Done with Gyeon products and probably ceramic coatings

[rick100]

Just venting out here . I just did a " 3 year ceramic coating" on my 2019 Audi sportback , no my first ceramic coating , but my second one with Gyeon products. I went through the whole process , acidic wash , iron remover, clay , polish , and eraser to finish off. I had previously put on Gyeon Pure evo on this same Audi and after a week I had to re-polish the hood area because the water spots were not coming off . Also the ceramic coating itself " failed" after 6 months , it was hydrophobic at first but after a while it was mehh . It was removed from my car after a year. I spend the winter playing around with waxes and sealants without any issues .
I had used car pro essence as a polish on my first installation of Gyeon pure , so I thought maybe the protection left behind by essence was not compatible with Gyeon pure . This time around I decided to put Gyeon Mohs on my Audi , also I used car pro reflect that leaves not protection behind to prevent any interactions issues between the two brands
The coating process itself was a breeze, the products goes on easy , flashes quite fast ( 30 seconds @ 20 degrees Celsius) and the removal is quite easy , very slick for a coating. I did 2 layers of mohs , I took the car outside to check for high spots and I only saw one which was corrected the same day . The car looked great . I also applied Gyeon cure which was part of the kit after 12 hours to prevent any water spotting issues for 2 weeks . Car was inside the garage for 3 days just to make sure the product had time to cure.
This is when the nightmare happened , again , I can't wash the car for 2 weeks according to Gyeon , so after 3 days I had to leave the car outside and it rained , as soon as I came out of my house in the am I can see the water spots from the rain, these spots looked different though , like a crystal/ rainbowish look engraved on my car , not the same look as the water spots I get with my other sealants and waxes I have been using. I didn't think much of it but I had the feeling that it was going to be a problem ... I would usually wash the car after work if it had rain , but I left it for a few more days . It was a week where it rain sporadically.
Fast forward to 10 days after install and I go for my first wash , as suspected the water spots do not come out , no matter what . I tried to polish a little area to see how bad it is and luckily enough polishing is removing the water spots. This is just like last year when I applied Gyeon Cure on this car, probably worst because now its all over the car instead of just the hood. Im removing this garbage from my car tomorrow , repolishing the whole car again and putting a wax on it.

My conclusion is that this product sucks , it cant even prevent water spotting from rain , I had other waxes and sealants on this same audi for the last 6 months, it has rain and snow and I never had an issue with water spotting , they came out after the wash no problem , but for some reason Gyeon cure, pure and mohs attract water somehow that it leaves water spotting more noticeable and it doesnt come out with a regular wash , and this is not water spotting from a sprinkle , its from rain

I m pretty much done with ceramic coatings too , every ceramic coating that I have put on always requires a sealant on top to prevent water spotting , so whats the point really, if you are masking the properties of the ceramic coating with a sealant , may as well just put a sealant on top without a ceramic coating. Looks wise , I ve been playing around with waxes and sealants the past 6 months and they actually do look better for me ...

I have better luck with car pro ceramic coatings but I dont think I would do it again

anyways just ranting today ...

 

[Klasse Act]

What size bottle did you use and how much was left afterwards

Also, what did you wash the car with

We're here to help for sure

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[Desertnate]

I find this really surprising and nothing at all like my experience. I've been running Pure EVO on my car for two years now and Mohs EVO for 12+ months on the wife's car without any issues. Even when filthy, the water behavior is pretty good. Water spotting has not been an issue on either vehicle. The only time I've had issues with tough water spots was on CQUK that was passing the 3 year point and starting to fail. Couldn't blame the coating at that point.

Do you live near a factory or airport? Your description of the water spots after the rain sounds strange for simple rainwater; like there is some sort of envornmental fall out mixed in. I cringe every time I have to leave me car at the airport. Even when parking in a covered area, I find it covered in all sorts nastiness that often is difficult to remove. It gets worse when mixed with rain or snow.

 

[rick100]

What size bottle did you use and how much was left afterwards

Also, what did you wash the car with

We're here to help for sure

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

30ml , not much left , maybe 5ml

I used car pro descale

 

[rick100]

I find this really surprising and nothing at all like my experience. I've been running Pure EVO on my car for two years now and Mohs EVO for 12+ months on the wife's car without any issues. Even when filthy, the water behavior is pretty good. Water spotting has not been an issue on either vehicle. The only time I've had issues with tough water spots was on CQUK that was passing the 3 year point and starting to fail. Couldn't blame the coating at that point.

Do you live near a factory or airport? Your description of the water spots after the rain sounds strange for simple rainwater; like there is some sort of envornmental fall out mixed in. I cringe every time I have to leave me car at the airport. Even when parking in a covered area, I find it covered in all sorts nastiness that often is difficult to remove. It gets worse when mixed with rain or snow.

I dont live close to an airport. I also have a M235 bmw with beadmaker and nothing sticks to it , after the rain the spots come out easily , even if I leave them for a few days .
I had a cadillac SRX with carpro lite and samething , all good after the rain .

I had the same issue with GYEON can coat .. Unless this coating is not compatible with my Audi , I do not know what to think. I followed instructions ...

 

[Klasse Act]

30ml , not much left , maybe 5ml

I used car pro descale

What type of soap did you use as a maintenance soap afterwards

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[DUBL0WS6]

Seems the people having best results use maintenance soaps or sprays.

 

[Klasse Act]

Bilt-Hamber Touchless or Auto-foam are great maintence pre-washes, Gyeon Restart for 2BM's...for starters

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk

 

[Optimus Grime]

I've read through this countless times and I'm beyond perplexed. I'm about 5 months into my application of Mohs and I've had zero waterspot issues and it's still beading like it was applied yesterday. My understanding with coatings requiring a sealant to prevent water spotting is only during the curing phase. Rain water shouldn't cause water spots unless you live near something that is creating some type of difficult to remove fallout or if something was left behind during the prep phase. It rained for a good week after applying Mohs and the only residue left behind was easily removed with a quick rinse less wash. You've got something else going on and it looks like none of us can figure it out.

 

[Desertnate]

Seems the people having best results use maintenance soaps or sprays.

I've done nothing special and I've having great results. I wash with either Hyperwash or 3D Pink. Most of the time, I don't top the Mohs EVO, and only occasionally topped Pure EVO as it began to age. I can easily skip the step and not feel like I've neglected the vehicles.

 

[Optimus Grime]

I've done nothing special and I've having great results. I wash with either Hyperwash or 3D Pink. Most of the time, I don't top the Mohs EVO, and only occasionally topped Pure EVO as it began to age. I can easily skip the step and not feel like I've neglected the vehicles.

I do use Reset and alternate between soap and ONR but I don't think the soap has anything to do with it, as long as you're not using one of those Walmart wash and wax soaps. I've been experimenting with P&S Frostbite and results are the same. I use Ceramic Detailer as a drying aid but it's a few sprays per wash and that in no way should be considered a topper.

I think the performance of the coating is going to come down to how well the vehicle was prepped before coating and the frequency of maintenance afterwards. It doesn't require anything obsessive. A good wash every few weeks and you should be good to go.

 

[DFB]

I think the performance of the coating is going to come down to how well the vehicle was prepped before coating and the frequency of maintenance afterwards. It doesn't require anything obsessive. A good wash every few weeks and you should be good to go.

I think this is where people go wrong with coatings.

For those who are not invested in detailing, be that non-car-people or those who love cars but are not into detailing, they get sold on a coating from a dealer/detailer/the internet as the ultimate solution, like an impervious layer that means you don't have to wash the car. Of course, we know that is not the case, but for those paying four-digit figures to have a coating applied, they think that means all they had to do was pay for the service and that's the end of the story.

The reality is, a coating is just as much if not more work to maintain as a wax or sealant, the only difference being how often you reapply the product. The notion of having to "unclog" a coating on a regular basis, having supplemental products applied to bring back the beading/gloss/slickness, this never seemed to be an issue with older forms of LSP's.

For people like us, we do this out of instinct and therefore get the full benefit of the coating. But for the average consumer that doesn't bother with regular maintenance, hell, even a regular wash, they end up wondering why the coating failed after 12 months, or that it doesn't bead anymore, or that it's riddled with water spots.

All of the above has me thinking I'll just go back to wax for my new car, coatings are great, but they are not as forgiving.

 

[Optimus Grime]

I think this is where people go wrong with coatings.

For those who are not invested in detailing, be that non-car-people or those who love cars but are not into detailing, they get sold on a coating from a dealer/detailer/the internet as the ultimate solution, like an impervious layer that means you don't have to wash the car. Of course, we know that is not the case, but for those paying four-digit figures to have a coating applied, they think that means all they had to do was pay for the service and that's the end of the story.

The reality is, a coating is just as much if not more work to maintain as a wax or sealant, the only difference being how often you reapply the product. The notion of having to "unclog" a coating on a regular basis, having supplemental products applied to bring back the beading/gloss/slickness, this never seemed to be an issue with older forms of LSP's.

For people like us, we do this out of instinct and therefore get the full benefit of the coating. But for the average consumer that doesn't bother with regular maintenance, hell, even a regular wash, they end up wondering why the coating failed after 12 months, or that it doesn't bead anymore, or that it's riddled with water spots.

All of the above has me thinking I'll just go back to wax for my new car, coatings are great, but they are not as forgiving.

It's odd. I'm very upfront with customers about the longevity of a coating, what it does and doesn't do, and how to maintain it which is not difficult. I've said it on here many times before. As part of my customer service package I ask all of my customers to come back and we'll wash the car together so that I know they will leave with the ability to care for their car. If they have no clue how to wash I'll start them on a rinse less routine and if they have a pressure washer I invite them back to learn how to use a foam cannon for a better clean. I send them off with some supplies to get started and if they need anything else they can buy from me at wholesale cost. Even with all of this, when I touch base months later at least 80% have never washed their car since I coated it and at the point I wash my hands of the situation.

I've been wondering why it's been so hard for me lately to get coating customers and I think I've figured it out. I refuse to lie and I detail with integrity and won't sacrifice that for money. I give people the honest facts but I keep seeing people prefer to be sold a dream. They flock to installers that overpromise and under deliver. 7 year coatings with a 5 year warranty, 8 year coatings for the price of a 5, 5 year coatings for $600 (the installer failed to mention that this was the price of the coating application and the paint correction wasn't included). This is what people want to hear because they think they can drive off and all of their exterior maintenance is taken care of. You can lead a horse to water......

 

[Desertnate]

It's odd. I'm very upfront with customers about the longevity of a coating, what it does and doesn't do, and how to maintain it which is not difficult.

This has been my experience too. I don't do anything different maintenance-wise with a coating than I did sealants. I wash them every couple weeks as able with a quality soap, keep the bird droppings off, and apply a light detail spray when I feel like it.

 

[CleanIT]

I ordered some Kealstrip Prepall. I've seen some reviews where the IPA based panel preps just can't remove the remaining oils/leftovers on the surface of the paint as well as Prepall. Bilt Hamber Cleanser Fluid is good too.

 

[Optimus Grime]

This has been my experience too. I don't do anything different maintenance-wise with a coating than I did sealants. I wash them every couple weeks as able with a quality soap, keep the bird droppings off, and apply a light detail spray when I feel like it.

This is exactly my routine. I used to top with a sealant because that's what I believed you're supposed to do but now I occasionally use Gyeon Ceramic Detailer as a drying aid. I've got two bottles of Cure that I'm about to dilute and turn into quick detailers. As my old algebra teacher used to say, keep it simple stupid.

 

[DFB]

It's odd. I'm very upfront with customers about the longevity of a coating, what it does and doesn't do, and how to maintain it which is not difficult. I've said it on here many times before. As part of my customer service package I ask all of my customers to come back and we'll wash the car together so that I know they will leave with the ability to care for their car. If they have no clue how to wash I'll start them on a rinse less routine and if they have a pressure washer I invite them back to learn how to use a foam cannon for a better clean. I send them off with some supplies to get started and if they need anything else they can buy from me at wholesale cost. Even with all of this, when I touch base months later at least 80% have never washed their car since I coated it and at the point I wash my hands of the situation.

I've been wondering why it's been so hard for me lately to get coating customers and I think I've figured it out. I refuse to lie and I detail with integrity and won't sacrifice that for money. I give people the honest facts but I keep seeing people prefer to be sold a dream. They flock to installers that overpromise and under deliver. 7 year coatings with a 5 year warranty, 8 year coatings for the price of a 5, 5 year coatings for $600 (the installer failed to mention that this was the price of the coating application and the paint correction wasn't included). This is what people want to hear because they think they can drive off and all of their exterior maintenance is taken care of. You can lead a horse to water......

Excellent post and exactly what I was attempting to explain.

Delivering customers "the dream" is all well and good, but how many of those customers will return in the future if the coating didn't live up to "the dream"? Being honest about what you are selling can be cost you a sale sometimes, but it can also win you future sales because the customer trusts your advice. It a razor thin line to tread.

 

[DFB]

This has been my experience too. I don't do anything different maintenance-wise with a coating than I did sealants. I wash them every couple weeks as able with a quality soap, keep the bird droppings off, and apply a light detail spray when I feel like it.

My routine as well, I treat a ceramic no different to a wax or sealant long term.

The problem is, many end up with a ceramic coating because they are led to believe it will "make cleaning easier". And it does, but it won't tolerate neglect either.

 

[Big DaveBig Dave is verified member.]

My routine as well, I treat a ceramic no different to a wax or sealant long term.

The problem is, many end up with a ceramic coating because they are led to believe it will "make cleaning easier". And it does, but it won't tolerate neglect either.

Sounds just like my Nephew's Father in Law, he bought a brand new BT-50 when he retired a few years ago, got it ceramic coated of course. He was sold on the coating because he isn't physically capable of washing it properly, just drive it through the car wash they told him. Now the paint looks flat, with water spotting all over it. He wants me to "fix it" for him. Sorry Bob, I don't touch ceramic coatings. I'm guessing a mate did it as a cash job for him, so it's more than likely gone anyway.

Sent from my motorola edge 20 fusion using Tapatalk

 

[DFB]

Sounds just like my Nephew's Father in Law, he bought a brand new BT-50 when he retired a few years ago, got it ceramic coated of course. He was sold on the coating because he isn't physically capable of washing it properly, just drive it through the car wash they told him. Now the paint looks flat, with water spotting all over it. He wants me to "fix it" for him. Sorry Bob, I don't touch ceramic coatings. I'm guessing a mate did it as a cash job for him, so it's more than likely gone anyway.

Sent from my motorola edge 20 fusion using Tapatalk

One of my clients bought a brand new Landcruiser in about 2012, he was upsold on a ceramic coating. The vehicle has been used extensively for offroad touring, so it's not a show pony statis statement that most Landcruiser's are. To this day, he believes that the coating still exists and that it makes cleaning easier. I have detailed the vehicle a couple of times since they got it, I can't say at any point did I notice it being easy to clean, let alone the merest hint of a coating existing on the vehicle, then or now.