Mercedes s550 Micro Marring issue

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76k10chase

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Hi Guys, I have been lurking on here for a while and have gotten a lot of good info. I recently was working on a black Mercedes s550 which has a factory ceramic coating on it. The story goes that the car had been taken back to the dealer and they "prepped it", but basically looks like they wiped the whole car down with a dirty rag as it is swirled badly and even some deeper scratches. My issue was when polishing, I thought I would simply compound/polish it out and recoat the car after, however, the coating is very strong and, while I was able to remove most of the imperfections, I am left with what looks to be some micro marring. Being that it is on top of the coating, I am not sure the best way to go about this.

Currently, I am using fg400 and an orange buff and shine pad to compound and PO85rd as a polish with a white pad, however, I was debating switching to a less aggressive polishing pad, as well. The marring showed up after the compound stage was wiped down with IPA. I am using a GG6 polisher with it on 5 for the compound and slower for the polish, I'm thinking maybe a speed adjustment might help some maybe? Any input would be great as I have never really had this issue before.

This is what it started as
View attachment 53676



And after I went over it
View attachment 53677



After I wiped that section down, however, this is what I saw. The marring was so fine it was really difficult to get on camera.
View attachment 53678 View attachment 53679​
 
CarPro Essence on a black pad? Haven't had 1st hand experience with what you're seeing but knowing the polishing ability of it to bring out a super shine combined with it's filling ability, I would try Essence as a base coat for a ceramic. I think it could be a good option. From there, give it a coating and call it done. Just my two cents at a possible fix.
 
I would try to remove those micro-marring as much as I can before applying a coating. Under direct sunlight, those marks can look a lot worse. Do you have any paint cleaners like sonax? I would try that with a orange lc thinpro pad with light pressure.
 
Softer pad for the final polish would be the first thing I would try. Not familiar with the menzerna products,so I would recommend Griots perfecting cream. I've been doing a lot with Griots and really like them.
 
FG 400 on orange pad and SF4500 on white pad is the perfect combination for Black Merc paint. Owned 2x AMG in black and that is what I used for both of them perfectly. Taking your SF4500 (po85rd) on a no cut pad with very little pressure and likely a 2-3 on the GG6 will possibly take out those fine marring. The only marring you should have after compounding it is the marring from the compound and pad itself. The paint should be level at that point. The polish is utilitzed to remove the marring from the 1-step. The polish and white pad should with no issue finish it out being ready for LSP. But some suggestions below.

Then, don't wipe it down with anything. Wash it with dish soap or whatever stripper you have handy and blow dry the vehicle. Then it should be marr free. If it is still there, you didn't either compound it out first, or polish out the compounding marring.

Using the Carpro essence will work likely also. You will be finely polishing and then filling whats left with material. You wont want to use a panel wipe or you will take out the fillers. Then coat on top. The coating likely will cover the fillers leaving it looking good. Not my way of doing things but it will work and solve your issue likely.
 
Mike lambert said:
Softer pad for the final polish would be the first thing I would try. Not familiar with the menzerna products,so I would recommend Griots perfecting cream. I've been doing a lot with Griots and really like them.
Click to expand...

I have not tried any of the GG products ever, let alone on black Merc paint, but @Mike Lambert is likely giving a good number 2 choice to try out. But use his suggested style with po85rd. Mike P uses po85rd/SF4500/whatever they call it now SF3800? for jeweling paint. So the product isn't the issue. Pad and speed might be. Slow down, no cut pad. Then work options from there. Light pressure and careful wiping with a good clean MF pad.

Also, you might need to be working surgically clean on this one. New pad every panel, and blowing out the pads between sections is highly recommended. ALso, try 2 passes and see if that fixed it, if not then 3 and so on. That last final step should be quick and easy.
 
Those marks you talk about look like towel marks to me, probably from the IPA wipe down you are doing. Keep in mind that an IPA can be a good way to remove polishing oils to check you work but IPA offers zero lubrication and you can very easily mar the paint with it, especially if you are using an inferior towel.

The FG400 should be removing whatever "factory ceramic" coating the car came with.

I would continue using the FG400 as you are, use a super soft towel to remove it. If you want to check your work I would use another towel soaked in ONR solution and wrung out, or Carpro Eraser, wipe lightly.

If you were having marring from the polish with the white pad, try and black pad just to see what happens and use zero pressure on the machine for the last 2 passes. Again, super plush towel to wipe off.
 
Before you go any further, you might take a look-see at this article by Mike Phillips.
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...estions/47152-ceramiclear-paints-careful.html
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...iclear-paint-code-location-mercedes-benz.html

You may be dealing with factory cermiclear paint.
the designation as follows by identifying the "C" in the paint code.

NDMyMDBENDRBMDdEQzFGODRDQUY6NjU1OThkYjgwYzQzOWI1NDc2Yzc5ZDczMTg1MWMwYmE=
 
ekennett said:
Those marks you talk about look like towel marks to me, probably from the IPA wipe down you are doing.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought when I looked at the picture

53676d1479786819-mercedes-s550-micro-marring-issue-img_3929.jpg




ekennett said:
Keep in mind that an IPA can be a good way to remove polishing oils to check you work but IPA offers zero lubrication and you can very easily mar the paint with it, especially if you are using an inferior towel.
Click to expand...


The only article I NEVER wanted to write was the article on how to dilute and use IPA.

I wrote it back when we had a few bad apples on this forum always telling everyone how to strip their paint with IPA ONLY they didn't give any good information on exactly how to do it.

So I asked someone else to take it upon themselves to write the article and AFTER a year went by and no one stepped up to the plate to write the article I did it just to make sure no one screwed up their paint following bad information from people that don't take responsibility for what they write.

Here's the article...

How to Mix IPA for Inspecting Correction Results



And in this article I show light towel marring caused by wiping paint with IPA

Hologram Free with a Rotary Buffer


Now you can see some light marring, but that's because IPA isn't a very good lubricant, in fact it's a horrible lubricant. I think of all the people that have been told by others to wipe their car down with IPA before going to the next step and it's pretty easy to understand that when they did this they likely marred their car's paint and this is called working backwards. It's also likely that if the people taking this advice were working on light to medium colored cars they never saw the marring.
HologramFree06.jpg




IPA is not a good lubricant and it can cause towel marring when you wipe scratch-sensitive clearcoat paints with it.


:dunno:
 
76k10chase said:
marring showed up after the compound stage was wiped down with IPA.
Click to expand...


That's normal when inspecting with a bright light. The "wiping" of the residue plus the towel can mar the paint.


Clearcoats scratch easy. There are other options for chemically stripping paint besides IPA. I like the Wolfgang Perfect Finish Paint Prep instead of IPA.

I wrote a VERY detailed how-to article for applying a coating to paint using the Wolfgang Uber Ceramic Paint Coating and the tips and techniques I shared would apply to ANY coating.

Lots of pictures.... lots of how-to info... check it out...


Review & How-To: Wolfgang Uber Ceramic Paint Coating


watermark.php


watermark.php




KEY TIP

Very Important
Have plenty of clean, soft microfiber towels on hand for the prep step to avoid cross-contamination.

watermark.php



On Autogeek.com


Wolfgang Perfekt Finish Paint Prep



And while this car is not black it is DARK BLUE and it is taken to car shows all the time. Last time I saw it - it still looked great.


watermark.php






:)
 
Thanks for all of the replies, the IPA I was using was diluted according to the article posted above, but I often wondered if that was the problem. I think what was confusing me the most was that the coating seems to be on the paint still I tested a spot that I hadn't compounded yet and one that I had and they beaded water exactly the same, even after the IPA. Has anyone had experience with this? The first picture I posted was how the car came back from the dealer so I am not sure how they marred it that badly, but I am also working on the worst section of paint first.
 
76k10chase said:
Thanks for all of the replies, the IPA I was using was diluted according to the article posted above, but I often wondered if that was the problem. I think what was confusing me the most was that the coating seems to be on the paint still I tested a spot that I hadn't compounded yet and one that I had and they beaded water exactly the same, even after the IPA. Has anyone had experience with this? The first picture I posted was how the car came back from the dealer so I am not sure how they marred it that badly, but I am also working on the worst section of paint first.
Click to expand...

1.) Was the car repainted?
2.) What is the paint code?
 
The car hasn't been repainted to my knowledge, its a 2011 and has a paint code of just 040 without a C so I assume it doesn't have ceramiclear
 
76k10chase said:
The car hasn't been repainted to my knowledge, its a 2011 and has a paint code of just 040 without a C so I assume it doesn't have ceramiclear
Click to expand...

Not sure if an IPA wipedown would even be necessary. Hit it with a good refining polish using a white pad and go right to your LSP of choice. On black, I'd use CarPro Essence and top it with a coating like McKee's 37. Otherwise, a good AIO that finishes out better than most anything is HDSpeed. You add an additional sealant to it if you choose.
 
What pdqgp states... If you have no intentions on doing a ceramic coating, an IPA wipe down will not be required. A final prep with a good AIO HD Speed, BOSS Finishing Sealant, etc.. then top-off with your favorite LSP.

If you really wanted to get the polishing oils off to inspect the work, my suggestion would be that of Mike Phillips, or, CarPro Erasure. Erasure does have lubricity and works wonderfully. As pointed out, IPA's do not have lubricity thus you're at the mercy of your MF towel and whatever it's picking up post-polishing and dragging it across the vehicle.
 
I also think it's towel marks. It does look like micromarring from a DA, but I can't tell for sure with a cell phone picture and the lighting.

What are you doing for LSP? I honestly wouldn't bother doing an IPA wipe down if you're not doing a coating. Yes, SF4500 is about as oily as it gets, but most sealants will do fine.

On the other hand, SF4500 can hide paint imperfections because it is so oily. I would highly suggest using a paint prep product if you have one. If this iz a customer's car and you can't wait, or if it's yours and you don't want to wait, then use a waterless wash or go to O'Reillys or Walmart or any auto parts store and buy Wax & Grease Remover (Duplicolor is a popular brand). Wax & Grease Remover isn't as good an option as Carpro Eraser, but it has wetting agents that'll protect the paint more than IPA does.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Autogeekonline mobile app
 
paul_g said:
What pdqgp states... If you have no intentions on doing a ceramic coating, an IPA wipe down will not be required. A final prep with a good AIO HD Speed, BOSS Finishing Sealant, etc.. then top-off with your favorite LSP.

If you really wanted to get the polishing oils off to inspect the work, my suggestion would be that of Mike Phillips, or, CarPro Erasure. Erasure does have lubricity and works wonderfully. As pointed out, IPA's do not have lubricity thus you're at the mercy of your MF towel and whatever it's picking up post-polishing and dragging it across the vehicle.
Click to expand...

I was planning on coating the car with cquartz uk, however, whatever the factory Mercedes Nano Sealant coating that was put on at the dealer is has not been removed with the compound which I was not anticipating. I think I am more worried about how to finish the car after removing the defects if this coating is still on there. This is my first time removing a coating like this and I was anticipating simply compounding it off and then recoating it, however, that does not seem the case at this point as the car is still hydrophobic and shows signs of the coating still existing when compared to areas I haven't compounded yet. Has anyone ever dealt with this?
 
If you used FG400 then you removed whatever coating was applied to the car. Clean paint will bead water. FG400 followed by 3800, then Essence and then your coating. The Essence will fill some scratches and provide a good surface for your coating to adhere.
 
I seems like you are confusing the factory ceramic clear coat paint system with the aftermarket "ceramic" coatings. ?
 
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