zmcgovern45
New member
- Sep 5, 2012
- 3,443
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4500 isn't something I use, so no need to test it.
I've got 22ple HPC on top of essence on my hood. I have VX3 and PRO2 on other areas of the car, but not with essence beneath them.
CarPro Essence with non-CarPro coating
- Thread starter SYMAWD
- Start date
4500 isn't something I use, so no need to test it.
I've got 22ple HPC on top of essence on my hood. I have VX3 and PRO2 on other areas of the car, but not with essence beneath them.
spinz
New member
- Feb 18, 2013
- 93
- 0
Hi Zach, do you mean an oil-based polish is not suitable prior to coating even if the polish residue was wiped off with IPA?
I'm starting to worry because most of the time i used SF4500/SF4000 as the final polish before applying any paint coatings.
If this is going to interfere with the coating then i'm in big trouble...
Chris Thomas
Optimum Guru
- Dec 21, 2007
- 1,824
- 0
So far from my experience it looks like essence is a good prep for 2 year coatings, but is not a viable option for coatings that need actually form a strong chemical bond to the paint.
AGOatemywallet
New member
- Jun 13, 2015
- 920
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Tell us more about your 2 year testing on this product that launched at SEMA 2015
Optimum Coatings
- "Permanent"
- 1 to 2 microns of added thickness
- A few drops per panel
No
Nope
Not Quite
Rsurfer
Well-known member
- Jan 26, 2007
- 14,159
- 26
No where did I read that Chris did a 2 year test. Someone asked for his opinion and he gave it.
I don't think he's talking about interfering even after an IPA wipe down. My reading was that he was talking about applying a coating right after polishing with an oily product.
Some people do two wipedowns just to make sure.
AGOatemywallet
New member
- Jun 13, 2015
- 920
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You believe that CarPro gave a sample of Essence to Optimum two years ago for them to test with Optimum Coatings?
Rsurfer
Well-known member
- Jan 26, 2007
- 14,159
- 26
Get real man..where did you read that Chris said he tried Essence 2 years ago? Go back and read his post again!!
Just because you don't agree with what Optimum might say about their products, don't say words that was not spoken.
AGOatemywallet
New member
- Jun 13, 2015
- 920
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This is what Chris said in his previous post
What am I missing?
The statement indicates that an assessment was made, that the product does not work with OPT Pro coatings.
What factors make it "not a viable option for coatings that actually form a strong chemical bond to the paint"?
Is the statement indicating that 2 year products like CQuartz and Gloss Coat; don't actually for a strong chemical bond to the paint?
How was this determination made? I would think it would require long-term testing.
builthatch
New member
- May 25, 2008
- 2,352
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it's apparent Dr. G made his pro coatings specifically to bond to bare clear coat for them to work as prescribed. he knows clear coat intimately as he has been instrumental in working with modern clear coat production prior to his foray with OPT.
Dr. G knows the chemistry of his coatings, and knows the chemistry of clear coat.
thus, the tail end of Chris's statement.
if you have a beef with OPT, that's fine, but Chris has been gracious for years on the forums. you're picking on the wrong guy if you have a problem with OPT.
Dr. G is readily available if you need to dispute OPT product claims. he makes the stuff, so it's best to consult him for any chemistry questions/doubts imo.
AGOatemywallet
New member
- Jun 13, 2015
- 920
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Optimum's Coatings can be applied in multiple layers right?
So they obviously "bond" to surfaces other than bare clear coat
I am interested to hear how the Folks at Optimum determined that Essence would not work with their coatings that last for more than two years and if by omission, Essence is compatible with Gloss Coat
I understand from a sales perspective, that you want consumers utilizing your full line, but they may have shot themselves in the foot, by claiming that what may be a breakthrough product, does not work with their coatings.
So they obviously "bond" to surfaces other than bare clear coat
I am interested to hear how the Folks at Optimum determined that Essence would not work with their coatings that last for more than two years and if by omission, Essence is compatible with Gloss Coat
I understand from a sales perspective, that you want consumers utilizing your full line, but they may have shot themselves in the foot, by claiming that what may be a breakthrough product, does not work with their coatings.
builthatch
New member
- May 25, 2008
- 2,352
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i want to clarify something. of course, we still can't edit threads on this forum past a few minute window. don't get it. never will.
anyway, i said clear coat. really, i should have said clear coat, among other hard automotive surfaces, because it will bond to glass, hard plastic, chrome, polished aluminum, etc. as long as the surface is bare and free of oil, contaminants, etc., Opti-Coat will bond to such surfaces and after that, the only way to get it off is abrasion or very aggressive chemicals that otherwise shouldn't be near a car. it has a different chemistry than CQ/CQF, which we all know.
it is possible that Opti-Coat, which is a pro only item and very expensive if you include the MAP policy, will not work as per the NON-OPTIONAL warranty, which is a min of five or seven years, depending on the product, if applied to a surface with chemicals that are in Essence or anything else that is not a certain type of hard surface. Dr. G knows chemistry, i don't. it is plausible that he can look at Essence, understand what makes it up and know that it will make the bond of his otherwise permanent coating weaker than it should be. permanent in this regard is like saying clear coat is permanent. it's not a forcefield, but it has a particular type of bond and life expectancy under normal conditions. there are tons of annoying online discussions on that, no need for me to get into it here.
since CQ works on top of Essence, the chemistry of CQ/CQF might be that where Dr. G or his minions can be comfortable admitting that Essence may be compatible with Gloss-Coat and not necessarily cause any issues that would be outside of the normal life expectancy of that coating.
i hope this makes sense. i just don't understand the confusion so i'm trying to explain WHY i don't understand the confusion. but, ultimately, as i mentioned, Dr. G is certainly an easy to reach guy.
Setec Astronomy
Well-known member
- Aug 31, 2010
- 17,034
- 1,320
Man, you guys are worse than people running for president that just want something to argue about. It's clear that Mr. Thomas was referring to "2 year coatings" as a product category, as in CQuartz and Gloss-Coat vs. Finest and Opti-Coat Pro.
Why don't you guys keep your shorts on.
Why don't you guys keep your shorts on.
builthatch
New member
- May 25, 2008
- 2,352
- 0
i didn't take it that way, esp. since Carpro is saying it's fine with all their CQ coatings. i don't know why Chris would volunteer info on another line that would override what the manufacturer is saying. Carpro says Essence bonds to the paint, and their coatings bond to Essence via merge.
inference is he's focusing on OPT coatings.
really i just jumped in because Chris has been so gracious through the years on the internet and it's unfair for people to attack him for volunteering his educated opinion.
otherwise doesn't matter either way to me because i use OPT coatings and Dr. G has expressed that Essence shouldn't be used prior. so, it's a closed case for me on a personal level.
AGOatemywallet
New member
- Jun 13, 2015
- 920
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I have not read that comment from G, only from Chris Thomas
A clarification from Chris on which coatings Essence is compatible with & why it is not compatible with OPT Pro coatings would make it crystal clear and provide valuable guidance to Forum Members who are considering the use of Essence with Gloss Coat
spinz
New member
- Feb 18, 2013
- 93
- 0
May i know where did Chris say the above?
This just saved me from using Essence with OptiCoat Pro on my parents car...
DaveT435
Active member
- Jun 23, 2012
- 3,982
- 0
I'll very simply say...does not play well with Blackfire coating. I'm going to try this particular bottle of coating that I opened yesterday and rule out coating issues simply because there have been some complaints about the product lately. I've used Blackfire in the past and found it very easy to use so after I rule that out I'm going to play with the time between Essence and Blackfire. I got it to work on my hood and it looks great, but it was an incredible amount of work. I definitely would not do a whole car this way.
builthatch
New member
- May 25, 2008
- 2,352
- 0
if you are referring to what i said, i asked someone at OPT (a Chris equivalent) who asked Dr. G and they said Dr. G said to not use Essence before their paint coatings. if, for some reason, that is now incorrect or that message was sent to me in error, someone from OPT can certainly step in.
AGOatemywallet
New member
- Jun 13, 2015
- 920
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Originally Posted by Chris Thomas
"So far from my experience it looks like essence is a good prep for 2 year coatings, but is not a viable option for coatings that need actually form a strong chemical bond to the paint."
haris300
New member
- Apr 1, 2014
- 999
- 0
Just wanted to add that my experience with applying BLACKFIRE Crystal Coat over Essence wasn't too great either. I love Crystal Coat on its own, but when I experimented with it over Essence, it was very sticky/grabby and I had a difficult time removing it. It wasn't impossible by any means but definitely required more effort. CQuartz, as I expected, went over Essence with no problem whatsoever.