Meguiar's #21 sealant hides swirls?

All waxes and sealants will cover up defects to some extent. M21 does a particularly nice job of masking some.

As far as longevity goes, it depends on so many factors that if's impossible for two to get the same results.

M21 does help with Micro Marring, real swirls, not really. Just the sealant look of it tends to amplify larger swirls, so its a net zero effect. Lots of better choices if that is what you are looking for. Anything with carnauba is going to do a better job.

davidc11291 said:

I randomly saw this sealant mentioned in a thread and started looking it up. The product description states that it will hide light swirls, meaning it's got fillers.

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-Since you stated:"meaning it's got fillers")...

Then I will understand that statement as:
You believe that there are fillers that hide things like light-swirls...
Am I correct in that understanding?

-If so...What are fillers anyway? Can you name some of them?

-To the best of your knowledge...
What "kind(s)/name(s)" of fillers, then, does M#21 contain?

^^^Just curious.^^^


Now...As far as:

davidc11291 said:

something I could use on low budget details to provide a little extra sparkle.

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IMHO...
-Only if that's what your customer-base will be willing to accept.
And...Only you know for sure, if that is true, or not.



Bob

Give D151 a look if you want a cheapo compound for wash & wax type jobs. In my experience clients that are looking for a less expensive service don't always have the best kept paint finishes... D151 actually provides a decent amount of correction and leaves wax protection behind as well. It slightly fills as well, as any wax does to a certain extent. However, if you work it right it will survive an IPA wipe down and the panel will still look great.

davidc11291 said:

This immediately piqued my curiosity as something I could use on low budget details to provide a little extra sparkle.

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I can't answer the questions concerning the M21, but low budget pricing led me to the OPS one step. Usually after completing the interior, I'll top it off with OOS or OCW for a low overhead, no cost to the customer, "extra sparkle".

The sweet thing about OCW and OOS is that the look improves as it cures...so the next day it actually looks better than when the customer gets their keys back.

So my suggestion would be to pick up the M21 if you're inclined...or to pick up a WOWA/WOWO lsp that's of your product line. rops:

davidc11291 said:

Well if you've ever polished a section to what seems to be a swirl free finish

^^^Sure Have^^^

then had an IPA wipedown reveal swirls that were filled and hidden by things in the polish, then I guess that would answer the question of whether or not fillers exist.

^^^Not necessarily so...IMO^^^

-What if the "swirls-being-hidden" were caused to be hidden, by abraded CC...not 'fillers'?
-Wouldn't an IPA wipe-down remove this abraded CC...
revealing an "unfinished polishing-session"...unless this is the
polishing-stage at which you decide to "quit polishing"?

No, I cannot name any of them, just like I have no idea what's in polishing oils, or what abrasives are in compounds and polishes. Most companies like to protect proprietary information.

-^^^Fillers are not proprietary^^^.

-Too bad, IMHO, that you feel you can exclaim and blame:
Fillers for hiding...when you don't have a clue what:
Real fillers are, or their purposes in car-care products.

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Another $0.02 of mine regarding: "Fillers".

Bob

Subscribed.

smack said:

Subscribed.

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Im the MANROFL ! Im the MAN

smack said:

Subscribed.

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Vegas Transplant said:

Im the MANROFL ! Im the MAN

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LOL. No kidding. How quickly things can take a turn for worse. We all like to see a train wreck.


SO, to keep things in order.

I was told by my supplier that #21 does indeed have some "fillers". He's a painter and long time detailer who has a pretty good relationship with his Meguiar's rep, so I believe him. Does it matter if it has fillers? Not really to me. I use Meg's #20 and #21 for ALL my details. It's a low cost, quality sealant that looks as good as anything else I've used. And I like sticking with a 100 year old company who has had much success.

As for longevity, I tell the customer 4-6 months ... and make their next appointment when possible.

Nicholas@Autowerx said:

Give D151 a look if you want a cheapo compound for wash & wax type jobs. In my experience clients that are looking for a less expensive service don't always have the best kept paint finishes... D151 actually provides a decent amount of correction and leaves wax protection behind as well. It slightly fills as well, as any wax does to a certain extent. However, if you work it right it will survive an IPA wipe down and the panel will still look great.

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+1 Love D151. Great AIO, then top with DG 105 or Colly 845/476s and your good.

Rambling thoughts on fillers...

By the very nature of polishing, any oils used as lubricants in the polish will fill or hide light swirls. This is true of any abrasive polish from any manufacturer. The same is true for a wax or sealant. They will hide light swirls

Why is this considered bad? Sure there are some (many?) here that will want to remove more paint to get to a perfect flawless finish but that perfect finish lasts for a fleetingly short time if you actually use the vehicle. Then you need to go back and grind off more paint over and over again.

I consider a product that hides light marring as a good thing. You don't need to remove as much paint, which is darn thin to begin with, and the look is 90-95% as good when you finish. On a driven vehicle, both only last for a short time before you will need to repeat the process, but in the latter case you will be leaving much more of the precious paint on the car.

In as much as the very top surface of the clear coat is more dense, harder and shinier, it seems preferable, to not remove excess paint in your details. IMO, slight filling is a plus for a vehicle you intend to keep for several years.

Too many variables to delve into the many products specifically. I like and have used several jugs of M21. It's a pretty good sealant but I prefer their Ultimate Liquid Wax (sealant) though. I too prefer dealing with a company that has been passionate about their products for over 110 years.

VR8 said:

LOL. No kidding. How quickly things can take a turn for worse. We all like to see a train wreck.


SO, to keep things in order.

I was told by my supplier that #21 does indeed have some "fillers". He's a painter and long time detailer who has a pretty good relationship with his Meguiar's rep, so I believe him.
And I like sticking with a 100 year old company who has had much success.

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-I was thinking just the opposite of: things taking a turn for the worse:
(Even though you say otherwise)...Not a train wreck...IMO.

I appreciate anyone taking over as conductor...
being charged with righting this thread (train) of the OP's...

...the train that someone,:dunno:, whose only interest/concern was
(according to the lastest information available to me):

-To ensure that the train was going to stop at the Depot where it was rumored that there
were some: 'passengers'...waiting to board, that had some ful-filling information for OP: David...
while the train, itself, was being tended---in order that:

-The train would not be going unabatedly-headlong into what may be construed/misconstrued
as yet another detailing mythical-railhead.


I agree that a company that's been in business for 100+ years...has had much success;
and, that 'they' and their 'trained reps.' are, for the most part: Believable.


I like/use Meg's car-care products.
Also, perhaps I should include: "They 'fill' my heart with joy"!



Bob

:awman:...............:grouphug:.......:nomore:......:bash:.........:laughing::laughing::laughing:



[SIZE=+4]WHAT?!?!? No...[/SIZE]

For me a big deal breaker is how long a company has been around. I dont jump on a bandwagon because it is a new product or anything of that matter. I need/want a manufacturer who has stood the test of time and Meguiar's has done that above almost all else.

Now if brand X, Y, or whatever you fancy has "fillers" or whatever what difference does it make??? It is helping you in the end to smooth the surface. I am in no way saying that I would want to use a glaze or something chock full of "Fillers" but a wax, seleant or whatever that has them is only benefiting the user when applying that last touch.

have enjoyed this thread folks
BUT.....
I think Johnny Ringo said "Eventus stultorum magister".
It's one of many great lines in a great film.
Good one.

[size=+4]You're right:[/size] [video=youtube_share;1F3wYMkpovo"]Tombstone - Doc Holliday meets Johnny Ringo - YouTube[/video]

:dblthumb2: Thanks for the correction hand! :dblthumb2:

Been meaning to change my sig to a Groucho quote...now's a good time.