A few questions about cleaner waxes and polishes.

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DUDE007

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Hi, all.

I'm confused over the use of a cleaner wax and clay bar. Many use the wax after using a clay but wouldn't that defeat its purpose? I understand that a cleaner wax is an AIO product....so can't i use it without claying(right after washing/drying)?

I read Mike's article about diminishing and SMAT abrasives......in which category does Meguiars polishing compound fall in? If its a diminishing abrasive then how long should i work it in until it completely broken down?

:confused:
 
Aside from staying with the proper sequence of each step, claying, cleaning and polishing all clean the paint uniquely enough that they are mutually exclusive procedures.

Clay removes embedded contaminates and strips the protection layers in the process.

AIO's will clean the paint with either chemical and/or abrasives, and also leave a layer of protection.

Most of Meguiar's products are SMAT, and it is those products that are used here on AG most often.

Whether it is SMAT or DAT, work time is generally the same with all other factors being equal. Use a general work time estimate of 4-5 minutes to complete 5-6 section passes on a 2x2 area. Again, all other factors considered equal. Until you lock-in a specific process for a particular panel and/or vehicle you won't know for sure how much deviation there could be from the estimate.
 
DUDE007 said:
Hi, all.

I'm confused over the use of a cleaner wax and clay bar. Many use the wax after using a clay but wouldn't that defeat its purpose?
Click to expand...

No. It won't. The reason is that both are different steps meant for different objectives, without a doubt that cleaner wax overlaps the clay (to some extent) when used standalone. But the primary purpose of cleaner wax is to remove or improve fine swirls, scratches and other minor surface defects like water spots and etchings alongwith protection and gloss.


DUDE007 said:
I understand that a cleaner wax is an AIO product....so can't i use it without claying(right after washing/drying)?
Click to expand...

Yes, u definitely can. As i said, both are different processes.

DUDE007 said:
I read Mike's article about diminishing and SMAT abrasives......in which category does Meguiars polishing compound fall in? If its a diminishing abrasive then how long should i work it in until it completely broken down?
Click to expand...

Meguiars polishing compound....???

Did u mean:
  • M105 Ultra Cut Compound, or
  • Ultimate Compound, or
  • M205 Ultra Finishing Polish

If u mean any one of the above, then all the above are SMAT. So you can stop anywhere in the buffing cycle without leaving swirls caused by the abrasives. Thats the differentiating characterstic of SMAT products.

Whereas, in DAT products when used correctly will break down over a normal buffing cycle, (period of time and number of passes), to sufficiently break abbrasives down. And this skill comes with practice/experience. Otherwise that will cause marring. Thats the reason why its said that "use less aggressive product 1st"
 
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To complement the previous responses:
Clay (or clay substitutes) removes, among other things, imbeded contaminants - these contaminants, if not previously removed by the clay, can dislodge themselves when you are using the cleaner wax and will be dragged across the paint and cause a lot of damage.
 
While it is possible to apply an AIO without claying there is a huge risk of instilling swirls and/or marring the paint. When polishing, if a pad picks-up one of those pimple-sized dots I always see on my clay bars, it's going to attach to the pad and against the paint during polishing. And it doesn't break down; so as long as the contaminate(s) are between pad and paint.... you are no longer simply polishing.

Every time I see small, pimple-sized dots on my clay bar I tell myself one less problem to run into during polishing.

With that said, I believe "not claying" is tempting fate. Eventually, that decision will come to haunt you.
 
imranhakro said:
Whereas, in DAT products when used correctly will break down over a normal buffing cycle, (period of time and number of passes), to sufficiently break abbrasives down. And this skill comes with practice/experience. Otherwise that will cause marring. Thats the reason why its said that "use less aggressive product 1st"
Click to expand...

No offense intended here... I think you are trying to state something valid, but just not getting to the end zone if you know what I mean.

First off, with DAT... all you need is pressure, patience and section passes. A monkey can diminish DAT abrasives with a polisher; there is no skill in diminishing the abrasives. Where the skill lays is doing that fast enough, before the product dries, and achieve the desired correction and reflectivity/gloss desired relative to the characteristics of the paint you are working on.

Second and lastly, the "use less aggressive product 1st", is valid in and of itself. Still, I don't see how it relates to the original question at all.

Like I said before, no offense intended and I apologize ahead of time if you believe I am being unfair.
 
DUDE007 said:
Hi, all.

I'm confused over the use of a cleaner wax and clay bar.
Click to expand...


  1. What are you working on?
  2. What is your goal?
  3. Do you have any type of electric polisher?

Lots of great information already posted for you in this thread, I would also suggest reading through this article, the information works for new cars and also used cars...

How To Detail Your Brand New Car by Mike Phillips



:)
 
mwoolfso said:
No offense intended here... I think you are trying to state something valid, but just not getting to the end zone if you know what I mean.

First off, with DAT... all you need is pressure, patience and section passes. A monkey can diminish DAT abrasives with a polisher; there is no skill in diminishing the abrasives. Where the skill lays is doing that fast enough, before the product dries, and achieve the desired correction and reflectivity/gloss desired relative to the characteristics of the paint you are working on.

Second and lastly, the "use less aggressive product 1st", is valid in and of itself. Still, I don't see how it relates to the original question at all.

Like I said before, no offense intended and I apologize ahead of time if you believe I am being unfair.
Click to expand...

The poster infact was unsure that either the said product is SMAT or DAT. The end zone was that i told him that its SMAT and how DAT is different from SMAT.

Secondly, if monkeys could play with DAT products so easily, i don't find any reason why Meguiar's came up with SMAT(More user friendly) products.:dunno:

Lastly, i didnt take it as offense. May be we both have different way of explaining things.:dunno:
 
@mwoolfso thanks for the info...now i get why you use it after claying.
 
@imranhakro Thanks for replying.
The paint i'm working on needs claying as the pad(by hand) i used to work the Mothers cleaner wax became slightly black. I think the swirls might worsen if the pad picks up any large contaminants....though i haven't noticed this yet. I'll experiment and see what i can do.

Meguiars has a clear coat safe polishing compound for use by hand only, i think it has diminishing abrasives. Click here to see it.
 
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