Swirles that just won't go away!

TMQ

TMQ

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Just completed a paint correction on 71 Jaguar XKE today. I am not too happy with the results.

I threw everything I had and it was still there mocking me! Drove me nuts.

It was a dark maroon paint. I had to resort to the most aggressive compound (Rupes Blue coarse) and Rupes coarse microfiber pad. Got some taken out but still...

Even pulled out the wool pad with Rupes blue coarse compound---Made the paint soooo marred and dull and yet the swirls were still there!!!

Kind of gave up and went to next step, polished with Rupes Yellow and yellow pads. Helped some but still...

Was getting pissed---cranked it up to speed of five. Bingo, things were looking much better. But still, those dang swirls were still there, but not as bad as before.

Is there such a thing like Swirl RIDS???

Sorry---AGO won't allow me to post pictures---yet.

Tom
 
And I was thinking---Maybe I need to go back to Mike's class! Grin...

Tom
 
What kind of paint? Single stage, Respray basecoat/clearcoat? You said polishing helped? Possible you were seeing marring and may need further refining? There is so many possibilities here. Could it be that bad and abused where wool and a rotary and or wet sanding is required. And if u get into that, is there enough paint to work with?
 
TMQ said:
Just completed a paint correction on 71 Jaguar XKE today. I am not too happy with the results.

I threw everything I had and it was still there mocking me! Drove me nuts.

It was a dark maroon paint. I had to resort to the most aggressive compound (Rupes Blue coarse) and Rupes coarse microfiber pad. Got some taken out but still...

Even pulled out the wool pad with Rupes blue coarse compound---Made the paint soooo marred and dull and yet the swirls were still there!!!

Kind of gave up and went to next step, polished with Rupes Yellow and yellow pads. Helped some but still...

Was getting pissed---cranked it up to speed of five. Bingo, things were looking much better. But still, those dang swirls were still there, but not as bad as before.

Is there such a thing like Swirl RIDS???

Sorry---AGO won't allow me to post pictures---yet.

Tom
Click to expand...

Is it the original paint?? I had a situation like this a few months ago. I ended up machine sanding the whole car and there were still scratches. Couldn't catch a nail on them. After questioning on several forums I finally figured out it had Restorfx on it. I know what to look for now and if I ever see another car with that stuff on it I won't get near it.
 
Was painted 3 years ago. Kind of a shoddy work. Base coat/clear coat. It had soooo many RIDS everywhere. I could not take out one.

Had tons of solvent pops all over as well. Messy paint work.

Hummm Even if I machine sanded it...prolly will still have scratches and deep swirls...

Hit it soo hard I thought I'll burn through the clear. But had tons and tons of clear. And it has been compounded in the past too!

Understand---Was able to knock out all the "light" swirls just like we see in a 50/50 shot on AGO.

It's those deeper swirls with short scratches mixed in. They just won't go away!

Restorx??? What's that?

Tom
 
Perhaps they are sanding scratches from the painter not properly wet sanding, Tommy??
 
I've done about 80 cars this year and this one was one of the two worst job to date.

Humm..Is it time to go to force rotation?

Tom
 
Dr Oldz said:
Perhaps they are sanding scratches from the painter not properly wet sanding, Tommy??
Click to expand...

Not really---poor cleaning. Towels with rocks in them is likely the cause.

It's been compounded in the past. Panels are flat. Just those swirls. Gotta be the deepest swirls I've seen!

Tom
 
Are you measuring inbetween compounding attempts? How much are you taking off? Sounds like a few I've encountered that were very difficult to remove and had to be wetsanded to get it done correctly. All of those were also repaints. Most likely wetsanding that wasn't removed initially combined with very hard clear.
 
Hope AGO gets the photo attachment and the gallery fixed so I could show you what I meant!

Been a 2 or 3 weeks now!

Been wanting to show the Apollo GT, 53 Mg TD, Satin black Hummer and this XKE!

And I can't post anything! Links are inactive.

Tom
 
RZJZA80 said:
Are you measuring inbetween compounding attempts? How much are you taking off? Sounds like a few I've encountered that were very difficult to remove and had to be wetsanded to get it done correctly. All of those were also repaints. Most likely wetsanding that wasn't removed initially combined with very hard clear.
Click to expand...

Oh theres gloss and shine. No dullness from wet sanding.

But you are correct---clear was very hard!

Its those circular swirls. Was still there after a heavy compounding using Rupes blue and Rupes coarse pad with some random short bitty scratches pointing in different directions.

Tom
 
TMQ said:
Not really---poor cleaning. Towels with rocks in them is likely the cause.

It's been compounded in the past. Panels are flat. Just those swirls. Gotta be the deepest swirls I've seen!

Tom
Click to expand...

It then sounds like you need to be more aggressive. Proceed with caution tho.

There Is a point where you can only do so much. A few jobs I have done in the past need such aggressive compounding that I actually chose to machine wet sand. There is a point where wet sanding is safer than heavy compounding solely due to less heat being introduced into the paint via wet sanding.

Hope you get it figured out buddy!
 
TMQ said:
Was painted 3 years ago. Kind of a shoddy work. Base coat/clear coat. It had soooo many RIDS everywhere. I could not take out one.

Had tons of solvent pops all over as well. Messy paint work.

Hummm Even if I machine sanded it...prolly will still have scratches and deep swirls...

Hit it soo hard I thought I'll burn through the clear. But had tons and tons of clear. And it has been compounded in the past too!

Understand---Was able to knock out all the "light" swirls just like we see in a 50/50 shot on AGO.

It's those deeper swirls with short scratches mixed in. They just won't go away!

Restorx??? What's that?

Tom
Click to expand...

Besides a nightmare?? lol. Hard to explain, it's like putting another layer of clear coat on. It's applied with a rag ot towel. It ends up being about about 3 mils thick and twice as hard as the hardest clear coat you've ever worked on. Whoever put it on this particular car did a great job on the application, you couldn't see any signs of a repaint or anything on top of the paint. The only problem was they never did a paint correction, just put it right on top of a badly scratched and swirled paint job. I guess when the installer isn't very good you actually see ridges in the stuff from the towel they apply it with.
 
Dr Oldz said:
It then sounds like you need to be more aggressive. Proceed with caution tho.

There Is a point where you can only do so much. A few jobs I have done in the past need such aggressive compounding that I actually chose to machine wet sand. There is a point where wet sanding is safer than heavy compounding solely due to less heat being introduced into the paint via wet sanding.

Hope you get it figured out buddy!
Click to expand...

Thanks Dr Olds---I was thinking that! If I was hitting the paint that hard, I thought at that point maybe wet sanding would've been the way to go. Also told the owner that as well.

Tom
 
Are you using the new white, or old blue microfiber pads?

The Rupes stuff struggled hard on a Mercedes on Saturday. Of course, as in the past, the 1st gen PC, M100, and LC microfiber did the trick. D300 on Megs mf pads did well, but not as good as the M100 on either the LC or Megs pads. M100 also worked very well with the NEW blue coarse Rupes microfiber pads. I only have a couple of those though, so I just finished out the cutting with the PC/M100/LCmf pads.

Back to the Rupes, I even did the washer mod, and that didn't help. Rotation wasn't the issue anyways,

I tried a bunch of different amounts of reload product, tool speed and preasure...

The only thing I didn't try was the UHS, which were all at home in my other rig.

I did a black Dodge Avenger the day before, and Menzerna PF2500 cleaned it up like a dream....
 
DaveT435 said:
Besides a nightmare?? lol. Hard to explain, it's like putting another layer of clear coat on. It's applied with a rag ot towel. It ends up being about about 3 mils thick and twice as hard as the hardest clear coat you've ever worked on. Whoever put it on this particular car did a great job on the application, you couldn't see any signs of a repaint or anything on top of the paint. The only problem was they never did a paint correction, just put it right on top of a badly scratched and swirled paint job. I guess when the installer isn't very good you actually see ridges in the stuff from the towel they apply it with.
Click to expand...

I see what you mean. Thanks.

Owner said was a repaint by shop next door. You could see nibs here and there, few body work lines underneath and bunch of solvent pops everywhere. Just poor work in general.

Tom
 
I've had problems like this with a car last year,I ran my rotary at 1200 rpm with light pressure and a black foam finishing pad and 3m 06064 moving it in a pattern similar to the DA orbital,,I then moved on to the 3m ultra fine 06068 with a blue waffle pad.,,problem solved...you could also try the megs 205,the rotary and a black waffle pad.

The paint I did this on was only a few days old at the most though,,I can't guarantee you the same results with older ,harder paint.
 
dlc95 said:
Are you using the new white, or old blue microfiber pads?

The Rupes stuff struggled hard on a Mercedes on Saturday. Of course, as in the past, the 1st gen PC, M100, and LC microfiber did the trick. D300 on Megs mf pads did well, but not as good as the M100 on either the LC or Megs pads. M100 also worked very well with the NEW blue coarse Rupes microfiber pads. I only have a couple of those though, so I just finished out the cutting with the PC/M100/LCmf pads.

Back to the Rupes, I even did the washer mod, and that didn't help. Rotation wasn't the issue anyways,

I tried a bunch of different amounts of reload product, tool speed and preasure...

The only thing I didn't try was the UHS, which were all at home in my other rig.

I did a black Dodge Avenger the day before, and Menzerna PF2500 cleaned it up like a dream....
Click to expand...

Tried the Rupes Blue foam pads (new ones too). Messy, didn't play well. I did not have the blue microfiber pads.

Switched over to the new Rupes white coarse microfiber pads. Helped a lot. Noticed that pads stopped working after a panel or two.

I have the UHS but wasn't with me. Really wished I had it. But after hitting as hard as I did, doubt it won't make much difference.

Probably would've burn the paint if I had a "heavy" cut compound! Kind of glad I got out of this one today!!

Tom
 
Farmallluvr said:
I've had problems like this with a car last year,I ran my rotary at 1200 rpm with light pressure and a black foam finishing pad and 3m 06064 moving it in a pattern similar to the DA orbital,,I then moved on to the 3m ultra fine 06068 with a blue waffle pad.,,problem solved...you could also try the megs 205,the rotary and a black waffle pad.

The paint I did this on was only a few days old at the most though,,I can't guarantee you the same results with older ,harder paint.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the input. I did have the megs 205 but wasn't with me. Thought this XKE would have been a simple one step deal. Wrong! Wrong! And boy was I wrong on all counts!

Tom
 
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