Differences in carnauba waxes?

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Detail_Guy

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How much difference can there be between various manufactures pure carnauba waxes?

Some folks say that brand "X" doesn't last long, but brand "Z" lasts for months? I'm assuming they are talking about appearance and/or beading.

Is it possible to have that much more of a saturation point in one carnauba wax than another one... so that a higher content of carnauba can be put into the product?

Maybe the "real" grade of carnauba, or how it is refined?

Is it the addition of polymers or other ingredients?

To be honest, I have noticed "some" differences in longevity... but not to the extent that some others have? Of course, as long as I've been doing this, I'm still not a real good judge of durability/protection. However, I still have a good eye for appearance. :D
 
For me :) most carnauba waxes or sealants, the appearance only last for couple of days. I notice they will go back to my original preb shine and appearance. But the water beading does lasted longer than the looks. But I haven't care about the lasting effect of the water beading tho, as I wax the car every week.

As I too want to have the appearance of the just waxed looks. To me it's more important than the durability of the waxes or sealants. :)
 
there are different grades of nuba.... also some companies add other cheaper waxes (bees wax)

then some companies add other ingredients. Killerwheels would be the man to ask on this topic... I am sure he'll post as soon as he sees it.
 
while all waxes inheritently offer carnauba as a base, there are alot of different ingredients, solvents, and polymers that can make the waxes look and act quite differently. Also note most boutique waxes can contain vary different amounts of carnauba, and some contain additional paint cleaners. Higher carnauba doesnt always mean better looks, sometimes it just means its harder to remove. Almost all car care products use #1 Yellow or Ivory (refined) carnauba and never noticed much difference between the two, but manufacturers suggest the Ivory product is more optically perfect.

Your assessment however is pretty much spot on. Usually the biggest differences are noted in durability, wet appearance (gloss factor), and application/removal. Some waxes (especially the high dollar boutique products) are not all that different in final look and thus the end user needs to consider their price point.

Example, I have used many high dollar Zymol products costing 2-3-4-5 times what Souveran costs and wife, friends, and neighbors will ellicit they look no different at end. Sure maybe one beads better in rain, or lasts a little longer, but in some cases is seems the price point is what makes the purchaser believe he/she is seeing something the rest of us dont. Souveran paste was one of the first waxes that most everybody saw "the difference" and thus why I come back to it. I can tell you however I have used many boutique waxes that are similar in outcome, and thus price once again becomes the real deciding factor.
 
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killrwheels@autogeek said:
while all waxes inheritently offer carnauba as a base, there are alot of different ingredients, solvents, and polymers that can make the waxes look and act quite differently. Also note most boutique waxes can contain vary different amounts of carnauba, and some contain additional paint cleaners. Higher carnauba doesnt always mean better looks, sometimes it just means its harder to remove. Almost all car care products use #1 Yellow or Ivory (refined) carnauba and never noticed much difference between the two, but manufacturers suggest the Ivory product is more optically perfect.

Your assessment however is pretty much spot on. Usually the biggest differences are noted in durability, wet appearance (gloss factor), and application/removal. Some waxes (especially the high dollar boutique products) are not all that different in final look and thus the end user needs to consider their price point.

Example, I have used many high dollar Zymol products costing 2-3-4-5 times what Souveran costs and wife, friends, and neighbors will ellicit they look no different at end. Sure maybe one beads better in rain, or lasts a little longer, but in some cases is seems the price point is what makes the purchaser believe he/she is seeing something the rest of us dont. Souveran paste was one of the first waxes that most everybody saw "the difference" and thus why I come back to it. I can tell you however I have used many boutique waxes that are similar in outcome, and thus price once again becomes the real deciding factor.
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Certain people will notice things others dont. I could care less what my friends, neighbors, etc. say about different waxes because they dont know what to look for, nor are they as picky. Hell, the majority of people are thrilled with a good wash.
 
killrwheels@autogeek said:
while all waxes inheritently offer carnauba as a base, there are alot of different ingredients, solvents, and polymers that can make the waxes look and act quite differently. Also note most boutique waxes can contain vary different amounts of carnauba, and some contain additional paint cleaners. Higher carnauba doesnt always mean better looks, sometimes it just means its harder to remove. Almost all car care products use #1 Yellow or Ivory (refined) carnauba and never noticed much difference between the two, but manufacturers suggest the Ivory product is more optically perfect.

Your assessment however is pretty much spot on. Usually the biggest differences are noted in durability, wet appearance (gloss factor), and application/removal. Some waxes (especially the high dollar boutique products) are not all that different in final look and thus the end user needs to consider their price point.

Example, I have used many high dollar Zymol products costing 2-3-4-5 times what Souveran costs and wife, friends, and neighbors will ellicit they look no different at end. Sure maybe one beads better in rain, or lasts a little longer, but in some cases is seems the price point is what makes the purchaser believe he/she is seeing something the rest of us dont. Souveran paste was one of the first waxes that most everybody saw "the difference" and thus why I come back to it. I can tell you however I have used many boutique waxes that are similar in outcome, and thus price once again becomes the real deciding factor.
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Excellent info... and I agree!

I sometimes think that the hit on the wallet has as much to do with ones take on a product, as does the actual appearance/performance of the product. A recent re-vist to an old detailing favorite (Mothers Cali Gold Pure Carnauba) proved just that point to me. Looks great, easy to apply, and lasts long enough for me. So much so, that I just ordered a new tin from AG. :D
 
beware guys of marketing and hyped up products.
 
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By trying the products out for yourself. Dont take the manufacturers or other peoples word for it.
 
Honest opinion or merely advertising? Commercialism brings with it concerns of honesty and true representation. In other words, it’s difficult to know what is true when someone is motivated by income, i.e. directly targeted at product sales, more so than an unbiased opinion
 
Hey what's up fellas, my experience with Carnauba waxes/polish is to use them only as a final finishing cream. And from my perspective if it's oily you have a good grade, but listen to D&D and try the products out for yourself.
 
Dust2Glory said:
there are different grades of nuba.... also some companies add other cheaper waxes (bees wax)
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Bees wax is actually more expensive than Carnauba....


killrwheels@autogeek said:
Sure maybe one beads better in rain, or lasts a little longer, but in some cases is seems the price point is what makes the purchaser believe he/she is seeing something the rest of us dont.
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I believe that this is a very accurate statement. Just by shelling out a lot of money they'll "see" things that are 'hard to describe' which makes it a better wax. Sure there may be something there but I highly doubt its worth the extra money.
 
Bees wax is actually more expensive than Carnauba....

Is that why less expensive waxes contain beeswax that is readily available and the more (most) expensive waxes are formulated with Carnauba wax that can only be imported from Brazil...very interesting
 
I could very well be wrong (won't be the first time) but I thought I read on one of these detailing forums that carnauba was cheaper than beeswax. I know on E-bay they are selling carnauba flakes for very cheap (something like $1 per oz)
 
I don't think carnauba is all that expensive as raw material, but, because of it's natural hardness (the very thing that makes it ideal for protection) the costs involved in processing it into something add a lot to the overall cost of a car wax, this wouldn't be true of bees wax and other softer waxes.
 
I dont believe beeswax is more expensive either, but know for a fact some wax companies use it because it beads better and thus most users "see" their car as freshly waxed and holding up. Beeswax however has no real protection benefits.
 
If you have the money, try out the wax for yourself. The fun thing about detailing is trying out different products and seeing what you like.
 
I don't think adding bees wax makes the difference in durability that some claim? As a matter of fact, bees wax added to carnauba may make the total product less durable.

It still confuses me... most claim that Souveran and others, left untouched, are good for about a month. On the other hand, the Collinite waxes last for "months"? How much more carnauba can they possibly stuff in there to make that kind of a difference? They must be doing something different. :confused:
 
Detail_Guy said:
I don't think adding bees wax makes the difference in durability that some claim? As a matter of fact, bees wax added to carnauba may make the total product less durable.

It still confuses me... most claim that Souveran and others, left untouched, are good for about a month. On the other hand, the Collinite waxes last for "months"? How much more carnauba can they possibly stuff in there to make that kind of a difference? They must be doing something different. :confused:
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The difference is the addition of an amino functional polymer, which as you are aware polymers form a molecular bond to the paint, which gives it durability. Technically its a synthetic (Micro-crystalline) wax
 
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