Clearcoat Fracturing versus Clearcoat Failure

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Clearcoat Fracturing versus Clearcoat Failure


Pictures courtesy of Jacob aka timaishu
The term Clearcoat Fracturing by Dave aka tuscarora dave


Clearcoat Fracturing

Clearcoat Failure

More clearcoat fracturing pictures by Jacob

Problem
When you diagnose paint with clearcoat fracturing, this is an indicator of a problem with the clear layer of paint.

Clearcoat Fracturing cannot be fixed by machine compounding and polishing as the fractures are like millions of stress cracks that run throughout the entire matrix or thickness of the clear layer of paint. Abrading the paint will just make the pant thinner and expose a deeper portion of the fractures.


Solutions

Live with the defect
Best recommendations are to prep the paint accordingly to insure the surface is clean and smooth, that is clay an polish if needed, and then maintain what lifespan is left in the paint using a premium quality wax, paint sealant or coating.

Repaint
The other option is to have the panel or component re-painted.​

 

[Marc08EX]

Hi Mike,

How about this?

*** Image taken from: Cracks in paint(crows feet)? - 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum

It seems like they are calling it crows feet. Now would you consider that clear coat fracture or clear coat failure?

Thanks.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Hi Mike,

How about this?

*** Image taken from: Cracks in paint(crows feet)? - 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum


It seems like they are calling it crows feet. Now would you consider that clear coat fracture or clear coat failure?

Thanks.

I would continue to call the defect in the above picture and link you shared crows feet or in the old days it was called lacquer checking, or lacquer cracking.

Both Lacquer Fracturing and Crows Feet are both a type of crack or fracture in the paint but have a very different appearance.

 

[FUNX650]

Clearcoat Fracturing versus Clearcoat Failure


Solutions

Live with the defect
Best recommendations are to prep the paint accordingly to insure the surface is clean and smooth, that is clay an polish if needed, and then maintain what lifespan is left in the paint using a premium quality wax, paint sealant or coating.

Repaint
The other option is to have the panel or component re-painted.​

Mike:

You have articles on glazes and their place in the auto recon/refinishing industry, as well as its use in the "detailing world". Since a ClearCoat paint film is supposedly 'more denser/less porous' than a SS paint film, I was wondering if a glaze would truly be of any help in the CC paint issues that are pictured in this thread.

Seems like now there are plenty of 'less dense/more porous' areas for a glazes to "soak" into.

Of course, a follow up with a wax, sealant, [or maybe one of the coatings(?)], whether a glaze is applied or not, is advisable...as you have stated.

Thanks for any input you may have on this matter.

Bob

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Mike:

You have articles on glazes and their place in the auto recon/refinishing industry, as well as its use in the "detailing world". Since a ClearCoat paint film is supposedly 'more denser/less porous' than a SS paint film,

I was wondering if a glaze would truly be of any help in the CC paint issues that are pictured in this thread.

First the answer to your above question and that is,

"no"


Once the paint has cracks like seen in the above pictures the paint is now past the point of no return. Applying any type of oily glaze or non-abrasive polish won't do anything to undo the damage or even stop any future cracking....

What I was told by a good friend in this industry as it relates to modern clear coat paints and non-abrasive, pure polishes or body shop safe glazes is that when a clear coat finish is "brand new" either a factory finish or a repaint, and it has not been sanded or cut with an abrasive compound or polish, that at this point in time the clear layer of paint is its hardest, densest and most impermeable.

With time, wear-n-tear and exposure to the elements, the clear layer becomes more open via swirls, scratches, oxidation and interstices which are microscopic cracks or fissures.

The point being that the physical condition or characteristics of new paints change with time.

Someone once asked me if there were any benefits to applying a non-abrasive, pure polish or bodyshop safe glaze to a brand new clear coat and the answer is for the most part "no" except to create a glossy appearance.

But the part most people miss is this...

A brand new paint job shouldn't need anything to make it look good, it should look good right off the assembly line or right out of the paint booth assuming in the case of the latter that the painter is experienced and has his paint process and paint booth dialed-in.

Seems like now there are plenty of 'less dense/more porous' areas for a glazes to "soak" into.

Definitely, the paint is more open and thus liquids and gasses can theoretically more easily pass through the paint.

Applying a non-abrasive, pure polish or bodyshop glaze might help to mask the scratches and improve the appearance of the paint. But since non-abrasive, pure polishes and bodyshop safe glazes are water soluble, the masking effect will be only temporary at best and if the product dries white then it could end up revealing the defects, not hiding them.

 

[SonOfOC]

I would continue to call the defect in the above picture and link you shared crows feet or in the old days it was called lacquer checking, or lacquer cracking.

Both Lacquer Fracturing and Crows Feet are both a type of crack or fracture in the paint but have a very different appearance.

Mike, how much of the "crows feet" can be attributed to the vibration and force of the hood being open/close thoughout the years? Does this vibration and flex shatter the paint/clear/laquer?

Reason I ask is that I come across many years of Honda/Acuras in black with this problem. It is substantially worse on front of the hood with little to none on other panels.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Mike, how much of the "crows feet" can be attributed to the vibration and force of the hood being open/close throughout the years? Does this vibration and flex shatter the paint/clear/lacquer?

Reason I ask is that I come across many years of Honda/Acuras in black with this problem. It is substantially worse on front of the hood with little to none on other panels.

Great question and I don't know.

I had the crows feet cracking problem on a 2004 Honda Passport that we bought brand new and it was garage kept the entire time we owned it so exposure to the sun can e ruled out.

Anytime I see a paint problem one of the things I try to do is figure out the root cause, one thing I look for is if the problem is isolated to

• Horizontal surfaces
• Hood only
• Bumpers only

As for vibration or *shock* caused by closing/slamming a hood... it's possible that the impact over time of a hood closing could be related to crows feet scratches but my first inclination would go towards engine heat (over time).

 

[truckbutt]

Thanks for the education. Any day I learn something new is a god day.

 

[FUNX650]

Mike....Thanks for your reply to my inquiry.

And as always, very insightful and beneficial. rops:

Bob

 

[Marc08EX]

Thanks for the info and answering my questions Mike!!

BTW, that clear coat fracture looks familiar. I encountered a car that had that and I did 3 section passes of M83 (good old days of you starting MOL) to take it out. Eventually, the clear coat failed within a year and the paint was peeling... Here's the thread: What do you guys think about this one? (Results are in!) (I hope I'm not going against the rules)

 

[opie_7afe]

im wondering if say you have clear coat fractures would it be cheaper to just wetsand and reclear the effected areas? my thinking is the clear will flow into the fractures thus sealing them off and be gone forever, or would re clearing it just lead to fracturing of the new clear...

 

[mcpp66]

Those pictures of clear coat fracture just looks like swirls to me???

 

[timaishu]

Those pictures of clear coat fracture just looks like swirls to me???

I can understand you thinking that looking at the pictures. But after compounding it 6 times and wetsanding once and it looking no different. I can assure you they are not swirls.

Also hard to capture a good picture of it.

 

[mcpp66]

Well, your last statement certainly clarifies the situation.

 

[tuscarora dave]

Here's a few photos of clear coat fracturing that I have put together over time. Some are harder to see in the photos than others. This GMC Safari has clear coat fracturing just on the passenger side door. Why or how it occurred on that door only is a mystery to me.

When I show up to detail a car and I see something like this old BMW sitting under trees for extended periods of time there is almost always clear coat fracturing present.

Clear coat fracturing on the roof of same BMW.

After some compounding, polishing and a layer of M-21 sealant there is a significant improvement but still fractured none the less.

Here is an extreme case of clear coat fracturing where the acid erosion from sitting under trees has taken this car's paint far beyond just fracturing. I posted this one just for fun.

 

[opie_7afe]

come on tuscarora dave you know you can just buff the last one out!...make it look brand new! lmfao..im just kidding of course!

 

[Hoytman]

Found this article while searching for a video for another forum member.

Reminder to Mike and myself as I have pictures and examples on black paint, with sun shots before compounding/polishing and after sun shots.

This post is so I can search my own postings so that I can find this thread again. I didn't realize Mr. Phillips had an article on it. I even have full 1080 HD video of black paint in the sun. Stay tuned...

 

[tuscarora dave]

come on tuscarora dave you know you can just buff the last one out!...make it look brand new! lmfao..im just kidding of course!

That's too funny!!!:laughing::laughing::laughing:

That car belonged to one of my best friends so we had time to horse around with it. Nothing that we tried would even get it white again so in a moment of ridiculousness we scrubbed it up with Westly's Bleche-Wite and it came out as white as snow.

The car has since gone to the crusher.

 

[spence]

I have the crows feet on the hood of my 2001 black Acura CL. The roof, trunk, side panels have no crows feet. I attribute it to heat from the engine or I have been told Acura used fiber glass for the hoods so that may be the diference. Detailers and painters have told me that it is the paint that is fracturing and not the clear coat. A little disapointing considering the cost of an Acura and Honda's normal high marks for quality.

 

[STI4Life06]

Hi Mike,

How about this?

*** Image taken from: Cracks in paint(crows feet)? - 8th Generation Honda Civic Forum

It seems like they are calling it crows feet. Now would you consider that clear coat fracture or clear coat failure?

Thanks.

I would continue to call the defect in the above picture and link you shared crows feet or in the old days it was called lacquer checking, or lacquer cracking.

Both Lacquer Fracturing and Crows Feet are both a type of crack or fracture in the paint but have a very different appearance.

Mike,

I have a Subaru Leagcy that had been repainted some time ago by a previous owner and it now has "crows feet", looks exactly like what Marc posted above.

Recently, someone had keyed my entire car and now I am trying to get a repaint under my insurance. I went to a reputable body shop today and they told me it will cost me out of pocket $1k to have them repaint it since he would have to chemically strip the paint all the way down to bare metal because of the crows feet and the insurance will not cover it.

My question: is that really true? Will they need to strip the paint entirely? I don't think your a painter but maybe you have a good friend that you can ask?