M105 Caking Up?

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Mirror Detailing

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Lately, M105 has just been getting on my nerves. I have been having it cake up more and more on me and am curious as to why its happening. I can only assume its from lack of moisture in the compound. But after yesterday I am fed up with 105. When I was working on this yesterday...

I would apply 105 in a nice 2x2 area, and within 5-10 secs of me turning around and grabbing the buffer it would have already caked up, to where if you ran your finger through it, it was almost dust.


caking.jpg


It did the same for 205, just not near as bad. So I tried different chemicals, and 3M 3000 Machine Polish did not seem to have a problem, or Menzerma Super Finish hor even with Ultimate Compound by hand.

Any idea why this would be happening. I figured maybe the severe oxidation in the paint, but its also happened on other vehicles I have done, that are in better condition. Now not near as bad, but enough to where I would put a coat down to buff, and then spritz it with water before buffing to get it to work in correctly.
 
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What was the temp outside? Have you kept the polish in extreme heat for storage? How old is it?
 
CEE DOG said:
What was the temp outside? Have you kept the polish in extreme heat for storage? How old is it?
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Considered these things as well... Temp was about 50-55 degree's, polish is stored in my garage in a shaded area when not used., and its only about a month old.
 
I've had this happen nearly everytime I've used M105. I, too, have to spritz it with water just to be able to work it. Very frustrating.

Colin
 
Looks like you were working outside. If you use too much or outside and and spread it around it will dry out like that. Also when you spread it out the air from the buffer will dry it out. You are going to have to make adjustments to the amount you use, also looking at the picture you are spreading it around too much so it is going to dry up.
 
I can think of a couple things happening. 1 your pad had to much compound on it causing it to cake up. 2 if you are using a rotary or a flex da your letting the product get to hot causing it to cake up.

Those are the only 2 things I can think of if you are working in the shade.
 
ASPHALT ROCKET said:
Looks like you were working outside. If you use too much or outside and and spread it around it will dry out like that. Also when you spread it out the air from the buffer will dry it out. You are going to have to make adjustments to the amount you use, also looking at the picture you are spreading it around too much so it is going to dry up.
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Was not working outside. Also thought about the amount and to thin drying out fast from the buffer. Then also thought about like you said applying to little, so even tried the same amount in a smaller area and got the same affect.

sullysdetailing said:
I can think of a couple things happening. 1 your pad had to much compound on it causing it to cake up. 2 if you are using a rotary or a flex da your letting the product get to hot causing it to cake up.

Those are the only 2 things I can think of if you are working in the shade.
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1. this picture was taken on the first buff after I ran the brush over the pad cleaning it out. 2. this was buffed at 1500 rpms and 1 pass, so not even time or pressure to heat the compound/paint up
 
Mirror Detailing said:
Was not working outside. Also thought about the amount and to thin drying out fast from the buffer. Then also thought about like you said applying to little, so even tried the same amount in a smaller area and got the same affect.



1. this picture was taken on the first buff after I ran the brush over the pad cleaning it out. 2. this was buffed at 1500 rpms and 1 pass, so not even time or pressure to heat the compound/paint up
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Try a different bottle of 105 you could of got a bad bottle. The only time this has happened to me was what I posted before.
 
Mirror Detailing said:
Lately, M105 has just been getting on my nerves. I have been having it cake up more and more on me and am curious as to why its happening. I can only assume its from lack of moisture in the compound.
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Don't feel too bad, I've experienced the same problem. I almost always have a spray bottle of plain water or M34 Final Inspection on hand when using M105 with a wool pad on a rotary buffer.

I scheduled to talk to Jason Rose today, I'll ask him about this issue and if he has any insight.


Mirror Detailing said:
caking.jpg
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Your Imageshack hosted picture is not showing up?


Mirror Detailing said:
It did the same for 205, just not near as bad.
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Question: When you start out with a clean pad does M205 buff correctly? As in long buffing cycle, doesn't dry up, easy to wipe-off?



:)
 
Mike.Phillips@Autogeek said:
Don't feel too bad, I've experienced the same problem. I almost always have a spray bottle of plain water or M34 Final Inspection on hand when using M105 with a wool pad on a rotary buffer.

I scheduled to talk to Jason Rose today, I'll ask him about this issue and if he has any insight.




Your Imageshack hosted picture is not showing up?





Question: When you start out with a clean pad does M205 buff correctly? As in long buffing cycle, doesn't dry up, easy to wipe-off?



:)
Click to expand...

I rehosted the picture did not even realize it was down. The 205, was most just clumping up in certain areas. It really wasnt a big problem to the point I would not want to use it anymore. Most times a simple spritz of water and the problem was solved.

But I also have my Foam Pad Conditioning Brush or Spur on hand pending which type of pad I am using to keep it clean every few passes. I am just more curious as to why the 105 cakes up so badly, so often.
 
Same thing happened to me as well. After one pass it just dries up and cakes on the surface. Its really hard to remove even with IPS 50/50. And like Mike Philips said, I just add a little bit of water, however its still frustrating. It makes the polish "milky" if you add the water and doesnt add much to the working time. It dries up again. I mean, im doing what the instructions say only I just keep the RPM's under 1400 with a temp of 70-85F. Just like the OP says too, M205 does the same thing but not as bad. So is there a flaw? Can you add some type of mineral oil to increase working time?
 
You can not spread 105 out like that, the air from the buffer will dry it out. You are going to have to find a sweet spot with it. It takes a little time to get used to get but once you find that sweet spot it works awesome.

I can't see how 205 clumps up on you guys. That has a lot of lubricants in it and I have never had it clump. Are you applying way too much? A little actually goes along way with 205.
 
ASPHALT ROCKET said:
You can not spread 105 out like that, the air from the buffer will dry it out. You are going to have to find a sweet spot with it. It takes a little time to get used to get but once you find that sweet spot it works awesome.
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I agree with Dana about finding the sweet spot, that's true for any paint correction product and whether you're working by hand or machine.

That said, in a production setting, a person should be able to lay down a bead of product and then buff and area about 2ft squared with not re-occurring problems. Even the labels states that.

M105label.jpg




I posted the introduction thread for this product on MOL when it came out and have buffed out a lot of cars and answers a zillion questions about M105 and over time you get to see a pattern and one of the patterns I've seen with M105 is that it has a short buffing cycle.

I'm confident Meguiar's monitors these types of issues and to tell the truth I thought we might see an "New and Improved" version introduced at SEMA this year but alas, it didn't happen.

Here are some tips for ANY time you're having problems with a product getting gummy or difficult to buff or wipe off,

  1. Shrink the size of your work area down to a smaller size
  2. Clean your pad often - if you don't have a pad washer and you buff out cars regularly then get one
  3. Switch to a clean, dry pad, or switch to a new pad

:xyxthumbs:
 
I also think you need to get to maximum speed from the get go and shorten your work area. On the rotary, i go right to 1500rpm from the start, work it about 15-20 seconds and your done. Yep. 105 can be a pain.
 
Mirror,

I'm having the same problem. So I called Meguiar's to inquire. Extremely helpful. There is a number on the back of the bottle that they'll take down and tell you how old the product is.

Also, they are sending me a new bottle to see if it's an old bottle and report the incident to their quality control. Then asked if I have the same problem with the new bottle to call them and they'd get me to another level to try and figure out the problem.

In the meantime, I'm going to make note of all the suggestions on here. As somebody mentioned, I have tried just dabbing the pad in a small area instead of spreading it out like you have. Then hit the power while moving the machine at the same time at a little faster speed, say 1300 and it helps but I still get the problem every once and a while.

I'd recommend calling them and reporting it.
 
I am to. Like someone said it might have been the size of my area, but that just the way I have always done it. I might try switching up to the way Mike and everyone says to do it by just laying down a line and picking it up and buffing out to the 2x2 area.

Frosty I will have to try what you said. I will give them a call in the next few days and see what they say.
 
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