What's my problem?

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skipper1

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I've been buffing cars every weekend for about 3 months. I started out with a G110v2 and 7" pads. The G110v2's cord shorted out and sent it in for a replacement. In the meantime, I still have cars to do and decided to get a PC 7424XP as a backup from AG. I went with the 5" backing plate and 5 1/2" Lake Country pads because I have read that I'll get better results.
Today, I had a new Kia that's about 3-4 months old. Freshly washed and all I did was put NXT 2.0 using a red 5 1/2" Lake Country pad. PC was set between 3 & 4. Why won't my pad spin? I've marked my backing plate so I could see if it would spin and it rarely would. I tried no pressure, some pressure and a lot of pressure. Best results were between some and lot. Pad flat on the surface. Am I doing something wrong here, does the PC have enough power, is the red pad the wrong one, however the website says to apply wax with the red one.
When I had the G110v2 using the black 7" pad, I had no problems with it spinning.

Next week I have a white Camero that's in terrible shape. I plan on using D151 to bring back the color and give it a wet shiny look. Am I going to have problems with the pad spinning using D151? I know the G110v2 using the 7" yellow pads work just fine.

I need help from the pros. Sorry for the long post and thanks in advance for your help.
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Does it spin if you apply no pressure to the pad? I am thinking that you may be applying too much pressure.
 
fairlady350z said:
Does it spin if you apply no pressure to the pad? I am thinking that you may be applying too much pressure.
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I thought I was applying too much pressure too, I had to actually lift up on the PC to get it to spin. Yes it did spin some, but not very much. That's why I'm here, thought someone else had this problem and knew the solution.
 
One problem could be that you are using a mildly abrasive product NXT 2.0 with a pad that is very soft and has no cut. The pad may be sticking to the paint because of this.

Have you tried a white ccs pad with NXT? this has yielded nice results for me whereas the blue ccs sticks a little bit unless I am using a pure wax or sealant.

IME the denser and stiffer pads are harder to bog down using an abrasive product than the softer pads. The softer pads glide nicely with products like souveran, UPP, and Fuzion. I don't know if there is a logical explanation to this.
 
Did you install the washer behind the backing plate? It comes in the bag with all the paperwork that no one reads. It makes the difference, also, don't be scared to bump up the speed.
 
I agree with above bump up the speed, assuming the washer was installed.
 
JonMiles said:
One problem could be that you are using a mildly abrasive product NXT 2.0 with a pad that is very soft and has no cut. The pad may be sticking to the paint because of this.

Have you tried a white ccs pad with NXT? this has yielded nice results for me whereas the blue ccs sticks a little bit unless I am using a pure wax or sealant.

IME the denser and stiffer pads are harder to bog down using an abrasive product than the softer pads. The softer pads glide nicely with products like souveran, UPP, and Fuzion. I don't know if there is a logical explanation to this.
Click to expand...

I could be wrong but I don't believe there is anything abrasive in NXT 2.0. I'm beginning to think the pad isn't soft enough. The red pads definitely are not as soft as Meguiar's 7" black pads.
 
snowking724 said:
Did you install the washer behind the backing plate? It comes in the bag with all the paperwork that no one reads. It makes the difference, also, don't be scared to bump up the speed.
Click to expand...

I had to double check, yep, the washer is there. Excuse me for the question but what does a washer have to do with the pad not spinning?

Well, I did bump it up to 4 and 4 1/2 and I did get more spin but went back down. I thought you needed higher speeds for compounds and paint restoration. I'll admit I'm learning something every time I do a car but this pad not spinning is making me crazy. I guess I need to remember I'm coming from a G110v2 to a PC, but they can't be that different.
 
skipper1 said:
I could be wrong but I don't believe there is anything abrasive in NXT 2.0. I'm beginning to think the pad isn't soft enough. The red pads definitely are not as soft as Meguiar's 7" black pads.
Click to expand...

MSDS says it has 5-15% calcined kaolin clay...this is a mildly abrasive cleaner. It is probably added because most consumers don't know how to properly prep the paint and a cleaner helps remove old wax, oxidation, minor swirls etc. This makes the wax give better results for the regular guy, where they can see a difference in the paint after application.

http://www.meguiars.com/msds/G127.PDF

check out the purpose of the product in the link. It says wax preparation. Kinda weird.
 
skipper1 said:
I had to double check, yep, the washer is there. Excuse me for the question but what does a washer have to do with the pad not spinning?

Well, I did bump it up to 4 and 4 1/2 and I did get more spin but went back down. I thought you needed higher speeds for compounds and paint restoration. I'll admit I'm learning something every time I do a car but this pad not spinning is making me crazy. I guess I need to remember I'm coming from a G110v2 to a PC, but they can't be that different.
Click to expand...

Is this the washer you have installed? It is the correct one. Also if the washer is not installed the backing plate could rub aginst the machine housing causing it to not spin as designed. The Red pad is PLENTY soft enough, and the PC should be spining like crazy a 4-4.5 as long as you have it flat aginst the paint with light pressure (remeber that some pressure is required or it will just jiggle).

IMG_02372.JPG
 
JonMiles said:
MSDS says it has 5-15% calcined kaolin clay...this is a mildly abrasive cleaner. It is probably added because most consumers don't know how to properly prep the paint and a cleaner helps remove old wax, oxidation, minor swirls etc. This makes the wax give better results for the regular guy, where they can see a difference in the paint after application.

http://www.meguiars.com/msds/G127.PDF

check out the purpose of the product in the link. It says wax preparation. Kinda weird.
Click to expand...

Jon, thanks for that info, but do you really think that would be enough to slow down a buffer to almost nothing when in the past there was no problems with a 7" pad?
 
I remember reading something by Mike P. that the PC needs a little pressure to spin the pad. Otherwise the pad will just vibrate which he said was good enough for a LSP.
 
DARK HORSE said:
Is this the washer you have installed? It is the correct one. Also if the washer is not installed the backing plate could rub aginst the machine housing causing it to not spin as designed. The Red pad is PLENTY soft enough, and the PC should be spining like crazy a 4-4.5 as long as you have it flat aginst the paint with light pressure (remeber that some pressure is required or it will just jiggle).

IMG_02372.JPG
Click to expand...

Hey Tad,

What does this washer do in regard to pad rotation? I put a new backing plate on my PC polisher and don't remember it having a washer with it.

So what is the washer made of and what is it supposed to do?
 
BobbyG said:
Hey Tad,

What does this washer do in regard to pad rotation? I put a new backing plate on my PC polisher and don't remember it having a washer with it.

So what is the washer made of and what is it supposed to do?
Click to expand...

Hey Bobby, I think it is more of a spacer than an actual washer. Not sure what the material is, maybe some kind of composite. Really dosen't matter what the material is, I'm sure a metal one is also fine. But the important part is that it is a little bit thicker than most regular washers. It acts as a spacer between the backing plate and the face of the machine. If there is not some kind of spacer between the two, it is possible for the bc plate to rub against the machine and either stop fully or impede the rotaion of the bc plate/pad...
 
DARK HORSE said:
Is this the washer you have installed? It is the correct one. Also if the washer is not installed the backing plate could rub aginst the machine housing causing it to not spin as designed. The Red pad is PLENTY soft enough, and the PC should be spining like crazy a 4-4.5 as long as you have it flat aginst the paint with light pressure (remeber that some pressure is required or it will just jiggle).



IMG_02372.JPG
Click to expand...


Nope, that's not the washer, mine is broader and thinner. It's the one that came with my Lake Country 5.5" flexible backing plate. I checked and the backing isn't rubbing against the housing. I think would have known today while buffing.

I will say this, those Lake Country pads really do stick to the backing plate. I could see how one could damage the pad trying to get it off.
 
Hey Tad, thanks for the quick reply!

I checked and even though I don't use the washer there's plenty of clearance so I should be all set.....:props:
 
This washer/spacer should have came with your pc. Check the box, it should have been in a small plastic bag, maybee with the wrech...
 
I had the same concern too until I switched to the 4in pads. They will spin at the lowest speed setting while applying an LSP.
 
Well, maybe I'm a candidate for the Flex 3401. I wonder if AG would let me trade in my PC 7424XP on a Flex? Just got it Thursday and used it today plus I have tons of brand new LC pads.
 
I found the article...
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...t-gen-porter-cable-dual-action-polishers.html

"When it comes to applying a wax or paint sealant, it's not important because at this stage of the game you're not trying to remove paint, (remove defects), you're just trying to spread-out a layer of wax or paint sealant and work it into the paint to whatever level is possible and jiggling or vibrating is perfect for this step."
 
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