Meguiar's UP vs UC vs Scratch 2.0

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rover137

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Hi all

I am in the process of purchasing a DA (12mm throw) as well as some Lake Country SDO pads (based in Australia) for use on my black car.

The car is a black Hyundai Nline 1.6T and i believe the car to have soft paint. I could be wrong (like i am with most things in life), but from what i can tell the paint seems soft.

The pads i am buying are a few of the black (finishing) and some orange (polishing - intermediate). I don't think i need a cutting pad at this point.

From what i can see the swirling is minor to moderate. Car is only 10 months old and the dealer didn't touch it (as instructed) and its been hand polished a couple times with Megs UP. I am also quite vigilant with my washing process.

My questions revolve around which which product/pad/speed to use.

Product/Pad

From other posts on here ( and other forums) it seems that for order of aggression the products go UP - Scratch 2.0 - UC. I have all these products at my disposal.

I was going to start with UP/Black pad then move to UP/Orange and then make my way up in product aggression along the same pad pathway.

Does this sound about right? I know UP is very minor in terms of aggression but it does contain some correction ability and matched with the right pad it may just remove some light swirls?

If i have to use Scratch 2.0 - can this product be used on the whole car (it seems to be marketed as a spot correction product) and is it likely i'll have to then finish off on UP or does Scratch 2.0 finish up nice enough on its own?

DA Speed

In terms of speed I've not really found much info around this. The machine i have has the following specs i think: Speeds 1-6 (
2500-5500/rpm)
​
In a general sense would the below assumptions be correct?

Wax: 2-3
Polish/finishing: 3-4.5
Correction:4.5 - 6

Therefore, if I'm trying to get some correction out of the UP/Scratch 2.0 i'd hit that with 4-5 and see how that goes at maybe 3-4 section passes?

Thanks in advance for your help!
 
Depends on your machine, the Rupes and Griots work well at speed 3-4. If I can maintain pad rotation I choose the lower speed, creates less heat and smooth operation. Only way to tell is do a test spot
 
vobro said:
Depends on your machine, the Rupes and Griots work well at speed 3-4. If I can maintain pad rotation I choose the lower speed, creates less heat and smooth operation. Only way to tell is do a test spot
Click to expand...

Thanks for your response.

This is the machine - Shine Mate EX-605 12mm Polisher

– Waxit Car Care

Its meant to similar to the Rupes. Maybe I’ll try 3-4 first and see how that goes.
 
If black pad is the same as most LC blacks, don’t bother using it. Use white or even orange (if white isn’t doing much) for UP. Your order of aggression (low to high) is correct but be aware that scratch-X is still fairly aggressive, not far off from UC.

Your general speeds look god but as mentioned above, you can hone in on the exact preferences once you try the machine.

Your test spot start point seems good. Start with the lower end of rotation speed and move up from there. Honestly, I change my speeds slightly as I polish depending on flat surface vs curved. Not recommending you do that but I think you’ll see that some areas require faster speed to keep the pad rotating on angles.
 
You really only need Ultimate Compound for deeper defects and Ultimate Polish for mild swirls. LC orange cutting pad for UC and a LC white or green pad for UP.
 
rover137 said:
Thanks for your response.

This is the machine - Shine Mate EX-605 12mm Polisher– Waxit Car Care

Its meant to similar to the Rupes. Maybe I’ll try 3-4 first and see how that goes.
Click to expand...


I'm guessing you're somewhere in the U.K.?

If it were me? I wouldn't get the free spinning long stroke - instead go old school and see if you can get an 8mm DAS6. Attach a 5" backing plate and then turn and churn 5.5" thin pads.



I was scheduled to teach a roadshow class at Waxstock this year but Covid-19 ruined that plan.


From days gone by - the ONLY guy to ever teach a car detailing class in the U.K. and photo document it with COOL AMERICAN CLASSICS and MUSCLE CARS.


Pictures: Roadshow Class at Waxstock in England!

Tools and buffing pads!


Dodo Juice Buff Daddy Dual Action Polishers

watermark.php


watermark.php



Lake Country 5.5" Foam Flat Pads for the Buff Daddy DA Polishers

watermark.php



watermark.php




So sad I never was able to get the pictures up showing all the other cool cars this class was able to train on.

Takes a lot of work and time to make pictures magically show up on a forum. A monkey can put a picture on FB or IG

https://www.autogeekonline.net/foru...trying-upload-photos-tread-2.html#post1689274






:)
 
acuRAS82 said:
If black pad is the same as most LC blacks, don’t bother using it. Use white or even orange (if white isn’t doing much) for UP. Your order of aggression (low to high) is correct but be aware that scratch-X is still fairly aggressive, not far off from UC.

Your general speeds look god but as mentioned above, you can hone in on the exact preferences once you try the machine.

Your test spot start point seems good. Start with the lower end of rotation speed and move up from there. Honestly, I change my speeds slightly as I polish depending on flat surface vs curved. Not recommending you do that but I think you’ll see that some areas require faster speed to keep the pad rotating on angles.
Click to expand...

Yeah i think the SDO LC black (range i will use) isn't too dissimilar to the range (CCS?) you are talking about. It looks like it has maybe just a little bit more cut. These charts rank both the SDO and CCS pads.

LAKE COUNTRY SDO ORANGE POLISHING PAD
– Detailing Shed

Lake Country CCS White Polishing Foam Pad
– Detailing Shed

It kinda looks like the SDO orange is maybe an in-between pad of the white and orange you are talking about? Looks like it has a decent cut with a good finish. I'm guessing the SDO orange can be used with bot UP and UC?

Do you think the black isn't needed, even for soft black paint to just polish with UP once all defects are removed?

Maybe i should just not bother with Scratch X and stick to UC and UP to get the job done?
 
Mike Phillips said:
I'm guessing you're somewhere in the U.K.?

If it were me? I wouldn't get the free spinning long stroke - instead go old school and see if you can get an 8mm DAS6. Attach a 5" backing plate and then turn and churn 5.5" thin pads.



I was scheduled to teach a roadshow class at Waxstock this year but Covid-19 ruined that plan.


From days gone by - the ONLY guy to ever teach a car detailing class in the U.K. and photo document it with COOL AMERICAN CLASSICS and MUSCLE CARS.


Pictures: Roadshow Class at Waxstock in England!

Tools and buffing pads!


Dodo Juice Buff Daddy Dual Action Polishers

watermark.php


watermark.php



Lake Country 5.5" Foam Flat Pads for the Buff Daddy DA Polishers

watermark.php



watermark.php




So sad I never was able to get the pictures up showing all the other cool cars this class was able to train on.

Takes a lot of work and time to make pictures magically show up on a forum. A monkey can put a picture on FB or IG

https://www.autogeekonline.net/foru...trying-upload-photos-tread-2.html#post1689274






:)
Click to expand...



Hi Mike!

Thanks for taking the time to post!

I'm actually in Australia. I'v looked at a few different machines we have available here and the Shinemate 12mm seems like one of the better ones (from what i can tell?).

What do you mean by free spinning long stroke? Can i ask what the difference is between that and the old school 8mm DAS6 and why you suggest it is a better option? I know what long and short stroke are (I didn't think 12mm was long though?) but have no idea what free spinning means?

I'm new to the space and have been doing lots of research but haven't come across those terms!

Is this the DAS6 you are talking about? Mint ProTools RO Polisher DAS6 Kit - Mint Protools Pads | Car Care Products Australia

If so, looks like there is a newer version available i should consider - DASTOOL DT-8 RO Polisher | Car Care Products Australia

I've not seen the thin pads here in Aus - are they just the SDO or HDO Range? Here i've seen SDO, HDO and CCS.


Good old Covid ruining everything! I don't suppose you ever come to Aus for classes?
 
rover137 said:
What do you mean by free spinning long stroke?

Can i ask what the difference is between that and the old school 8mm DAS6 and why you suggest it is a better option?

I know what long and short stroke are (I didn't think 12mm was long though?) but have no idea what free spinning means?
Click to expand...


I think there's a grey or fuzzy area where opinions collide on where short stroke ends and long stroke begins, I would defer to Jason Rose as a reputable sources that would know where the dividing line breaks and who would also be able to back-up his opinion.


As to free spinning? There are 2 general categories of orbital polishers.


1: Free spinning random orbital polishers

2: Gear-driven orbital polishers - note the word "random" is missing in this definition.​


It's late, I just finished correcting a pcar so can't type a lot. I will leave you with these.

Read and focus on the verbiage after the pictures in this article,

The ghosting footprint and the actual footprint - Long Stroke Free Spinning Orbital Polishers


And then read this article,

Why I call the FLEX 3401 the BEAST! by Mike Phillips


If you're in this for the long run, check out the Supa BEAST or the Mille - both are gear-driven orbital polishers and this is where you're going to get SPEED.


And check out this video,

LIVE Detailing Class - Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers - Once Step Detailing


:)
 
Mike Phillips said:
I think there's a grey or fuzzy area where opinions collide on where short stroke ends and long stroke begins, I would defer to Jason Rose as a reputable sources that would know where the dividing line breaks and who would also be able to back-up his opinion.


As to free spinning? There are 2 general categories of orbital polishers.


1: Free spinning random orbital polishers

2: Gear-driven orbital polishers - note the word "random" is missing in this definition.​


It's late, I just finished correcting a pcar so can't type a lot. I will leave you with these.

Read and focus on the verbiage after the pictures in this article,

The ghosting footprint and the actual footprint - Long Stroke Free Spinning Orbital Polishers


And then read this article,

Why I call the FLEX 3401 the BEAST! by Mike Phillips


If you're in this for the long run, check out the Supa BEAST or the Mille - both are gear-driven orbital polishers and this is where you're going to get SPEED.


And check out this video,

LIVE Detailing Class - Gear-Driven Orbital Polishers - Once Step Detailing


:)
Click to expand...



Thanks for the literature Mike!

Sorry, I misunderstood and thought you were saying that the Shinemate is not free spinning and is gear driven - my bad.

I understand now that you were recommending an old skool 8mm over 12mm. I've read a few different pieces where short vs long throw has been defined. From what i can tell it is anywhere from 10-12mm where you cross the threshold into long throw territory depending on who you talk to.

Before looking at the Shinemate 12mm i did try find a decent 8mm here in Aus but had difficulty finding a quality machine with that spec. The closest i could find with a decent amount of user feedback was the 12mm.

I'm more of a weekend enthusiast who is starting out (spending too much money) and a traditional DA, at this stage, is what I need i think.
 
Shine Mate should be OK. They make some of the Griot's Garage polishers, for example.
 
57Rambler said:
Shine Mate should be OK. They make some of the Griot's Garage polishers, for example.
Click to expand...

Yeah, from what i can tell they are decent - people here in Aus compare them to Rupes, minus the price tag.

12mm be ok for a beginner you think? One annoying thing is that you can't change the backing plate on that machine, so you are stuck with the 5".
 
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