Finishing Polish For Soft Paint

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james751993

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Hi everyone,

I decided to do a detail on my black Mitsubishi Lancer today. Started off with a wash, iron x, tar x, and then clay. I didnt want to remove 100% of all defects, I just wanted to remove some light swirls and restore a bit of gloss. I reached for ultimate polish and my DA with a white LC CCS polishing pad. To my surprise the polish hazed the paint ever so slightly and I could make out the trails of the polisher (I thought this was stuck on residue, I tried to remove it with wax and grease remover which is similar to prepsol, and then followed car pro eraser to no effect which tells me that its hazing), I have used this combination before on my mums car with haze-free results. With the same combo of pad and polish I tried different machine speeds, arm speeds and passes to no effect. I then threw on a LC CCS black finishing pad, there was an improvement but the paint was still hazy under my defect spotting light. I then reached for Mothers Pure Polish and repeated the same pad and technique combos and got even more hazing. I have concluded that my paint is indeed soft :(

When it comes to soft paint what finishing polishes and pads do you guys use to achieve a haze-free finish? Any advice would be absolutely fantastic ! :confused:

-James
 
In your case, I would get some Megs 205, apply 4 small pea sized drops of 205 to a clean pad. Then rinse the pad out with some distilled water... just enough to get about 70% of the megs 205 out of the pad. I would take a spray bottle of distiled water and spray a test spot on the vehicle. Then do 6 to 8 section passes with the pad and watered down 205. You may have to mist your wipe-mf with some distilled water as well. In other words, you want to wet-polish the vehicle. I would also tape trim and cover windows with towels as there may be some splatter...

Another thing to check is your Microfiber Towels. Did you wash them COLD Water with a dedicated Micro-Restore detergent? Did you air-fluff dry (low heat). A scratchy old MF could easily cause hazing.
 
Sonax Perfect Finish is known to work on soft finicky paints. And as mentioned above it's important to use great quality mf towels when wipe of residue polish and the LSP. It's also important to not overwork the polish of choice. So 4-5 passes per sections then wipe it off gently. Then a sealant that is known to be easy to wipe off too or a WOWA as wipe of is not needed. A coating would be to consider as well since it's bonds so fast and you level it and get the product residue off. If coating is an option or a coating light as Gyeon CanCoat. A primer polish like carpro essence or if CanCoat the Gyeon Primer would be a great choice to a finishing polish. The benefit is the no need to do a prep wipe before coating if useing a primer polish.
 
I ran into this issue as well.

M205 and UP basically scoured my paint. Tried multiple pressures, speeds, and pads (all 3 megs foam discs, hazed no matter the pad.)

2e264c75b9229b4f0c31db82ce982c61.jpg


The stripe down the middle (excuse my rock chips) was from m205. The after on either side was from Pinnacle Advanced Swirl Remover (Pinnacle Advanced Finishing Polish would work too.) It’s good stuff, and really easy to work with. The diminishing abrasives mean you have to work it for a little longer than I’d like though, so I’d been trying to find a non diminishing polish that I could use in its place.

Mwoywod was nice enough to send me a sample of HD polish+. I don’t have any pictures of the finish after using it, but it also finishes down haze free. Product doesn’t dust, has plenty of working time, and has a great wipe off. Wouldn’t hesitate to recommend this product. It does seem to stain pads, which doesn’t bother me, but it’s probably worth mentioning.

If pad staining bothers you, Griots Garage Perfecting Cream is basically neck and neck with HD polish+, and it smells better IMO.


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Try UP with the black pad again.

This time back off on:

1. The amount of polish.
2. The pad speed. Use just enough to maintain slow rotation.
3. Number of passes. The more passes you do, the more the paint will adhere to the abrasives, and potentially mar the finish.

You also want to maintain firm pressure. Sort of counter intuitive, but these these SMAT polishes are sort of a different animal. I had a very hard time wrapping my head around the concept of polishing to a high gloss with one set of passes, but it makes sense...

The following article is a must read for M205/Ultimate Polish.

Tips to acheive a flawless finish with M205 and a DA polisher
 
Finick said:
I ran into this issue as well.

M205 and UP basically scoured my paint. Tried multiple pressures, speeds, and pads (all 3 megs foam discs, hazed no matter the pad.)

2e264c75b9229b4f0c31db82ce982c61.jpg


The stripe down the middle (excuse my rock chips) was from m205. The after on either side was from Pinnacle Advanced Swirl Remover (Pinnacle Advanced Finishing Polish would work too.) It’s good stuff, and really easy to work with. The diminishing abrasives mean you have to work it for a little longer than I’d like though, so I’d been trying to find a non diminishing polish that I could use in its place.

Mwoywod was nice enough to send me a sample of HD polish+. I don’t have any pictures of the finish after using it, but it also finishes down haze free. Product doesn’t dust, has plenty of working time, and has a great wipe off. Wouldn’t hesitate to recommend this product. It does seem to stain pads, which doesn’t bother me, but it’s probably worth mentioning.

If pad staining bothers you, Griots Garage Perfecting Cream is basically neck and neck with HD polish+, and it smells better IMO.


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Click to expand...

Its annoying considering Ive had great luck on other cars ! :P
In regards to the products you mentioned, did you inspect the finish after it was wiped down with IPA or another oil removing solvent to make sure said oils werent masking the potential hazing??

-James
 
dlc95 said:
Try UP with the black pad again.

This time back off on:

1. The amount of polish.
2. The pad speed. Use just enough to maintain slow rotation.
3. Number of passes. The more passes you do, the more the paint will adhere to the abrasives, and potentially mar the finish.

You also want to maintain firm pressure. Sort of counter intuitive, but these these SMAT polishes are sort of a different animal. I had a very hard time wrapping my head around the concept of polishing to a high gloss with one set of passes, but it makes sense...

The following article is a must read for M205/Ultimate Polish.

Tips to acheive a flawless finish with M205 and a DA polisher
Click to expand...

Great! Thanks for that! Ill be sure to give those techniques a go. If they dont work then Im considering buying either HD polish+ as Finick suggested or menzerna 3500. Anyone tried the menserna polish on soft paint? Ive read it works well.

-James
 
Carpro Reflect has always worked for me with soft sticky paints.
 
james751993 said:
Its annoying considering Ive had great luck on other cars ! :P
In regards to the products you mentioned, did you inspect the finish after it was wiped down with IPA or another oil removing solvent to make sure said oils werent masking the potential hazing??

-James
Click to expand...

For sure, I was super pumped when I got my quart of m205 because I’d seen all the great reviews. My paint was just not havin it. The quart is just sitting on my shelf gathering dust, next to the half full bottle of Ultimate Polish!

I’ve followed all 3 of those polishes with an IPA mix and haven’t seen them hiding the haze at all.

I’ll say that maybe there was a way to get m205 or UP to work on my paint, and someone much more experienced than me could manage, but for me it simply wasn’t worth trying to jump through more hoops than I already had.


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I've made this recommendation for very soft black Porche paint a few times. It has worked great for everyone who has tried it. It's great on extremely soft paint. Optimum HyperPolish on a finishing pad.
 
Probably another which would work well, would be Wolfgang Finishing Glaze.

I've used it, and as others have informed us folks, the "Glaze" name is a misnomer, it is actually an extremely fine last step ultra finishing polish, about the equivalent I believe to Menzerna 3800-4000.
 
MarkD51 said:
Probably another which would work well, would be Wolfgang Finishing Glaze.

I've used it, and as others have informed us folks, the "Glaze" name is a misnomer, it is actually an extremely fine last step ultra finishing polish, about the equivalent I believe to Menzerna 3800-4000.
Click to expand...



With a soft foam finishing pad, this has always worked for me on very soft paints.

And you're correct, it's not a "glaze", that's meaningless word in our industry now days. It's a fine cut polish.


:)
 
Mike Phillips said:
With a soft foam finishing pad, this has always worked for me on very soft paints.

And you're correct, it's not a "glaze", that's meaningless word in our industry now days. It's a fine cut polish.


:)
Click to expand...

If only the name of a product was the same across the board !:p

I will most likely install a coating in the next 2 months or so. Probably CQuartz. :)
 
Did you think of carpro reflect or essence if you are going to a coating ?


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UPDATE: I decided to start my testing with Menzerna SF3500 since it was a product I could get my hands on quickly. Just as soon as my search began it finished. 3500 finished BRILLIANTLY on the paint with zero marring using a LC CCS black finishing pad. From what I have read, 3500 uses diminishing abrasives so I experimented with amount of passes and machine speed. The best method to remove most blemishes was 4 speed on the polisher and 5 passes over the section.
Thank you to everyone for their input. :)

-James
 
james751993 said:
UPDATE: I decided to start my testing with Menzerna SF3500 since it was a product I could get my hands on quickly. Just as soon as my search began it finished. 3500 finished BRILLIANTLY on the paint with zero marring using a LC CCS black finishing pad. From what I have read, 3500 uses diminishing abrasives so I experimented with amount of passes and machine speed. The best method to remove most blemishes was 4 speed on the polisher and 5 passes over the section.
Thank you to everyone for their input. :)

-James
Click to expand...

Great to hear that you got it sorted out.
 
james751993 said:
UPDATE: I decided to start my testing with Menzerna SF3500 since it was a product I could get my hands on quickly. Just as soon as my search began it finished. 3500 finished BRILLIANTLY on the paint with zero marring using a LC CCS black finishing pad. From what I have read, 3500 uses diminishing abrasives so I experimented with amount of passes and machine speed. The best method to remove most blemishes was 4 speed on the polisher and 5 passes over the section.
Thank you to everyone for their input. :)

-James
Click to expand...

Very happy that you have gotten the results you were seeking, that's good news.

I'm very sorry and apologize to you, that when I followed along, and responded to you here, I never looked to the left and noted your location. My fault, not yours.

That due to location, it may not have been an easy matter getting detailing supplies from the USA. I'm hoping my mention of Menzerna and comparing the Wolfgang products to them that a light went on and that you then knew what to seek for a Polish to get the job done.

It is my understanding that the Wolfgang Polishes are indeed made by Menzerna, perhaps from their USA located Facility, and/or marketed for the USA.

I'm not sure how many other PBMG house brand's products and Polishes may be made by them, but I can attest that all their product lines are totally first class in every way.

Best of luck!
 
MarkD51 said:
Very happy that you have gotten the results you were seeking, that's good news.

I'm very sorry and apologize to you, that when I followed along, and responded to you here, I never looked to the left and noted your location. My fault, not yours.

That due to location, it may not have been an easy matter getting detailing supplies from the USA. I'm hoping my mention of Menzerna and comparing the Wolfgang products to them that a light went on and that you then knew what to seek for a Polish to get the job done.

It is my understanding that the Wolfgang Polishes are indeed made by Menzerna, perhaps from their USA located Facility, and/or marketed for the USA.

I'm not sure how many other PBMG house brand's products and Polishes may be made by them, but I can attest that all their product lines are totally first class in every way.

Best of luck!
Click to expand...

Nah, no offence taken mate your suggestion solved my issue. :)
We do have a few suppliers here that can get products that PBMG stock. I went with Menzerna as the supplier had a shopfront that was close to my home. For some reason I cant find a supplier for SF3800, even on the Menserna Australia website it makes no mention of it. I would have preferred SF3800 in following the 'use the least aggressive method to get the job done' but only SF3500 is available locally. Maybe I'll order some off Autogeek once my shopping list grows to make the shipping cost worth it.

-James
 
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