Flex 3401 - First time user

[Demonizer]

Well... I finally got to use my Flex 3401 DA. As a newbie to this kind of detailing/paint correction - I thought I would share my experience along with a couple questions on what I learned using my Flex 3401. I have never used any kind of DA polisher or specialty compounds - just auto parts store cleaners & was - hand applied.

First - why I chose the Flex 3402 - It had the best reviews, and I thought there was something to the forced rotation DA, also I thought my paint was worse than it was (so I found out when I used it) - Forced rotation just made more sense to me.

I was procrastinating using it because it was bigger & heaver that I thought it would be, and I thought its was overkill for me & I would wreck my paint or something. This is absolutely a professional tool for rigorous use - way more that a hobbyist like me would really need - I even thought about returning it for a smaller Griots or something - but I kept it - waiting for the right time to use it.

My car is a 1967 Mustang I built - took 4 years. Paint is all PPG Deltron base & 2021 clear - and its BLACK!

Was cut buffed out nice & flat. After I put the car back together I had been leaning on it & wiping it down with regular towels (before I learned about Microfiber) which marred up the finish pretty good. Not to mention all my car buddies & the "use an old cotton diaper, or soft terry cloth towels" well, these leave plenty of scratches. Now I have an arsenal of MF towels from Microfiber Madness on down.

Couple weeks ago I was up North at a 3 day car show where it rained all three days and I had to dry it off with the hotel towels - YUP - I said the hotel towels - YIKES - so, the paint was in bad shape with swirls & towel scratches you can see a mile away -

So its time to fix all that - out comes the Flex.

I got all the color pads in the LC Hybrid 5" lineup - 2 of each, except the white pad where I got 6 of those - most reviews on AG said the white was the most "universal" pad that I would probably use the most.

Products are Wolfgang Uber Compound, Total Swirl Remover, Finishing Glaze, and the Deep Gloss Paint Sealant - all 3.0

After reading many, many posts & watching Mikes videos, I started with the least aggressive combo I thought might work - White pad & TSR.

STEP 1 -
Did a test section - Flex on speed 3, White Pad, TSR - WOW! 4 passes with just the weight of the Flex got rid of 95% of all defects - that was awesome.

The Flex was very easy to use, easy to control and smooth with very little vibration. I worked the paint for 7 hours straight with no hand fatigue. Glad I kept it - and now I would not trade it for anything.

So now 95% of all the defects are gone. Rather than go after the last little scratch in my test area, I wanted to complete the whole process to see how it really works and to what degree the first step of compounding really needs to be for a car I like to drive allot & will most certainly get regular usage defects in it again.

The uber compound did not seem necessary.

So - on to STEP 2 - Polish
First I used a black (no cut) pad with the Glaze, speed 3. didn't seem to make a very noticeable change.
So, I tried the White pad again on speed 3 - WOW! The paint really came alive and cleared up even more of the defects & "haze" left from the TSR. - Great! - So now I would say it was hard to find any defects at all.

STEP 3 - Seal
Black Pad, Sealant, Speed 3. Very easy to apply

waited 45 min.

VERY Easy to remove - which was GREAT - after removing the TSR & Polish steps, it was a nice relief to be able to re,oce the Sealant so easily.

End Result - AMAZING. Yes, there are a couple of random light scratches left - but nothing anyone will find, and the overall look of the car is amazing,

Went to the car show tonight & everyone thought I got a fresh paint job - was more comments about how pefrect my paint is than usual - so yes - it was a huge improvement that anyone can notice. - even without chasing every last scratch.

Now, some Questions for the experience guys.

1) During the compounding step with the TSR - I started to get swirl marks left from the DA. I traced my progression of the little 2x2 panels I was working on & found that when I had the FLEX on speed 5, with light pressure applied - it left the swirls. If I worded a few passes at Speed 5 with some light pressure applied, THEN switch to Speed 3, with 3 passes & no pressure but the weight of the Flex - no swirls - just incredibly smooth & clear black - Does this sound right?

2) Step 2 - Polishing. The black pad did not yield much of a change/result. Using the White pad on speed 3 made a very noticeable change in the finish, and worked out any hazing left from Step 1 - really got the the depth & clarity back. Guessing the Polish needs either a harder pad and/or a lightly aggressive pad (like the White) to work the paint?

Well - there you have it.

The Flex 3401 very hight recommended - and easy to use!

to anyone who posted things about the Flex, pads and/or Wolfgang products - THANKS - I probably ready your post!

 

[Moldavite]

Good topic

 

[Rsurfer]

:xyxthumbs:

Well... I finally got to use my Flex 3401 DA. As a newbie to this kind of detailing/paint correction - I thought I would share my experience along with a couple questions on what I learned using my Flex 3401. I have never used any kind of DA polisher or specialty compounds - just auto parts store cleaners & was - hand applied.

First - why I chose the Flex 3402 - It had the best reviews, and I thought there was something to the forced rotation DA, also I thought my paint was worse than it was (so I found out when I used it) - Forced rotation just made more sense to me.

I was procrastinating using it because it was bigger & heaver that I thought it would be, and I thought its was overkill for me & I would wreck my paint or something. This is absolutely a professional tool for rigorous use - way more that a hobbyist like me would really need - I even thought about returning it for a smaller Griots or something - but I kept it - waiting for the right time to use it.

My car is a 1967 Mustang I built - took 4 years. Paint is all PPG Deltron base & 2021 clear - and its BLACK!

Was cut buffed out nice & flat. After I put the car back together I had been leaning on it & wiping it down with regular towels (before I learned about Microfiber) which marred up the finish pretty good. Not to mention all my car buddies & the "use an old cotton diaper, or soft terry cloth towels" well, these leave plenty of scratches. Now I have an arsenal of MF towels from Microfiber Madness on down.

Couple weeks ago I was up North at a 3 day car show where it rained all three days and I had to dry it off with the hotel towels - YUP - I said the hotel towels - YIKES - so, the paint was in bad shape with swirls & towel scratches you can see a mile away -

So its time to fix all that - out comes the Flex.

I got all the color pads in the LC Hybrid 5" lineup - 2 of each, except the white pad where I got 6 of those - most reviews on AG said the white was the most "universal" pad that I would probably use the most.

Products are Wolfgang Uber Compound, Total Swirl Remover, Finishing Glaze, and the Deep Gloss Paint Sealant - all 3.0

After reading many, many posts & watching Mikes videos, I started with the least aggressive combo I thought might work - White pad & TSR.

STEP 1 -
Did a test section - Flex on speed 3, White Pad, TSR - WOW! 4 passes with just the weight of the Flex got rid of 95% of all defects - that was awesome.

The Flex was very easy to use, easy to control and smooth with very little vibration. I worked the paint for 7 hours straight with no hand fatigue. Glad I kept it - and now I would not trade it for anything.

So now 95% of all the defects are gone. Rather than go after the last little scratch in my test area, I wanted to complete the whole process to see how it really works and to what degree the first step of compounding really needs to be for a car I like to drive allot & will most certainly get regular usage defects in it again.

The uber compound did not seem necessary.

So - on to STEP 2 - Polish
First I used a black (no cut) pad with the Glaze, speed 3. didn't seem to make a very noticeable change.
So, I tried the White pad again on speed 3 - WOW! The paint really came alive and cleared up even more of the defects & "haze" left from the TSR. - Great! - So now I would say it was hard to find any defects at all.

STEP 3 - Seal
Black Pad, Sealant, Speed 3. Very easy to apply

waited 45 min.

VERY Easy to remove - which was GREAT - after removing the TSR & Polish steps, it was a nice relief to be able to re,oce the Sealant so easily.

End Result - AMAZING. Yes, there are a couple of random light scratches left - but nothing anyone will find, and the overall look of the car is amazing,

Went to the car show tonight & everyone thought I got a fresh paint job - was more comments about how pefrect my paint is than usual - so yes - it was a huge improvement that anyone can notice. - even without chasing every last scratch.

Now, some Questions for the experience guys.

1) During the compounding step with the TSR - I started to get swirl marks left from the DA. I traced my progression of the little 2x2 panels I was working on & found that when I had the FLEX on speed 5, with light pressure applied - it left the swirls. If I worded a few passes at Speed 5 with some light pressure applied, THEN switch to Speed 3, with 3 passes & no pressure but the weight of the Flex - no swirls - just incredibly smooth & clear black - Does this sound right? Yes

2) Step 2 - Polishing. The black pad did not yield much of a change/result. Using the White pad on speed 3 made a very noticeable change in the finish, and worked out any hazing left from Step 1 - really got the the depth & clarity back. Guessing the Polish needs either a harder pad and/or a lightly aggressive pad (like the White) to work the paint? That's why you bought so many white pads.

Well - there you have it.

The Flex 3401 very hight recommended - and easy to use!

to anyone who posted things about the Flex, pads and/or Wolfgang products - THANKS - I probably ready your post!

 

[Don M]

Welcome to the world of the power buffer, you'll never go by hand again (unless you want to apply an LSP that way for nostalgia, which I do sometimes).

 

[Corey@OptimalDetailing]

Now, some Questions for the experience guys.

1) During the compounding step with the TSR - I started to get swirl marks left from the DA. I traced my progression of the little 2x2 panels I was working on & found that when I had the FLEX on speed 5, with light pressure applied - it left the swirls. If I worded a few passes at Speed 5 with some light pressure applied, THEN switch to Speed 3, with 3 passes & no pressure but the weight of the Flex - no swirls - just incredibly smooth & clear black - Does this sound right?

2) Step 2 - Polishing. The black pad did not yield much of a change/result. Using the White pad on speed 3 made a very noticeable change in the finish, and worked out any hazing left from Step 1 - really got the the depth & clarity back. Guessing the Polish needs either a harder pad and/or a lightly aggressive pad (like the White) to work the paint?

Well - there you have it.

The Flex 3401 very hight recommended - and easy to use!

to anyone who posted things about the Flex, pads and/or Wolfgang products - THANKS - I probably ready your post!

1) Sounds absolutely correct. Slowing the speed down and letting the compound go ahead and finish down more (and better), you're allowing the finishing abrasives to take the time to do their job. In the end, leaving a better finish. Not that you're spending MUCH more time doing 3 additional passes at a slower speed, I have never tested and done more than 2 additional passes. I have never seen a need, try that next time and see if 2 additional passes will finish down the same. Saving time is saving time!

2) I go through more of the white pad than any. Probably why I have 2x as many of those than I do my other hybrids.

And very happy that you didn't let the Flex intimidate you any more! It is a larger and heavier machine, but once you flick it on that first time and see how smooth it is, it fits the bill just perfect.

 

[Denali-ws6]

Great informative post!! I am in the same predicament as you. I wanted the flex but because of the price, and the fact I was only going to work on a few cars, I was thinking a PC or griots garage, but you pushed me over the edge to buy the flex...haha.

Thanks for your post.

Brian

 

[Garyhw48]

Demonizer,

I think you've just about got it. Yesterday I used mine for about 6 hours with Hydro-Tech pads. Started with WG Uber and a Tangerine medium pad. Wasn't getting the results I wanted. Switched to the Blue aggressive pad and perfect results. Cleaned with cotton towel between each section and primed the pads. Switched to the Tangerine pad for the Finishing Glaze, also perfect. Put the sealant on with the soft Red finishing pad.

What I'm getting at is I've watched all of Mike Phillips videos so many times I think I have them memorized.

Like he says, the right pad, the right product, the right speed and cleaning and priming the pads are the key to getting the results that he gets and it's obvious that he gets excellent results.

I've learned more from him in the last year than I learned in the previous fifty on my own. I am so glad for you, I wouldn't give up my Flex either.

 

[Mike@DedicatedPerfection]

Well... I finally got to use my Flex 3401 DA. As a newbie to this kind of detailing/paint correction - I thought I would share my experience along with a couple questions on what I learned using my Flex 3401. I have never used any kind of DA polisher or specialty compounds - just auto parts store cleaners & was - hand applied.

Right on! :dblthumb2:

First - why I chose the Flex 3402 - It had the best reviews, and I thought there was something to the forced rotation DA, also I thought my paint was worse than it was (so I found out when I used it) - Forced rotation just made more sense to me.

Forced rotation is the way to go IMHO. No matter what amount of downward pressure or curvy panels you through at it, the 3401 will continue to spin.

I was procrastinating using it because it was bigger & heaver that I thought it would be, and I thought its was overkill for me & I would wreck my paint or something. This is absolutely a professional tool for rigorous use - way more that a hobbyist like me would really need - I even thought about returning it for a smaller Griots or something - but I kept it - waiting for the right time to use it.

It may be bigger and heavier than a PC, but as mentioned it is a professional tool built for full time usage. This is the way the Germans build things. Quality is paramount

My car is a 1967 Mustang I built - took 4 years. Paint is all PPG Deltron base & 2021 clear - and its BLACK!

Was cut buffed out nice & flat. After I put the car back together I had been leaning on it & wiping it down with regular towels (before I learned about Microfiber) which marred up the finish pretty good. Not to mention all my car buddies & the "use an old cotton diaper, or soft terry cloth towels" well, these leave plenty of scratches. Now I have an arsenal of MF towels from Microfiber Madness on down.

Couple weeks ago I was up North at a 3 day car show where it rained all three days and I had to dry it off with the hotel towels - YUP - I said the hotel towels - YIKES - so, the paint was in bad shape with swirls & towel scratches you can see a mile away -

:nomore:

So its time to fix all that - out comes the Flex.

I got all the color pads in the LC Hybrid 5" lineup - 2 of each, except the white pad where I got 6 of those - most reviews on AG said the white was the most "universal" pad that I would probably use the most.

Products are Wolfgang Uber Compound, Total Swirl Remover, Finishing Glaze, and the Deep Gloss Paint Sealant - all 3.0

After reading many, many posts & watching Mikes videos, I started with the least aggressive combo I thought might work - White pad & TSR.

STEP 1 -
Did a test section - Flex on speed 3, White Pad, TSR - WOW! 4 passes with just the weight of the Flex got rid of 95% of all defects - that was awesome.

The Flex was very easy to use, easy to control and smooth with very little vibration. I worked the paint for 7 hours straight with no hand fatigue. Glad I kept it - and now I would not trade it for anything.

So now 95% of all the defects are gone. Rather than go after the last little scratch in my test area, I wanted to complete the whole process to see how it really works and to what degree the first step of compounding really needs to be for a car I like to drive allot & will most certainly get regular usage defects in it again.

The uber compound did not seem necessary.

So - on to STEP 2 - Polish
First I used a black (no cut) pad with the Glaze, speed 3. didn't seem to make a very noticeable change.
So, I tried the White pad again on speed 3 - WOW! The paint really came alive and cleared up even more of the defects & "haze" left from the TSR. - Great! - So now I would say it was hard to find any defects at all.

STEP 3 - Seal
Black Pad, Sealant, Speed 3. Very easy to apply

waited 45 min.

VERY Easy to remove - which was GREAT - after removing the TSR & Polish steps, it was a nice relief to be able to re,oce the Sealant so easily.

End Result - AMAZING. Yes, there are a couple of random light scratches left - but nothing anyone will find, and the overall look of the car is amazing,

Went to the car show tonight & everyone thought I got a fresh paint job - was more comments about how pefrect my paint is than usual - so yes - it was a huge improvement that anyone can notice. - even without chasing every last scratch.

Outstanding. Glad to hear of your feedback. Where are the pictures?

Now, some Questions for the experience guys.

1) During the compounding step with the TSR - I started to get swirl marks left from the DA. I traced my progression of the little 2x2 panels I was working on & found that when I had the FLEX on speed 5, with light pressure applied - it left the swirls. If I worded a few passes at Speed 5 with some light pressure applied, THEN switch to Speed 3, with 3 passes & no pressure but the weight of the Flex - no swirls - just incredibly smooth & clear black - Does this sound right?

2) Step 2 - Polishing. The black pad did not yield much of a change/result. Using the White pad on speed 3 made a very noticeable change in the finish, and worked out any hazing left from Step 1 - really got the the depth & clarity back. Guessing the Polish needs either a harder pad and/or a lightly aggressive pad (like the White) to work the paint?

Well - there you have it.

The Flex 3401 very hight recommended - and easy to use!

to anyone who posted things about the Flex, pads and/or Wolfgang products - THANKS - I probably ready your post!

1. Sounds right. With the Wolfgang products you should be in the 6 section pass range to allow the abrasives to fully break down.

2. Yes. If the pad is to soft such as the black Hybrids, it won't allow the polish to be broken down effectively. Wolfgang FG is matched pretty well to the characteristics of the white Hybrid.

 

[Kenny94]

Great thread!

1. Sounds right. With the Wolfgang products you should be in the 6 section pass range to allow the abrasives to fully break down.

Thanks Mike.

 

[Demonizer]

Well Guys,

Thanks for all the replies

Indeed it was a lot of fun doing the paint correction and watching the results happen right in front of me - almost exactly on par with Mikes videos and with direct relevance to all the posts I read & studied on AG Forum before I started.

Yes, the Flex 3402 is an awesome DA and MUCH easier to use than it looks like it would be when you first pick it up - soend the extra & get it over any other DA. Even for someone like myself where I only do my hot rod maybe twice a year depending on how long I can keep it scratch free!

----
1. Sounds right. With the Wolfgang products you should be in the 6 section pass range to allow the abrasives to fully break down.

2. Yes. If the pad is to soft such as the black Hybrids, it won't allow the polish to be broken down effectively. Wolfgang FG is matched pretty well to the characteristics of the white Hybrid.
----

GREAT - thanks for the conformation - also, nice to know about the 6 section pass to work down the abrasives. I knew that the WG products used diminishing abrasives,thats one of the big reasons I chose WG - less chance of screwing up as it will break down before its cuts to much, But , being a new guy to detailing wasn't really sure how to best utilize that technology - I just made passes until it felt about right - usually around 4-6. I will ensure at least 6 passes from now on - Thanks.

The WITE Pad - yes, I really like that white pad - it seemed to work the best for the TSR & FG & now I know why!
I really don't care to chase down every last "RIDS" (small scratches?). As much as I would probably like to take that challenge, removing 95% of the defects yielded AMAZING results for a driven car. Now if I only towed it to shows in an enclosed trailer I would remove every last scratch - but then you cant drive... so where is the fun in that!
I run the Autocross as well with this car as well as show it, so it will get some more defects as time goes anyway.

-----
Outstanding. Glad to hear of your feedback. Where are the pictures?
-----------

It was hard to get befor & after pics close enough to see the detailing - but I attached some



HOW DO I CLEAN the PADS??

CLEANING WHILE POLISHING
I rotated between two white pads when working each phase (TSR & FG) as I read that they will heat up & its better to have a cool pad? however, even with constant use, the Flex got warm at the top aluminum part but the pads really didn't. I still rotated the pads about every 3rd section just to be safe. But I was mostly on speed 3.

After each section, I do a "clean on the fly" technique with a terry cloth towel - a modified version. When I first tried it, the Flex grabbed the towel & spun in into a big knot faster that I could say "Oh S#*"! now I lay the towel out on the table & just rub the pad against he towel with some downward pressure - with the FLex OFF! Then a quick scrape with the included pad brush.

CLEANING WHEN FINISHED
I got some WG Polishing Pad Rejuvenator with the Flex 3401 WG System/Kit I bought.
All the pads were fairly easy to clean except the black pad with the WG Sealer.
The Sealer just wont clean out, & makes everything (my hands) very slippery & is hard to wash off (perhaps a good testament to the durability of the stuff) but how do you clean the sealer out of the pad?

WHAT I DID:
after use -
- Sprayed them with the WG Spray pad cleaner (came in the kit)
- Squeezed the pad out
- dipped the pad in water
- Squeezed it again
- scrapped the surface with my fingernails
- Repeated that process until the water was mostly clear to all pads (except the black sealer pad - it just got "gummy" & never cleaned out)

Then I made a 1 gal solution of the WG pad rejuvenator & soaked all the pads overnight.

Then I rinsed them all, dried them by rolling them in a towel & squeezing

All came out good except the black sealer pad.

QUESTIONS:
- how do I clean the sealer out of the black pad

- After first use & cleaning, the white pads dont feel quite as firm/stiff as the remaining new white pads I have. Is that normal, and, will they continue to work as they did before? Did I ruin them?

 

[xabo]

Y"es, the Flex 3402 is an awesome DA and MUCH easier to use than it looks like it would be when you first pick it up."

I take it you mean the Flex 3401?

 

[Kenny94]

QUESTIONS:
- how do I clean the sealer out of the black pad

- After first use & cleaning, the white pads dont feel quite as firm/stiff as the remaining new white pads I have. Is that normal, and, will they continue to work as they did before? Did I ruin them

That's a good thing. With WG Paint Sealant 3.0 there will always will have some left over polymers. Shows you how strong the bonding is. Just used this pad for your sealant needs for your next job. After you wash your pad.

As for the feel of the pad after you wash it...Nothing feels like a new pad after it's used one time.

 

[Demonizer]

Yup - Flex 3401

And I agree - the black pad I used for Paint Sealant is just for that - cant get it all out, so its a dedicated pad.

 

[campngolf]

Impressive write-up. As a newb it's good to hear how other "non-professionals" go through the step and get great results.