Menzerna Powerlock Prep

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5js

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I have a new vehicle and would like to put a coat or two of Menzerna Powerlock on before winter.

I have never clayed before but have bought the Maguire’s clay kit which uses the Maquire’s Quik Detailer as a lubricant.


My question is do I need to use a wipe/cleaner such as Carpro Eraser after claying and prior to applying the Menzerna Powerlock? (I do not plan on doing any polishing). The manufacturer directions don’t specify.
 
IMO:
-At the very least: a light polishing step
should follow the Claying step.

-However, if you’re not going to polish after
the Claying step...you may want to re-wash
the vehicle...that is: if you believe that there
may be some left-over Clay lubricant/residues
from the Claying step.


Bob
 
I agree with Bob.

Depending on the color or aggressiveness of the clay bar, you may mar the paint in the process. Soft paint mars easily. Inexperience also leads to marring that you might otherwise avoid or minimize.

I always polish after clay bar.
 
FUNX650 said:
IMO:
-At the very least: a light polishing step
should follow the Claying step.

-However, if you’re not going to polish after
the Claying step...you may want to re-wash
the vehicle...that is: if you believe that there
may be some left-over Clay lubricant/residues
from the Claying step.


Bob
Click to expand...
Thanks for the responses.

A bit of info - this is a new car (Toyota RAV4) and my daily driver. I live in Maine and the winter / road chemicals can be harsh so I’m most interested in protection.

I can see imperfections in the paint - the factory paint reflection is bumpy (it’s not a mirror reflection) and shows some swirl marks (not sure the pro terms). I am thinking of taking it to a pro in the spring but want put a layer of protection on before winter.

I’m would definitely consider myself inexperienced so I don’t want to create more damage that the pro will have to fix, but was hoping by claying I could remove environmental contamination before applying a sealant (the Menzerna Powerlock).

I do have experience with some of the polishing products (Maguire’s Fine Cut Cleaner, 205, Swirl Remover 2.0, Cleaner Wax, and Show Car Glaze) but only on miniature products ( pro Pinewood derby cars that I was able to give incredible finishes to - but application on that scale was hand applied and totally different. For them I used a couple of pads. Bought them from AG and I think they are the Hex logic pads - orange and white)

Anyway, I guess I have enough experience to know my limitations. I plan on being very easy with the clay and generous on the lubricant - but if the recommendation is to polish - what do you recommend for a polish given what I am trying to do?

FYI, was planning on doing everything by hand. I do have an old DA tool (buffer?) but I think it was made for waxing not polishing. Not sure I have the tools/experience to properly polish and that is why I was just thinking of washing (and likely Iron-X) - claying - then Menzerna (2 coats).

Summary: Rinse off at home -> Iron-X -> rinse -> wash at local touchless carwash w/blow dryers -> clay with Maguire’s kit -> ??? -> 2 coats of Menzerna

Very open to any suggestions/recommendations.
 
don't clay unless you plan to polish. No desire to polish, then you should be fine with a normal wash and powerlock application. I've applied powerlock 3 or 4 times and never done any eraser or post polish prep and the results have always been fantastic.

I will say that I highly encourage you to do the polish. sf3500 is a very easy to apply polish, even if you half ass it, it's a good step. If you get a clay mitt it'll really help with cutting down the time and if you're going to do all the work to prep and mask off for powerlock, i think you'll appreciate the extra time to polish. You really, really dont want to leave any crap behind to get sealed in by the powerlock.
 
Belo said:
don't clay unless you plan to polish. No desire to polish, then you should be fine with a normal wash and powerlock application. I've applied powerlock 3 or 4 times and never done any eraser or post polish prep and the results have always been fantastic.

I will say that I highly encourage you to do the polish. sf3500 is a very easy to apply polish, even if you half ass it, it's a good step. If you get a clay mitt it'll really help with cutting down the time and if you're going to do all the work to prep and mask off for powerlock, i think you'll appreciate the extra time to polish. You really, really dont want to leave any crap behind to get sealed in by the powerlock.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply. I wish I had the polisher and a bit of experience to give this a try with the SF3500. Sounds like the best plan. I'm just not sure I'm ready to purchase a polisher and try it out for the first time on my new car. I do agree that I really don't want to have environmental contaminants sealed under the powerlock. Hmm, somewhat of a dilemma.

On a related question - if I were to polish would I need to use a cleaner before applying the Powerlock? I cannot find any "directions" on the Menzerna site that provide a step-by-step, but they have a product called Control Cleaner (used to be Top Inspection) and the description says "Removes polish residues, grease and contaminants prior to sealing. The new formulation cleans without streaks and guarantees excellent wiping." From the MSDS it appears to be 2.5-<10% Propylene glycol and 2.5-<10% Ethanol. UPDATE: Just found the answer - Menzerna's directions on the Technical Data Sheet for Powerlock. "Step 1. Clean the glossy surface with Menzerna Control Cleaner prior to sealing".
 
Based on what I've read so far here, I'd simply give your RAV a wash and apply the Powerlock. You'll be just fine and happy with the results. Skip the clay unless there are obvious signs of contamination like spots of sap that you can feel with your hands.
 
5js said:
Thanks for the reply. I wish I had the polisher and a bit of experience to give this a try with the SF3500. Sounds like the best plan. I'm just not sure I'm ready to purchase a polisher and try it out for the first time on my new car. I do agree that I really don't want to have environmental contaminants sealed under the powerlock. Hmm, somewhat of a dilemma.

On a related question - if I were to polish would I need to use a cleaner before applying the Powerlock? I cannot find any "directions" on the Menzerna site that provide a step-by-step, but they have a product called Control Cleaner (used to be Top Inspection) and the description says "Removes polish residues, grease and contaminants prior to sealing. The new formulation cleans without streaks and guarantees excellent wiping." From the MSDS it appears to be 2.5-<10% Propylene glycol and 2.5-<10% Ethanol. UPDATE: Just found the answer - Menzerna's directions on the Technical Data Sheet for Powerlock. "Step 1. Clean the glossy surface with Menzerna Control Cleaner prior to sealing".
Click to expand...

no cleaner needed. Here's some advice and 2 paths you could take given your situation.

1. buy a portercable kit from autogeek during one of their sales. Buy the kit that comes with the pads and get 3 white pads and 2 orange and a black. Buy a bottle of sf3500 or equivalent polish. You'll be down a couple hundred bucks, but those tools, pads and bottle will last you years. literally years. This assumes you have all the other towels and wash stuff handy of course. Don't overthink all the paint cleansers and stuff, you really don't need it.

2. if you're not budgeted for the machine system or don't have the time, i'd discourage you from hand applying powerlock. It can be done for sure, but I think there are better options. You can purchase any of the numerous spray and seal products like mckees 10 minute, sonax pns or spray and seal etc. A real good wash and these spray seals dont require the prep work or the effort to buff in like powerlock. Now of course the results aren't as good, and I'd suggest you reapply them every 2 months or so if you get a sunny winter day. I just did a spray and seal last night and i took me maybe 15 minutes. In the winter I use the toucheless washes, go home and touch up any spots missed with a waterless and then apply the protection.

3. If your'e set on just a protection and not sold on the spray and wipe products, I've never used it, but have heard colonite is unmatched for shear protection. Might not have the pop, gloss or feel to some of the others, but will straight up protect that paint.

sincerely,

guy from upstate ny :)
 
Belo said:
no cleaner needed. Here's some advice and 2 paths you could take given your situation.

1. buy a portercable kit from autogeek during one of their sales. Buy the kit that comes with the pads and get 3 white pads and 2 orange and a black. Buy a bottle of sf3500 or equivalent polish. You'll be down a couple hundred bucks, but those tools, pads and bottle will last you years. literally years. This assumes you have all the other towels and wash stuff handy of course. Don't overthink all the paint cleansers and stuff, you really don't need it.

2. if you're not budgeted for the machine system or don't have the time, i'd discourage you from hand applying powerlock. It can be done for sure, but I think there are better options. You can purchase any of the numerous spray and seal products like mckees 10 minute, sonax pns or spray and seal etc. A real good wash and these spray seals dont require the prep work or the effort to buff in like powerlock. Now of course the results aren't as good, and I'd suggest you reapply them every 2 months or so if you get a sunny winter day. I just did a spray and seal last night and i took me maybe 15 minutes. In the winter I use the toucheless washes, go home and touch up any spots missed with a waterless and then apply the protection.

3. If your'e set on just a protection and not sold on the spray and wipe products, I've never used it, but have heard colonite is unmatched for shear protection. Might not have the pop, gloss or feel to some of the others, but will straight up protect that paint.

sincerely,

guy from upstate ny :)
Click to expand...

So, somewhat coincidentally my 17 yr old son just purchased his first vehicle and it has a lot of scratches. Being his first vehicle he wants to try to get rid of the scratches. I think some of the scratches are beyond what can be taken care of with a polisher - but I thought this may be a good opportunity to practice and get rid of some of the lighter scratches. (I'll just have to set my son's expectations accordingly. With that, I may purchase the porter cable kit and maybe some more product and pads.

Questions:

(1) For my sons car I am not looking for perfection - rather to remove some of the scratches and practice technique. What product (polish/pad combo) would you recommend for this learning experience?

(2) For my car: if I were to polish with the Menzerna 3500 what pad would I use? Then for applying the Powerlock what pad would I use?

(3) I have seen a lot of posts/videos on this site regarding polishing. Which is the best instructional video or post for a newbie?

I think I have all the products and tools I need for the wash (wash, foam gun, buckets, wash mitt, air compressor/drying towel) as well as a good quality microfiber for buffing the Powerlock. I think all I need is a list of products for polishing and applying the powerlock.
 
1. keep it in the family and get the menzerna fg400. it's a good compound and if you can't get the scratch out with the 400 and a yellow or orange pad, you're not going to get it out, or you'll need some pro help. I've head real good luck with that combo though. Just be aware that a compound will need a polish over it. So if you're spot treating with the 400, do a final full boddy with the sf polish. the polish and white pad combo does real well for small scratches and swirls too, but it really brings the paint to life. Be sure you get some pad cleaner and pad brush too to extend the pad's life.

2. white pad for polish. you can use an orange for a better cut, but i think you're limited with the 3500 and it wouldn't be super noticeable. there are some good articles here on how many pads, I will use 3 on a normal size car and 4 on an suv or truck. hood, roof, trunk. and 1 per side. Some guys use like 6. In a pinch you could get buy with 1 or 2 but you're not getting the best results with that approach.

I use the black pad for powerlock. You dont want any cut for your protection. Let it sit and then wipe off the access with a mf towel.

3. i'd read mike's articles. it's hard to polish the wrong way and do any damage with a da, but you should learn a good technique with pressure and passes and he has a bunch on these you should be able to find with the search. I recommend some painters tape too as I'm still not great at keeping away from trim even after years of practice, and once that stuff gets in, it's a b!tch to get out.
 
I own the Porter Cable and it has done a good job on the 3 cars I have used it on.
The first few threads on this site made it sound real good.
After I bought it seemed like every thread touted the GG6. Yep, that's my life. :)
However with the new Griot's G9 coming out I would go that route.

Don't be too hasty and do your homework before you buy.
Good luck, you will enjoy working on your cars either way.
 
Belo said:
1. keep it in the family and get the menzerna fg400. it's a good compound and if you can't get the scratch out with the 400 and a yellow or orange pad, you're not going to get it out, or you'll need some pro help.
Click to expand...
Thanks – that’s exactly where I want to be with the sons car – do as much as we can reasonably do without going to a pro. It’s more of a “let’s clean it up the best we can”, while using it as an opportunity to gain experience/confidence in using the tool.

Belo said:
Just be aware that a compound will need a polish over it. So if you're spot treating with the 400, do a final full boddy with the sf polish. the polish and white pad combo does real well for small scratches and swirls too, but it really brings the paint to life. Be sure you get some pad cleaner and pad brush too to extend the pad's life.
Click to expand...
So follow the FG400 (yellow or orange pad) with the SF3500 (white pad), Then apply the sealant (black pad)? Any recommendation for the pad cleaner?

Belo said:
3. i'd read mike's articles. it's hard to polish the wrong way and do any damage with a da, but you should learn a good technique with pressure and passes and he has a bunch on these you should be able to find with the search. I recommend some painters tape too as I'm still not great at keeping away from trim even after years of practice, and once that stuff gets in, it's a b!tch to get out.
Click to expand...
Haha – yea, good suggestion on the painters tape.
I did see this link on the AG site: Dual Action Orbital Polisher Guide: how to remove swirls, scratches, & oxidation with an orbital buffer. Porter Cable 7424, foam pads, backing plate, which has some video’s by Mike. I’ll check them out tonight.
 
MAXBKS said:
I own the Porter Cable and it has done a good job on the 3 cars I have used it on.
The first few threads on this site made it sound real good.
After I bought it seemed like every thread touted the GG6. Yep, that's my life. :)
However with the new Griot's G9 coming out I would go that route.

Don't be too hasty and do your homework before you buy.
Good luck, you will enjoy working on your cars either way.
Click to expand...

Yup - been there numerous times. Guess that's the way it goes. Research a product - buy it - then the next best thing comes around. Oh well.

Yea, I have all the products for washing and waxing (or sealing in this case) but have never done any polishing (at least by machine) so I trying to do a bit of homework before I make a purchase.

Lot's a good info on this site - so I read as many threads as I could. Now I'm at the point of narrowing down what I'm gonna do. Wasn't going to do any polishing but now that my son has a vehicle and asked me if I could help him with removing some scratches I figured this would be a good opportunity to give it a try. Oh, and in addition to the detailing - he wants to put in a new stereo and speakers... I remember those days and getting your first car.....
 
5js said:
Thanks – that’s exactly where I want to be with the sons car – do as much as we can reasonably do without going to a pro. It’s more of a “let’s clean it up the best we can”, while using it as an opportunity to gain experience/confidence in using the tool.


So follow the FG400 (yellow or orange pad) with the SF3500 (white pad), Then apply the sealant (black pad)? Any recommendation for the pad cleaner?


Haha – yea, good suggestion on the painters tape.
I did see this link on the AG site: Dual Action Orbital Polisher Guide: how to remove swirls, scratches, & oxidation with an orbital buffer. Porter Cable 7424, foam pads, backing plate, which has some video’s by Mike. I’ll check them out tonight.
Click to expand...

even if your sons car doesn't return to showroom shine, it'll be night and day and instantly rewarding. it's the best way to show love to a new purchase. Your steps are correct. orange compound/correct, white/polish/shine and then black/protect. If you get a little more serious, add some Wolfgang exterior trim selant (or similar), tire gel, some glass cleaner and rain-x or equivalent and you'll be complete. the trim stuff really helps if either car has any black trim. Otherwise you get this shiny paint with dull trim.

any of the pad/conditioner combos are fine. try to find one on sale. there might even be a combo that includes the brush.

as far as the griots orbital. i dont have experience with it. i'm sure it's great. In my opinion, you dont go wrong with either setup. they're not going to be night and day different.
 
There is night and day difference in the Porter Cable and the new Griot's 9. Way more power, balance, speed, and a lifetime warranty. Prices are close, so why buy the Porter Cable?
 
rangerbay said:
There is night and day difference in the Porter Cable and the new Griot's 9. Way more power, balance, speed, and a lifetime warranty. Prices are close, so why buy the Porter Cable?
Click to expand...

If anyone (the OP, or any lurkers) is in the market for their first polisher at this time, boy are you in luck.

At $150, you can get a great machine in the G9, and it will be just about everything you need as a hobbyist.
 
PaulMys said:
If anyone (the OP, or any lurkers) is in the market for their first polisher at this time, boy are you in luck.

At $150, you can get a great machine in the G9, and it will be just about everything you need as a hobbyist.
Click to expand...

Do you think a long throw might even be better?
 
bcgreen said:
Do you think a long throw might even be better?
Click to expand...

I have all kinds of machines. Short throws, long throws,(15 and 21) small DA's (3") flex rotary's, cheap rotary's, and the GG6 is still my go to.

I have a G9 on the way,I and will keep my 6 with a 5" plate, and keep the 6" on the 9.

Long throws are really not a good choice for learning. Long throws are technique machines, short throws are simple, easy to use and learn with, and can do one helluva job.

I think this new G9 will be a game changer. Get it, I don't think you will be the least bit disappointed.

Bill
 
rangerbay said:
I have all kinds of machines. Short throws, long throws,(15 and 21) small DA's (3") flex rotary's, cheap rotary's, and the GG6 is still my go to.

I have a G9 on the way,I and will keep my 6 with a 5" plate, and keep the 6" on the 9.

Long throws are really not a good choice for learning. Long throws are technique machines, short throws are simple, easy to use and learn with, and can do one helluva job.

I think this new G9 will be a game changer. Get it, I don't think you will be the least bit disappointed.

Bill
Click to expand...

I am not a beginner as I have doing the detail thing since '94 or '96 with the PC7335 and for more difficult situations I use my Makita. I figured the G9 would be a step up since my PC is more than 20 yrs. old and maybe technology has advanced and made better machines. I am not a pro and am retired so I don't want to go the big $ route for a Flex or Rupes and from what some people have said the long throw is better if you have some experience.
 
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