(Another) Question About Water Spots

Matt92 said:

Hey Guys,

Rread Mike's post and it looks like my next step is to use a paint cleaner by hand (since I don't have a DA yet) I think? (any other suggestions welcomed)

My question is this: Is there any good way to prevent water spots? I would have thought a good sealant topped with the spray wax would have worked, but obviously not.

Second question: If I don't have time in the next week or so to do a full paint clean like Mike shows in his post, will the water spots eat through the clear coat or become worse/harder to get out? Is there any downside to not getting rid of the water spots right away?

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First question: What color is the car??? This makes a difference.

Water spots are created by the hardness of the water... essentially mineral deposits (Calcium & Magnesium). No, they won't etch through the clear-coat like bird droppings, but they are stubborn buggers to get out. And the longer you let them bake in the hot sun makes them even harder.

You could start with paint cleansing lotion (if you have it). I actually just started using PCL on various jobs in small spots or sections, by hand, although if I were to do an entire car, I would use a wax/sealant pad and a DA.

Honestly, although it has saved me a few times, I wouldn't use it in this case. My case was a freshly detailed car (3 step paint correction & sealant) got HD Speed spatter from another car getting detailed, then dried in the hot sun. I used the cleansing lotion to get the spatter off when a QD or D114 wouldn't.

The best route to take is paint correction. In your case if the paint is already in excellent condition, you may consider getting HD Speed which is an All In One (compound, polish & sealant). It's cut level (hard to believe) is a #2 but amazingly it's a miracle solution. The best way to apply is to get yourself a DA (Porta Cable 7424 xp is a GREAT machine for the price).

As far as preventing water spots, my suggestion would be a good caranuba wax... Perhaps Collinite 476 double wax, or Collinite 916 (Mark D'Elegance). Others may suggest a coating such as Opti-Coat or CQuartz, but you need to do a full paint correction (3 step - compound, polish and eraser) before applying the coating.

I say Collinite because (I believe) it was the first Caranuba / Polymer mix dating back to the 1930's for marine use. I have used it on all three of my cars and it is VERY hydrophobic. 476 is a double wax used in marine applications. It actually deepens the color of the car and adds a 5 mile wet shine, while repelling water.

If your just starting out, the latter option (3 step paint correction) is a big learning curve and time consuming... I would just do the HD Speed, step back and marvel, then do the Collinite and make it pop.

Hope this helps! And tell your GF you're not crazy... You're increasing the value $$$ of her ride.:buffing:

use a wheel cleaner on your paint..... rain etches because its acid
use an acid based wheel cleaner like megs wheel brightener

Do not under any circumstances use an acid based wheel cleaner on your paint.

If you have stubborn water spots use a dedicated product designed for removing water spots. Your paint will thank you.

CarPro Spotless Water Spot Remover

Acid based wheel cleaner is perfectly fine on your paint if you properly rinse the cleaner off the paint. I've done it multiple times myself and at the detail shop I work at.

We have found that XMT AIO works well on many spots. I haven't had much luck with any of the sprays designed for it. XMT 360, Rupes 21 and the yellow pad. The only way I have seen to prevent them is to wipe them off ASAP.

custmsprty said:

Do not under any circumstances use an acid based wheel cleaner on your paint.

If you have stubborn water spots use a dedicated product designed for removing water spots. Your paint will thank you.

CarPro Spotless Water Spot Remover

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You realize that Spotless is an acid based product also, right? It amazes me that everyone here on AG is so afraid to use products that have been industry standard for years, just because you don't understand a product doesn't mean it wont work.

Matt92, where do you live? Usually water spots are caused by hard water (mineral deposits) and rainwater almost by definition shouldn't have any minerals in it. Rainwater can be acid (which will vary by location which is why I asked).

Frequently if you have a freshly waxed car, and it gets a little dusty, then you have a light rain, the water will bead up and carry the dust into little drops that then dry causing unsightly "water spots", but they are just dirt and should wash off.

Are you sure that the water spots aren't from hard water from your washing, your (or a neighbor's, or work) sprinklers, the dealer, the detailer?

FinishingTouchA said:

You realize that Spotless is an acid based product also, right? It amazes me that everyone here on AG is so afraid to use products that have been industry standard for years, just because you don't understand a product doesn't mean it wont work.

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There are many acid-based products for water spot removal, not just Spotless but Optimum's MDR and a DG product, and of course the traditional decon systems from Valugard and the Finish Kare one sold here.

However I wouldn't myself use Meg's Wheel Brightener as my acid water spot remover of choice--the acid in WB is more for dissolving metal and I think it's less appropriate or perhaps inappropriate in this situation.

My opinion is that there is little that you can do to prevent water spots when your car is hit. Unless you keep your car in the garage 24 hours per day or are extremely meticulous in washing/cleaning your car after it rains or is hit by a sprinkler, preventing water spots is hard for the every day man using his daily driver. I do believe, however, that you can minimize the damage caused by hard water -- having a good sealant or coating on the car and prompt treatment of water spots can minimize the damage to the clearcoat.

If you don't want to use megs wb on paint, it works wonders on glass...

Rain water typically won't leave water spots because rain water is in effect distilled water, which should be much more soft than hose water or any kind of water.

So I dont have an explanation as to why you are having hard water, unless perhaps its acid rain, or water that bounced off signs\light posts etc that have picked up dirt\ions etc.... which is unlikely btw.

My car just came thru a mad storm (very rare here), but no water spots at all. This is in socal where our tap water is 450-600 ppm which is extremely hard.

I cant speak for wax, but I know from experience that Opticoat is more susceptible to hard water spots than bare paint. I noticed that i get way more spots after my car was coated, which is counter intuitive. Still, I think the coating's water shedding and dirt shedding abilitys more than make up for that fault. Just buy a water dionizing filter + a pressure washer and do spot free rinses on your coated car and you should be good.

Plus having your car coated means you dont have to worry about minor defects like water spots because you know they only reside on the coating layer and thus can be polished off later on without wearing down the clear coat.

Matt92 said:

Thanks Paul! So I'm guessing the M21 sealant that I have or the Meg's Ultimate Paste wax aren't good enough products? The car actually never had these products on them.... A driver in front of me ran over a paint can and got white paint all over my car (modern steel metallic... Gunmetal color). I took it to a detailer who removed almost all of the white paint and supposedly did a 3 step paint correction. I doubt he did though because I can still see small swirls in the right light. Would that combination of M21 and the ultimate paste wax work after correcting the paint?

In short, there's probably no way of preventing this in the future, other than parking in a garage or driving it after it rains to get most of the rain off, right?

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Both are good products. Just so you know they are both sealants.

Did you park under a tree or something that may have caused the spots? Are you sure they were not already on the paint to begin with?

Rain usually doesn't. It just rained off and on over the weekend and I have not washed the car since then and there was no water spots.

asianisafish said:

If you don't want to use megs wb on paint, it works wonders on glass...

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Yeah, if you want to see rainbows.

FinishingTouchA said:

You realize that Spotless is an acid based product also, right? It amazes me that everyone here on AG is so afraid to use products that have been industry standard for years, just because you don't understand a product doesn't mean it wont work.

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So is muratic acid, acid based, but I wouldn't use it on my paint.

I think FG400 is way too harsh for the soft Honda paint. I did a black Honda recently, and I was able to fix it only with M4000 (thanks to Tato for that, he said it is possible, I was thinking about M2500), Flex 3401 and white hybrid. The least abrasive always first, right?
I would consider GG6 over Porter Cable.
It is a common conception here the combo Menz 400 and 4000. I would add the M2500 and make a trio, the more I use it, the more I appreciate it. The 4500 is more a jewelling compound, outstanding finish but very little cut.
Regarding micromarring from M105/M205, I believe is unproper technique/choice of pads/wrong speed, pressure and choice of polisher than blame of the compounds.
If you want to know how to properly use it, read Kevin Brown. It is very inaccurate, to say the least, to blame that M105/M205 cause micromarring. Bestregards