AIO Followed By Finishing Polish - Wipe Down/Off AIO Between The Two?

ralphsmithiii

ralphsmithiii

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Hey guys, I know I've seen this answer before somewhere but it's been a challenge to find the info (for me) via the search feature.

My question is, if I'm using an AIO to do some light correction (using PF2500) and I want to do a round with a finishing polish (looking to buy 3D HD+ today), is it required/recommended to wipe the PF2500 off the paint before I do a run with the 3D HD+ and a fresh finish pad? I believe I had read before that you could just run the finishing polish over the paint but part of my broken logic thinks that you may just be spreading/mixing the two together and thus not getting the same effectiveness with running the 3D HD+ on "clean" paint. It doesn't take much time to wipe the panels down with a towel, but if I'm doing "extra" work when I don't have to then I'll skip that step. After the finishing polish I'll hit it with Wolfgang Perfect Prep then followup with a ceramic coat.
 
You’re asking for trouble laying down a AIO right before a coating, even if you’re going to use the paint prep. There’s a chance it won’t completely come off with it being just applied.

Just my 2 cents.
 
I was going to apply the finishing polish after the AIO. I know that Menzurna products typically are oil-based. Would doing the finishing polish + the paint prep not ensure I don't have issues with the AIO? Or, what am I supposed to do after using the AIO but before putting ceramic coating?
 
ralphsmithiii said:
I was going to apply the finishing polish after the AIO. I know that Menzurna products typically are oil-based. Would doing the finishing polish + the paint prep not ensure I don't have issues with the AIO? Or, what am I supposed to do after using the AIO but before putting ceramic coating?
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If it was me I’d skip using the AIO altogether in this case. After all, you don’t need the sealant/wax portion of it [you’re planning on trying to remove it immediately after laying it down] + any polishing will be more than taken care of with the finishing polish you plan on using.

What exact benefits are you hoping to gain by using the AIO? It seems like it’s only purpose would be to create more work and uncertainty.
 
Eldorado2k said:
If it was me I’d skip using the AIO altogether in this case. After all, you don’t need the sealant/wax portion of it [you’re planning on trying to remove it immediately after laying it down] + any polishing will be more than taken care of with the finishing polish you plan on using.
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Not only are you asking for trouble like Eldorado described, but you are working backwards with the abrasives as well. The AIO's I've used are LESS abrasive than a finishing polish since they were never designed with a focus on doing any real correction of the paint. Your process would take you to a more aggressive product rather than less. Not only that, but PF2500 is a medium grade polish whereas 3500 or 3800 are the finishing polishes for Menzerna.

Go with Eldorado's advice. Use a real polish to do the correction and leave the AIO out completely.
 
as others have said skip the AIO step..stick with polishing then proper IPA wipedown to remove all the oils left behind from polishing step to ensure you get proper bonding of ceramic coating..AIO are for light correction and some protection..
 
Hmmm...Ok I must of misunderstood the products. So, the Mezurna PF2500 is an AIO that is designed to: Menzerna Medium Cut Polish 2500 is made for the OEM market as a quick way to polish out light flaws and amplify the paint’s gloss. It has the cutting ability just a step below Super Intensive. This will remove moderate to mild swirls, water spots, and light scratches. Then Menzerna Medium Cut Polish 2500 does something amazing – it burnishes the paint to an ultra high gloss, like you’d expect from Nano Polish.

So, if I had very well maintained paint with light swirls, I shouldn't be using this AIO? Originally, I was using Megs 105/205 for heavy compounding then 205 to polish. But the 205 is leaving some light micro marring on this particular vehicle. I switched over to the bottle of SF2500 and it was a night and day difference in both the micro marring and overall polish/gloss. Note: I did not use 105 as this car didn't need it.

Are you guys saying that AIO's are "junk" essentially? I've had great results before but if I'm doing it wrong and/or could have much better results then that's awesome. I just want to make sure I'm understanding what I'm doing with the right products.

TL;DR - If I need light paint correct on a hard clear (2010 ZR1 Corvette), which products should I be using?
 
Or, now that I'm thinking about it, the finishing polish is what I may be not understanding correctly. SF2500 takes out 2500 grit marks and the Blackfire SRC Finishing polish I have takes out 3000 (I believe). 3000 is finer than 2500, correct? I assumed that if I wanted that "Extra" finish to clean up any left over swirls or anything light, than the SRC finishing polish would do so. But, from what you guys are saying that's not correct?
 
ralphsmithiii said:
Are you guys saying that AIO's are "junk" essentially?
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No ones saying AIO’s are junk, but there’s a percentage of their final result that’s filling in blemishes and making it look as good as it does upon completion. That’s the natural side effect of its built in wax component.
 
Ok gotcha. What would you recommend if I wanted to perform a light polish and to end with a ceramic coating?
 
Let's see if this is any help -

On my wife's car, that I do not plan to coat, and on friend's cars that I do not intend to coat, I think an All-In-One is a great product for vehicles that require minimal correction. However, I'd never add a coating on top of it. It is intended to be the last product used (unless you "top it off" with additional sealant).

On my car to be coated, or for a friend who wants to pay for a coating, I would use a more standard polish (or compound and polish), then do some type of panel wipe to remove any oils or residue the polish leaves, and then apply the coating.

Using a product whose ultimate goal is leaving protection behind, and then needing to remove it in order to coat, is working backwards.

Good luck on your project.
 
I think we might have a vocabulary problem that is confusing things.

An AIO is also known as a cleaner wax. Examples of AIO's are HD Speed, McKee's 37 360, or Menzerna 3-in-one. These products have a mild polish mixed in with a sealant or wax and allow you to polish and protect the car in one step, hence the designator of "all in one". The abrasives in these products vary by aggressiveness, but all are on the mild side. Also the wax/selants in them also vary in durability. If you are going to apply a coating, you do NOT want to use one of these types of products because of the wax/sealant they leave behind.

If you're talking about Menzerna 2500, that isn't an AIO, it's a medium grade or swirl remover polish. Some people may refer to it as a one-step polish because you may be able to use it to correct and produce an LSP ready shine in one step on certain paints. One-step doesn't equal AIO. Using 2500 to do the correction, and then following up with a finishing polish like 3500, 3800, or SRC Finishing Polish would be very normal.

With that out of the way, I think you're asking if you need to do a wipe down between your medium grade polish and finishing polish. My answer would be, it depends. Technically, you don't. The important wipe down is at the end of all the polishing and before you apply the coating in order to remove all the oils from the polishes. However, when first working on the car, it might be a good idea on a couple spots just to make sure you're getting the desired level of correction from the 2500 without all the polishing oils obscuring your view of the actual paint condition.
 
Thanks Desertnate! You are correct, I had my vocab wrong. I was calling SF2500 an AIO but it's a one-step polish (which I assumed to be an All-In-One). So based on at least what you're saying, then I'm good to go with the SF2500 (not an AIO) followed by a finishing polish. I want to try the 3800 but it appears it doesn't come in a smaller bottle option although from what I've read on this forum, most people say you couldn't' tell the difference between 3500 and 3800 and 3500 comes in a smaller option. I'm also considering the 3D HD+ finishing polish as it seems to have great reviews. But, I own the SRC finishing polish I bought a few years ago.
 
ralphsmithiii said:
Thanks Desertnate! You are correct, I had my vocab wrong. I was calling SF2500 an AIO but it's a one-step polish (which I assumed to be an All-In-One). So based on at least what you're saying, then I'm good to go with the SF2500 (not an AIO) followed by a finishing polish. I want to try the 3800 but it appears it doesn't come in a smaller bottle option although from what I've read on this forum, most people say you couldn't' tell the difference between 3500 and 3800 and 3500 comes in a smaller option. I'm also considering the 3D HD+ finishing polish as it seems to have great reviews. But, I own the SRC finishing polish I bought a few years ago.
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Glad we figured it out. If you have SRC Finishing Polish already, I believe it is very similar to Menzerna's 3500 or 3800. I've used it to finish out the rock hard black paint on my VW for years. It's easy to use and produces great results. The only draw back is it's a little oily and takes more wipe-down work before applying a coating.
 
Sounds like you figured out the differences. I would say to skip 3800 if you are going to use a ceramic coating. It is too oily of a product that takes a few prep wipes to remove. I would look into Optimum Hyper Polish, Sonax Ex 04-06, Gyeon Polish. I personally was not a fan of HD Polish but that would be a good one as well. Less oils to remove with a prep wipe yet leaving good gloss.
 
CarPro Essence is an AOI that can be used prior to coating. Just throwing this in to muddy the waters. Lol.
 
rlmccarty2000 said:
CarPro Essence is an AOI that can be used prior to coating. Just throwing this in to muddy the waters. Lol.
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There you go....

I thought about Essence or Gyeon Primer, but didn't want to go down that road.
 
I would wipe of the residue after the pf2500 as it may be not only polishing oils but clearcoat residue and broken down abrasive. So if you are going with a finishing polish after this step I would take the little time it takes to wipe it off after you are finished the section you have polished. I see no benefit to not wipe it off. Depending on the ceramic coating you are going to apply I would see if they have a primer for it. Carpro has essence primer and gyeon has their Primer, Polish Angel has their Invicible Primer and so on. A big benefit with those primers are if you let them after wiping them of with a mf towel and as they recommend to let the solvents to evaporate from them. You don't need to use a panel wipe product to get the polishing oils off for the coating to bond properly. And with the primers you often get a longer longevity from the coating and some has resins in them that creates a higher gloss than a finishing polish could do. So say you where to apply a carpro coating. I would do a test spot to get the combo dialed in with the pf2500 and pad that gets the correction you are satisfied with. Then use a finishing pad and carpro glosspad is a great choice for polishing with carpro essence. To be on safe side and the recommended time wait for at least 3 hours after you have polished with essence and then apply the coating. If you only would need the correction from a finishing polish you can get the cut from essence too with the right pad. And test spot is your friend here to see which combo with the least aggressive polishing to correct it to your satisfaction.
 
Thanks everyone for the super helpful tips, suggestions, all of the above! I've almost finished the car with SF2500 this go-around and I must say, it looks really good with a respectable amount of gloss thus far. I was looking to throw that little extra step of using a finishing polish since my understanding is that it doesn't take nearly as much time to apply and work it in since you are just "finishing" off any left over light imperfections and thus you don't have to treat it like a full correction. 2-4 passes a panel and move on is what I've read on this forum. With that, early this morning while discussing this with you all, and although I have the SRC finishing polish by Blackfire, I picked up the 3D HD+ polish to give it a go. AG is running their 20% off coupon today and I wanted to pick up two gray finishing/polishing pads (6.5 and 3.5) for my Flex 3401 and PC. I'll wipe the car down to get the SF2500 resign off then test a panel with the HD. If I don't notice a major difference with it I may pass and just and wipe it down with the Perfect Prep then coat it. Also for a reference point, I'm using the rest of the McKee's 37 Paint Coating. It's what I bought for my first attempt to ceramic coat due to the price and ease of application and I feel like it got me every bit of about a years coverage as expected from a Florida car that's driven and cleaned often. Actually, now that I think about it, I believe I also have some of their paint prep coating, too.
 
There are so many questions like this in the forum. People using products completelly out of the realms of what they are designed for.

First, why would you use an AIO then use a polish? An AIO is halfway in cut between a compound and a polish and is meant to replace both in a single step. If you are gonna do a 2 step, why not use a compound and a polish and obtain the best result possible at a lower price point?

Second, AIOs have waxes and sealants in them. If you polish afterwards you will remove the protection in the AIO... so why use the AIO in the first place?

Third, if your goal is to coat the vehicle, your preparation steps should be to correct as much defects as possible (Compound), bring the most shine you can (Polish) and make sure no wax or sealant are present on the paint (Agressive wash, grease and wax remover of some sort after polishing AND not applying any wax or sealant in the prep work).

So if I were you, I would drop the AIO completelly and replace it with a compound of your choice. Also make sure to use a fallout remover (Iron-X, Ferrex, etc), tar remover, road film remover and clay the paint before moving on the compound and polish. As a grease remover, you have several options, Isopropyl alcohol mix, CarPro Eracer, Duplicolor Grease and Wax remover, etc. Then you are ready for the coating.
 
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