Help with 21ft 1991 Bayliner Trophy Boat Hardtop

Ohio Detailing

Ohio Detailing

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Hiya fellas,

Looks like I'm about to make my foray into boat detailing--and how! As you can tell by my thread title, it's a 21 foot 1991 Bayliner Trophy Boat with a hardtop.

Here are some of the aspects pertaining to the boat that the client shared with me on the phone today:
  • The Gel Coat is dull and hazy
  • Gel coat is not terribly neglected, and doesn't have any obvious signs of severe age, swirls, or chips
  • The botton hull portion of the boat is VERY dull and in need of extreme attention (he believes this is because it's the portion that sits in the water and has a special coating on it to resist the elements)
  • He tried a test-spot, by hand, with 3M's "Marine Restorer & Wax" and was highly impressed by the results -- but is certain that for such a large vessel the boat would need to be tended to entirely by machine (I have a FLEX and a Makita)

So, with those little doodads in your noggin... hows about we tackle a couple questions to get my "sailing" in the right direction as I enter the realm of watercraft refinement, please:
  1. What product, or products (since I'll likely have to do a two phase polish/sealant) is ideal and time-tested as a proven performer in the aquatic world of gel-coats? (I know there is never a "best" product - I've been doing this for over a decade - but what would yield amazing cleaning and polishing/glossing results in one, or two steps with regards to a boat?
  2. What RPM should I use while polishing?
  3. For boats over 20 feet and with a hardtop, what is a usual approximation of a quote for just the exterior, and the exterior AND interior?
  4. Will I need a special sealant or wax to apply after compounding/polishing?
  5. Lastly, what type of pad(s) should I use? I have all types of foam, but can purchase some other materials if necessary

I imagine the project to be similar to: THIS from the description on the phone (he does not own a phone so he cannot MMS) I am also attaching an image to this post for reference.

A thousand thank yous!! I'm very excited to apply the techniques and methods from motorcycles and motorcars over to the boat crowd, mateys! Ahoy.
 
Bump, PLEASE!

I told the owner I'd have a quote to him BY TODAY! Please lend a hand.
 
Another bump for another new day... whew, today was a long one, doing a three-day detail on a 2014 Cadillac - looking so fine!

SO... ideas/ranges for a two-phase polish on a 21ft hard-top trophy boat?
 
I'm no expert but this is what I use:

To remove heavy to medium oxidation use your Makita Rotary with 7.5" twisted wool pads and a water based compound (Farecla Profile 200 / Aqua Buff 1000 / Presta Supercut) first. If water based compound not working use a petroleum based compound (Fountain of Youth - Vibra Cut / Megs Heavy Cut / 3M). Twisted Wool and heavy cut compound will leave swirl marks. Rotary speed approx 1800 to 2200 rpm for heavy cutting.

To remove light oxidation or first step swirl marks use a blended wool/lambs wool/heavy to medium cut foam pad to create a good shine. Use lighter grit compound in same series as first pass. Rotary speed 1400 to 1800 rpm for light polishing.

Last pass I use a polymer sealant or a Carnuba wax (Collinite) - lots of options available. Apply by hand (sealants) or DA on slow speed (wax).
 
Thanks fellas!

primo spaghetti said:
use aquabuff 1000 and 2000 on a rotary with wool.
Click to expand...

Sounds easy enough... I'll look into Aquabuff, obviously I've never heard of it since we're concentrated the area of our business focus on motorcars and bikes over the years - but this is another ecessary layer for business growth.

  • Do any waxes or specialty products need to be applied after the two-stage compound and polish?

Chase_910 said:
I'm no expert but this is what I use:

To remove heavy to medium oxidation use your Makita Rotary with 7.5" twisted wool pads and a water based compound (Farecla Profile 200 / Aqua Buff 1000 / Presta Supercut) first. If water based compound not working use a petroleum based compound (Fountain of Youth - Vibra Cut / Megs Heavy Cut / 3M). Twisted Wool and heavy cut compound will leave swirl marks. Rotary speed approx 1800 to 2200 rpm for heavy cutting.

To remove light oxidation or first step swirl marks use a blended wool/lambs wool/heavy to medium cut foam pad to create a good shine. Use lighter grit compound in same series as first pass. Rotary speed 1400 to 1800 rpm for light polishing.

Last pass I use a polymer sealant or a Carnuba wax (Collinite) - lots of options available. Apply by hand (sealants) or DA on slow speed (wax).
Click to expand...

VERY NICE!! Thanks Chase :) So that answers my question from above, pertaining to a traditional LSP needed on a gel coat finish. So your system above requires a Makita (great, I have that) and some wool pads... looks like I'm ready to go aside from the products themselves.

Thanks for the help, the RPM speed was insightful.

So... do these nautical gel coat finishes haze or hologram like clear-coats?
 
Ohio Detailing said:
VERY NICE!! Thanks Chase :) So that answers my question from above, pertaining to a traditional LSP needed on a gel coat finish. So your system above requires a Makita (great, I have that) and some wool pads... looks like I'm ready to go aside from the products themselves.

Thanks for the help, the RPM speed was insightful.

So... do these nautical gel coat finishes haze or hologram like clear-coats?
Click to expand...

I'm getting ready to make my order... what size bottles am I looking for in order to polish an entire 21 foot hardtop Bayliner trophy boat?

:buffing:

Would any of these be ideal, if the boat only has light to medium oxidation?
1. Marine 31 All-In-One Gel Coat Polish and Wax, all in one boat polish wax, boat cleaner wax
2. Marine 31 Gel Coat Gloss and Color Restorer, marine compound, gel coat oxidation remover, fiberglass restorer
3. Meguiars #50 Marine/RV Cleaner Wax is a polish and wax in one for your fiberglass, gel-coated boat or RV.
4. 3M Marine Restorer & Wax, boat polish and wax, boat wax, fiberglass restorer, gel coat polish
5. Collinite Fiberglass Boat Cleaner #920

It isn't severe enough to need a heavy cut, and I'm having issues finding Aqua Buff 1000 on AutoGeek.

THANKS :)
 
My AG order won't arrive until later this week, so is there anything that can be used to polish the gelcoat that I may have on hand from auto use... And/or anything decent that can be store bought?
 
Anything you may have for a car will work on marine gelcoat finishes. Gelcoat is extremely durable and takes a little more work due to the usual inability to wash and wax while in the water all year and in my experience people don't seem to do much maintenance on the outside of their boats. I use chemical guys phase v compound /polish followed by jetseal on the boats I do. If I have any trouble with misc spots I will pull out a heavier cut compound but mostly keeping da pads clean is the most important. On boats your pads typically get a bit funky faster than working a car.
 
Also if they keep the boat in the water the need to do a good bottom paint from the water line down. Otherwise the hull will overtime absorb water and start cracking on the gelcoat. That's how it is here for me in a freshwater situation.
 
Also I use orange css pads on my da for heavy oxidation and a pink css for well maintained cleaner boats. As for pricing the local standard here is 12 dollars a foot for the hull and 6 a foot for the top side just polishing and wax or sealant. That's for your typical 36ft or smaller boats. Anything with a fly bridge or much larger top side is priced on a per job basis.


I'm no expert on detailing just a hobby mostly and some side work but I've never walked away from a boat that the owner wasn't very impressed by my work.
 
Trutech74 said:
Anything you may have for a car will work on marine gelcoat finishes. Gelcoat is extremely durable and takes a little more work due to the usual inability to wash and wax while in the water all year and in my experience people don't seem to do much maintenance on the outside of their boats. I use chemical guys phase v compound /polish followed by jetseal on the boats I do. If I have any trouble with misc spots I will pull out a heavier cut compound but mostly keeping da pads clean is the most important. On boats your pads typically get a bit funky faster than working a car.
Click to expand...

Thanks Trutech,

AutoGeek took a long, long time shipping my items for some reason (and some still have not arrived -- back-ordered now), so by the time the order arrived that client was long gone. It ended up costing us in the end, we explained our newest shipment had not arrived as expected.

I also called and spoke directly with whomever answers the phone at Menzerna, and they told me my 1500 would work perfectly on the white clear coat. Well, it didn't... and actually ended up staining the clear coat since their product is black. That took a while to remove.

Really odd and uncharacteristically bad service from both organizations in total.
 
Ohio Detailing said:
Thanks Trutech,

AutoGeek took a long, long time shipping my items for some reason (and some still have not arrived -- back-ordered now), so by the time the order arrived that client was long gone. It ended up costing us in the end, we explained our newest shipment had not arrived as expected.

I also called and spoke directly with whomever answers the phone at Menzerna, and they told me my 1500 would work perfectly on the white clear coat. Well, it didn't... and actually ended up staining the clear coat since their product is black. That took a while to remove.

Really odd and uncharacteristically bad service from both organizations in total.
Click to expand...

see post 4;

aquabuff is white. white doesn't stain porosity.
 
primo spaghetti said:
see post 4;

aquabuff is white. white doesn't stain porosity.
Click to expand...

see post 13;

Unfortunately my order didn't even ship for nearly a week after I placed it, let alone arrive... so although I ordered some of AG's Marine 31 products (I couldn't find AquaBuff on AG's site), I was left with what I had on hand, which Menzerna assured me would be perfectly fine.
 
no sir, the black pigment is not the best or ideal product.

gel is full of microscopic pinholes called porosity. always try and stay with white polishes/compounds where possible.

Aquabuff is readily available, but agreed, not on AG.

do yourself a favour, if youre going to be getting into boats, and if you only take one piece of advice from me, aquabuff and a rotary are the way to do a boat.
 
primo spaghetti said:
no sir, the black pigment is not the best or ideal product.

gel is full of microscopic pinholes called porosity. always try and stay with white polishes/compounds where possible.

Aquabuff is readily available, but agreed, not on AG.
Click to expand...

Tell Menzerna that :(

I actually questioned their advice on the phone, right from the client's driveway... it was kind of awkward, and the person who answered the phone at Menzerna seemed a little perturbed and rude. That's alright though, there are PLENTY of other options out there for my next order, I don't have to stay with a company that doles out incorrect advice and costs businesses money and time.
 
primo spaghetti said:
no sir, the black pigment is not the best or ideal product.

gel is full of microscopic pinholes called porosity. always try and stay with white polishes/compounds where possible.

Aquabuff is readily available, but agreed, not on AG.

do yourself a favour, if youre going to be getting into boats, and if you only take one piece of advice from me, aquabuff and a rotary are the way to do a boat.
Click to expand...

Hmm interesting to know. No products I have ever used are black so I've never ran into that issue myself thankfully.
 
when i worked in the boat building industry, we moved away from Megs #4 (i think thats what it was) because it was a beige colour compound, and the polish, was a browner colour. it was a bugger to get out of the porosity. when we made the move to aquabuff it was unreal the difference, and the less cleanup we had was great.

i may have said it somewhere else before, but we were building million plus dollar yachts (Neptunus) so anyone should be happy with the products we were using at the factory.

The closest comparison, (again not on AG as of yet) is the Scholl concepts line of marine polishes and compounds. someone has got to get the ear of a purchaser and expand the scholl line, and heck, even bring in the Aqua Buff.
 
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