Opticoat 2.0 discontinued, OptiCoat Pro sees price increase

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It never fails to make me laugh when people discuss the fact that 10cc of OC product = more product and coverage than a 50ml bottle of UK. My undergrad was in biochemistry and back then (1992) 1cc=1ml. Did something change since that time?

oh, did someone say that here? i missed it if so.

i know that i mentioned a comparison between 2.0 and CQ and someone chimed in with a response about 50 ml of CQUK :shrugs:

anyway, from what i've seen...and from AG even says in their own copy, 30 ml of CQ is enough for 1 car. but let's say you can probably do two just because people apparently preach that.

in my experiences...and i have a lot of them with 2.0...10cc will do two cars, especially if you aren't doing glass and inner barrels. but normally, for most people at least, it's doing 1 car.

so, more or less, the end game is identical for both products - maybe two cars, but definitely one top to bottom.

CQ costs 50-60 dollars

GC will be 50-60 dollars (and with a durability claim of up to 2 years...which matches the warranty claim for CQ's pro product.)

but anyway, to answer your question...no, nothing changed and still, 1 cc or ml of one product doesn't mean 1 cc or ml of another, lol.

1 cc of Pro doesn't even cross to 1 cc of 2.0...believe it or not. there are WAY too many variables to even begin to explain why, but that's the way it is.
 
Perhaps Optimum wants OC to be the new dealership offering. We just started offering Ceramic Pro 9H at the dealer I work at and I'll just say OC is the deal of the century compared to what we charge.
 
"1 cc of Pro doesn't even cross to 1 cc of 2.0..."


Very Interesting


Does this mean that OC 2.0 actually lays down a "thicker" layer of product than OCPro?


That is really interesting, if the OCPro is able to offer more protection with less thickness
 
full time pros can use Pro...because they can charge accordingly for the product. and doing $300 a month shouldn't be a problem at all. so those two things alone will separate the full timers from the part timers. and also, a fringe benefit is it will separate the guys who do it right as opposed to the pros who use the OPT auth status as a means to sell cheaper (inferior) products on a consistent basis. it's not hard to tell - a pro posts 15 cars a month on his facebook page and 14 have CQF installed? yeah, not a good deal for OPT to have them on their auth installer list.

What about full timers that don't sell a lot of high end coatings because of their locations? Shut out.

What about those that do not want to invest a minimum of 3600 per year to install a very small line of products? Shut out.

As for selling Gloss Coat, I'm sure it is a fine product but there are a LOT of really good products that last 2 years. Why should I pay more for Optimum version of a 2 year coating?

I'm not sure who all these guys are who are scamming the authorized installer system. OC Pro installs (had) plenty of profit margin. Now if you are selling the coating for $495, the profit is about $350. Still a good day! However, now that the price has been increased the market just grew a little smaller, especially when accounting cost of prep and correction before application.

I live in a small rural market. Sometimes I will do 5+ coatings in a month, sometimes I will go 2-3 months without an installation. I'm VERY sure that there are no other shops fighting for my territory, but none the less it will inevitably be empty.

As I said before, I'm a big Optimum fan and use their products on a daily basis. I will continue to use them. I do feel however that smaller operations in smaller markets are getting a strong "go big or get out" message. If that is true, I understand. It is their business, their products, and their choice. But it still does not mean that it's not frustrating for me to lose a good stream of income.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using AG Online
 
What about full timers that don't sell a lot of high end coatings because of their locations? Shut out.

What about those that do not want to invest a minimum of 3600 per year to install a very small line of products? Shut out.

As for selling Gloss Coat, I'm sure it is a fine product but there are a LOT of really good products that last 2 years. Why should I pay more for Optimum version of a 2 year coating?

I'm not sure who all these guys are who are scamming the authorized installer system. OC Pro installs (had) plenty of profit margin. Now if you are selling the coating for $495, the profit is about $350. Still a good day! However, now that the price has been increased the market just grew a little smaller, especially when accounting cost of prep and correction before application.

I live in a small rural market. Sometimes I will do 5+ coatings in a month, sometimes I will go 2-3 months without an installation. I'm VERY sure that there are no other shops fighting for my territory, but none the less it will inevitably be empty.

As I said before, I'm a big Optimum fan and use their products on a daily basis. I will continue to use them. I do feel however that smaller operations in smaller markets are getting a strong "go big or get out" message. If that is true, I understand. It is their business, their products, and their choice. But it still does not mean that it's not frustrating for me to lose a good stream of income.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using AG Online

i understand that point.

but, it's common in business, especially in businesses selling tangible goods.

there has to be a concrete distribution plan in place. and, with something service-based like detailing, without having someone visiting the shop to see what's going on, you have to figure out what data to use to make a cut-off to delineate who can be direct and who can't be.

commonly, a quota is what companies use. basically, if you can't buy enough to stay direct, then you aren't part of that particular level of distribution and must deal with the next level, which is through a distributor.

the problem with quotas alone is that they don't discern between quality and quantity. so what you do is take a look at how the business presents itself, what is their reputation, do they conduct business in a manner that is in line with your own operation and standards?

so, between those two things, you should be able to separate things pretty cleanly. will some people be upset? of course! everyone wants to be direct. everyone wants to be "in".

it's just not practical though for the manufacturer to consider every last person - you have to pic a spot and run with it as the dividing line.

as far as your question about competing product...if you truly believe a competing product is better, then you have to go with that. i was thrilled with 2.0 and given the claims made about Gloss-Coat and the initial feedback from beta testing...it's even better than 2.0 on many fronts. and, i believe OPT is thinking the same thing. their Gloss-Coat will be superior to anything else readily available outside of professional ranks.

i just don't think it's that big of a deal. i think there is more opportunity than there ever was to make money detailing. if not being an auth installer is that big of a deal for anyone but they weren't even doing that much business with OPT in the first place, i don't know what to say about that :)

"1 cc of Pro doesn't even cross to 1 cc of 2.0..."


Very Interesting


Does this mean that OC 2.0 actually lays down a "thicker" layer of product than OCPro?


That is really interesting, if the OCPro is able to offer more protection with less thickness

more thickness...approximately double according to OPT's film thickness claims. you end up using more Pro per area than you do 2.0.

while they both come in syringes and are kind of similar in application, they are really pretty different from each other in composition and performance (how they apply and end up).

i'm not an expert, but this is what i've seen with my own eyes.
 
I do feel however that smaller operations in smaller markets are getting a strong "go big or get out" message.

Ouch. There's a message that small business has been getting for a long time. Thanks for that perspective. Makes me think about all the small pharmacies that are gone now that there is a CVS and Walgreens on every other corner, and the small coffee shops now that the same thing has happened with Starbucks and Dunkin.
 
I wonder if some of the calculus on this is that we enthusiasts like the tactile feel of a slick surface, and because we are always doing something to our car, that trade-off (to get a glossier, slicker coating) is a fair one against a shorter life.

While I expect many OCP customers, particularly if there is going to be a dealer push, never wash their car themselves or do anything else to it, the coating is simply insurance like an extended warranty on an appliance, etc.
 
more thickness...approximately double according to OPT's film thickness claims. you end up using more Pro per area than you do 2.0.

while they both come in syringes and are kind of similar in application, they are really pretty different from each other in composition and performance (how they apply and end up).

i'm not an expert, but this is what i've seen with my own eyes.

How are people getting a full-sized vehicle out of 10ml's of Pro and two vehicles out of 10ml of OC2.0?

I used 10ml sample of CQuartz UK on the roof and one panel of my Yukon. UK is supposed to have the highest concentration of Silica out there. It must have more contents that flash off
 
full time pros can use Pro...because they can charge accordingly for the product. and doing $300 a month shouldn't be a problem at all. so those two things alone will separate the full timers from the part timers. and also, a fringe benefit is it will separate the guys who do it right as opposed to the pros who use the OPT auth status as a means to sell cheaper (inferior) products on a consistent basis. it's not hard to tell - a pro posts 15 cars a month on his facebook page and 14 have CQF installed? yeah, not a good deal for OPT to have them on their auth installer list.

if you aren't a full time pro...you can install Gloss-Coat and make a lot of money off of it using a great product. no warranty to sell, no quotas...just install and sell a product that has a durability claim that matches the warranty of the competitor's pro product.

if the customer wants a better product than Gloss-Coat, they will have to go see an auth installer for the more expensive Opti-Coat Pro. makes sense.

as far as the price increase...it's all relative. so, relative to the original price? yes, that's wild...600% is a lot. but i think he was SEVERELY underpriced to begin with. like..by a large margin. here's why: 40 cc of coating for $100? that's crazy. generally speaking, that's four cars worth of product. so, $25 worth of product can be installed and then resold for 15 or 20 or 25 times the cost? that means that the detailer is making MASSIVE margin and OPT is making peanuts. i am sure they weighed it out and said this isn't sustainable. so, they increased the price so now the shift is more in line...more reasonable margins shared between the supplier and the reseller/installer. they can sell less to those who really want it and can sell it for what it actually is...and make reasonable margin.

from my vantage point, this is what i think OPT's thought process was like:

- the reseller is making exponentially more money than we are. that needs to be adjusted - we made a mistake and are selling it for WAY too little money given the technology
- we are underpriced vs. the competition given our warranty and durability
- our dealer network is not living up to its name and not buying what we are advertising them as having...and in fact, many are selling competing products way more often because they are cheaper because they don't have the same durability.

all of that makes sense to me but what do i know!!!

I'm sorry, but Optimum used that excuse in 2012 when they raised the price 45%. You can sit back, bend over, and take the 3rd increase up the you know what, yet again, and tell your self its all hugs and rainbows, or you can say NO MORE and move on. There are plenty of other Pro coatings available now that excel in many ways over OCP and the option list is only going to get larger. I'm not going to sit back and take this yet again when they are companies like CarPro who actually listen to their installers and care what we think.


And 40cc only did 3 vehicles for me with paint, trim, and wheels.
 
I think in sales & marketing perception is sometimes close to reality. Since this change of OC to OGC doesn't seem to be to welcomed (just see above) - it doesn't look like it may have been the best move for Optimum.

A lot of people are saying they'll just use this or that - but nobody seems to be excited to try OGC. It does seem odd to DC a pretty successful product & replace it with something with less durability.

Maybe it's very expensive to manufacture OC and it's not profitable. Dunno. It also seems some Pro installers are not happy about changes there as well.
 
How are people getting a full-sized vehicle out of 10ml's of Pro and two vehicles out of 10ml of OC2.0?

I used 10ml sample of CQuartz UK on the roof and one panel of my Yukon. UK is supposed to have the highest concentration of Silica out there. It must have more contents that flash off

Dr. G. doesn't use Silica in paint coatings.
 
I think in sales & marketing perception is sometimes close to reality. Since this change of OC to OGC doesn't seem to be to welcomed (just see above) - it doesn't look like it may have been the best move for Optimum.

A lot of people are saying they'll just use this or that - but nobody seems to be excited to try OGC. It does seem odd to DC a pretty successful product & replace it with something with less durability.

Maybe it's very expensive to manufacture OC and it's not profitable. Dunno. It also seems some Pro installers are not happy about changes there as well.

I mentioned the profitability angle earlier, Dr. G makes everything here in the US, some of the other coatings are imported, maybe that makes a difference in the cost to mfr.

As far as not being excited to try Gloss-Coat--I actually am, I am just still processing the loss of OC 2.0. I really am feeling the need to go to a Detailer's Anonymous meeting lately, though.
 
I used 10ml sample of CQuartz UK on the roof and one panel of my Yukon. UK is supposed to have the highest concentration of Silica out there. It must have more contents that flash off

If we're allowed to discuss other products and brands, the new TAC Systems coating Sparkle (dumb name even though I love the product) has the highest silica content - 75%

By the CarPro coating and other chemical supplier
 
If we're allowed to discuss other products and brands, the new TAC Systems coating "Sparkle" (dumb name even though I love the product) has the highest silica content - 75%

Um, we're allowed to discuss other products and brands that AG sells, and usually we allowed to discuss to some degree products that they don't, but not to post links--ur going to get in trouble for that.
 
nobody seems to be excited to try OGC.

As far as not being excited to try Gloss-Coat--I actually am, I am just still processing the loss of OC 2.0. I really am feeling the need to go to a Detailer's Anonymous meeting lately, though.

Ok, I got over my OC 2.0 loss by hoarding some, and now I pulled the trigger on Gloss-Coat, since you threw down the gauntlet. I'm going to let my friend Jr. do the review so we can test the easier-to-apply theory.

Now, when/where is the next DA (Detailer's Anonymous) meeting? I have been out of control lately.
 
Um, we're allowed to discuss other products and brands that AG sells, and usually we allowed to discuss to some degree products that they don't, but not to post links--ur going to get in trouble for that.

I thought that since TAC Systems wasn't sold in the US, the link wouldn't hurt but I'll take it off, anyway.

edit: I can't :( - not allowed to edit my previous post for some reason.
Can a mod make the change for me?
 
I thought that since TAC Systems wasn't sold in the US, the link wouldn't hurt but I'll taken it off, anyway.

edit: I can't :(

Oh, if it's not sold in the US I wouldn't worry about it too much, sorry I didn't see you were down under.
 
If we're allowed to discuss other products and brands, the new TAC Systems coating..."Sparkle" (dumb name even though I love the product) has the highest silica content - 75%
Why is it so hard for the people, that write-up product descriptions, to use correct spelling, etc.?

What are they talking about here.
Is it something that's: gleaming, glossy, and/or lustrous; an outdoor hockey pick-up game; or climbing up a tree?


"QUARTZ SPARKLE contains 75%
pure quartz based in nano-technology,
The cured QUARTZ SPARKLE is as tough and rigid.
Inorgnaic coat will help you to maintain your car clean,
shinny, and scratch resistant".


And they want people to gush; and, then rush right over and buy their products?

Good Grief!!

Bob
 
I have on my sister's car PBL, OC 2.0, 22PLE, CQUK, and I will be adding GC to it just for testing purposes at this time. I will have it on Wed. or Thurs.
 
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