Clearcoat cracks, paint thickness, polishing car today?

C

charlestek

New member
Sep 22, 2010
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Last year I wrote about some clearcoat cracking/fracturing in my paint: http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...red-wrinkled-etching-popping-up-all-over.html

I have not polished and rewaxed the car in almost a year because of my job, but am considering doing it today.

A month or so ago, I bought a paint thickness meter and found my paint thickness to be in the 110 to 130 micro meter range which may or may not jive with the clearcoat issues I saw as far as being caused from overpolished thin clearcoat.

Given the clearcoat issues, the safest thing might be to just clay, IPA and wax the car, but I'm questioning taking a risk doing a light polishing with some Merzerna light polish I bought.

Any opinions would be welcome.
 
I've seen this a few times and can tell you that if you polish the paint, the white snowflake fractures become even more noticable. This is especially true if the car is black in color. The paint below the clearcoat has failed and it will need to be repainted.

Of course you can clay and wax to protect the existing condition.
You can try a small 12" x 12" section if you are still curious, but be prepare to be shocked at how bright the snowflakes show after the polish.
 
SonOfOC, it is curious that you are saying it is the paint below the clearcoat, ie the basecoat that is failing vs the clearcoat failing. I initially thought it was the clearcoat that was polished down too deeply by the previous owner, but the paint guage does not seem to be telling me that.

In any case, yeah, this sucks. The snowflakes are mainly on the hood, roof and trunk lid.
The sides of the car seem to be ok.

I hate to put wax on the car over a lot of swirls.

I got laid-off from my job last month so any car repainting money would be out of the question for awhile. The people in the other threads told me to just live with it.
If I get back to work, I guess I would have to evaluate whether paying say $5000 (I think that's what it would cost) to repaint a car with 59k miles would be worth it.
 
I don't know how thick the paint really should be however the thicker the paint the more it costs the auto manufacture, I think you can see where I'm going with this.

Some say that the paint film thickness is about 0.001". Given the fact that the average human hair measures 0.004" the clear and color coat totals 1/2 the thickness of a human hair so that ain't all that much!

Now, I don't have a paint thickness gauge but from what I've read they're only capable of displaying total thickness from the metal to the top of the clear coat, not individual layers.

What you don't want to do is to apply a product that dries white such as a polish or paint cleaner. These will fill those little voids in the paint and will look like hell.

This might be a great opportunity to lay down a nice glaze to fill those voids once the surface is clean.


  • Wash
  • Clay
  • Klean Strip Perp-All Wipe
  • Glaze
  • Wax


Glazes


Some sealants and waxes to consider:

Sealants

Wax


One of my favorites

 
I'm with BobbyG here, glaze and wax it until you can have the paint repaired. I've messed around with 3 glazes and of the 3 CG GlossWorkz Glaze fills like crazy. That stuff has a very deep, wet shine to it as well.
 
Yeah,

I have some meguiars machine glaze, which I did not use last year. Last year I used poli-seal than opti-seal then collinite 476s after polishing with Meguiars 205.

I guess you are saying it is safer to use the meguiars glaze instead of the mezerna (power finish) or meguiars 205. I was thinking about opti-seal then collinite 476s or 845. I'm doing it today, so that is all I have on hand. I suppose klasse would be better than the opti-seal, but I don't have any.

I also remember from asking on the optimum forum that meguiars glaze is not favored as a base for optiseal because of its paint oils, so maybe I should just do glaze then the collinite waxes.

I have Meguiars Machine glaze #3 and #7 on hand, not #80. It is a holiday today, I might be able to get some #80 if the store is open.


Maybe it would be better to pay someone to prep it and put opticoat on??
 
My understanding is that you're trying to improve the finish and are looking for a way to clean up the finish and get rid of those unsightly white marks everywhere.

Cleaning the white residue from the existing cracks is task #1.

A small brush like a tooth brush and some Perp-All should prove very successful at removing this debris and residue. What you don't want to do it so refill these crevices with new residue left over from polishing products like Menzerna Power Finish or Meguiar's M205. Both are great products but will leave behind residue filling those little cracks.

I think this is a safe approach...

Meguiar's #80 has some correction capabilities as it removes minor swirls and oxidation. This might give you exactly what you're looking for.. It's difficult to tell without actually inspecting the finish in person.

Richard mentions a glaze heavy in fillers, this is what your after to help the situation.

Collinite 845 is an all-time-favorite of mine. It does a beautiful job leaving the finish looking wet and provide 5 months of solid protection here in New England.

Before you take it to someone give it a try yourself. It sounds like you already have most of what you need. Spend some quality time working on the hood and see if the situation improves, if it does then continue, if not then off to the shop,,,
 
Ok,

I found a store that is open today that has #80 speed glaze. I'm going to be using a porter cable 7424xp machine. So after the speed glaze, I need another glaze on top, can't use meguiars #3, need a filler glaze?

I can't get the filler glaze without ordering it from autogeek and waiting a few days. We have an unusual day of nice weather in Boston today and I'm running out of time and out of daylight here.

I don't have a garage.
 
The store had a bottle of #80 that looked 4 years old. I passed. Have to get some from another store that has to order it from the warehouse. Damn, I wanted to get the car done today. I suppose I could have used Meguiars swirl remover than glaze, if the swirl remover is as mild as the swirl remover in #80

Btw, I don't have a super amount of crevices, mostly on the roof, hood and trunk. Rest of car seems relatively ok.
 
charlestek said:
Ok,

I found a store that is open today that has #80 speed glaze. I'm going to be using a porter cable 7424xp machine. So after the speed glaze, I need another glaze on top, can't use meguiars #3, need a filler glaze?

I can't get the filler glaze without ordering it from autogeek and waiting a few days. We have an unusual day of nice weather in Boston today and I'm running out of time and out of daylight here.

I don't have a garage.
Click to expand...

HA, I work in Boston but live Southwest of the city about 1 1/2 hours away...no traffic!!

I don't think Meguiar's #3 fills much although I've never used it. You really need a filler glaze to gain some ground on the surface condition but to do it today or tomorrow you'll need to work with what's available..

Given the weather and availability of Meguiar's #80 I'd do just one section and see how it comes out. The finish might benefit from two coats but follow the directions on the label and be sure that it's dry before top coating...
 
If you have a pep boys by you they usually have the Megs #80. I know there is a pep boys in Nashua. I don't know how close to NH you are.
 
Actually I'm in Watertown. Given the late time right now and the fact that the sun will set close to 6pm, I don't have time to get this done today. I guess I will do a small section and look at it.

It looks like the Chemical Guys Glosswork Glaze is not widely available. Autogeek does not sell it apparently. But it is available on ebay.
 
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Careful putting links up to other detailing sites...that's against ag rules.

I may have some glaze at my home (Billerica). I'd have to check and can get back to you later tonight if your interested.
 
SeaJay, ok, I removed the links. However if the chemical guys is so good, then I may not need the Meguiars. However, it does not seem to be a swirl removing glaze, just a swirl filling glaze. I'm getting a product overload headache....
 
OK,

I ordered some Chemical Guys XTREME SHINE EZ~CREME GLAZE w/ACRYLIC SHINE II for the glaze. So I may or may not want to do some light polishing before the glaze.
 
charlestek said:
OK,

I order some Chemical Guys XTREME SHINE EZ~CREME GLAZE w/ACRYLIC SHINE II for the glaze. So I may or may not want to do some light polishing before the glaze.
Click to expand...

Great!

Sounds like you want to clean those spots removing the white debris or residue then apply the glaze according to the directions.
 
charlestek,

I'm taking a guess here, but is your car a Acura / Honda???
If so, the glaze or polishing will NOT work.

The fracture is in the basecoat beneath the clear. Put your fingernail on top of it, look and feel real carefully. You'll notice those fractures are below the clear coat.

If your car hasn't been polish, then polishing it will make those marks show so much more. The white crow's feet like marks suddenly come to life and makes that area look like shattered glass.

As for the glaze, it won't work since the damage is below the clear coat.
 
No it is a Nissan Maxima. I either have tiny crows feet or some actual areas where the paint has left a small pitted crack into the surface below. It does make sense that the filler is not going to fix this as long as the clearcoat is still above. I guess I need to take more pictures. I polished once last year when I got the car. This is my only attempt this year, and I definitely need at the least to clay and Ipa the surface and get some wax on the finish. It is bad therefore that I can't polish this at all. Polishing might at least get rid of swirls in the paint in areas where the cracks are not, but as you say I guess it will accentuate the cracked areas as well.

As I said before, most of this is in the roof, hood and trunk deck. Not much on the sides at all.
 
I just looked at the pics again and I'm going to say that I don't think those are going to come out by polishing. And as for a glaze filling them in I think it might be too much for a glaze. Just my opinion. Certainly worth giving it a try though since you ordered it. Plus a glaze will not last very long.

How old is the car? And the roof, hood, and trunk deck are usually the spots that show their age and take the most abuse from the sun.

If the white crows feet are under the clear then there really isnt any fixing that with out repainting. It looks like crows feet in the clear to me though. But hard to tell with a pic.
 
The crow's feet in the first picture in that link are from a meguiars picture from some one else's car that Mike took. The second picture with the tiny spot is my picture.

I guess the idea with the glaze is that I will be able to fill in adjacent swirls in the paint without abrasively polishing the paint that might make the fractures worse. So essentially I'm trying to use the glaze to fix the good parts of the finish without using any abrasives on the paint.
 
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