Metal Flake Paint

[tampatopless]

Do you guys find that certain sealants or waxes bring out the "pop" in metal flake paint more so than others?

If so, which ones?

I had been reading some posts when one poster mentioned that he thought Meg's NXT made his paint look darker and he had switched to some other products.

I guess I had never really thought of it before. I have a Monterey Red Vert and am always looking to get as much pop as possible out of the metal flake.

Any help is appreciated.

 

[mg6045]

Yes for sure. You will want any product that makes the paint brighter. You dont want a product that has a darkening effect.

For wax's you want to stay away from Pinnacle Souveran if you want mettalic to pop. BUT, you will love there signature Series II for making the paint bright and pop.

Wolfgang Fuzion is amazing on Mettalics as well or light colors.

Basically any product that says it works well on light colored cars, will usually make mettalic paint pop as well.

Synthetic paint protection is the answer usually. Minus the Meg's obviously which is heavy with darkening oils in most of there last step products and in there new spray products as well.

 

[BobbyG]

:welcome: To Autogeek Online!!

Over the years I've found that carnauba waxes give the appearance of more depth and give the finish a much wetter look therefore bring out that sparkle. For additional depth and protection applying a sealant then applying wax will give both added protection and depth..

These are great examples of quality waxes that I'm sure will please..

• Wolfgang Fuzion
• Dodo Juice Supernatural
• Pinnacle Souveran
• Blackfire Midnight Sun
• Collinite 845[FONT=&quot][/FONT]

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Here's my personal take on it...

If you want the metallic flake to *PoP* then you want to get the clear layer of paint as clear as possible so your eyes can see past the clear layer of paint to the metallic flake embedded in the basecoat.

Any defect on the "surface" of the clear layer of paint will cloud your view of what's under it.

It's just like everyone always posts,

A flawless finish is 90% prep work


After you create a clear, smooth surface, then all you have to do is use a premium quality wax, paint sealant or coating to seal your hard work and take the results you've created to an even higher level.

I have a close friend that doesn't believe a wax or a paint sealant or a coating adds anything to the end-results if a person does a professional job of polishing the paint.

To some degree I agree with him except for this...

Most polishes are water-soluble, at least pro-grade products, no so much consumer grade, retail type products. So without a insoluble coating over your hard work the polishing oils are going to be removed and expose naked or bare paint.

By applying a wax, paint sealant or coating you do three things,

1. Protect the paint with a sacrificial barrier coating - This barrier coating will sacrifice itself so you paint doesn't have to sacrifice itself.
2. Create an UNIFORM appearance - Even everything out.
3. Hold up when exposed to wet weather or car washing, heck even wiping with a spray detailer.

I've been reading posts all my online life about how one wax is better than another wax to really make the metallic flake in a car's paint *pOp* but I've never bought into that idea once.

The goal for any type of paint is to,

Make the surface of the paint as defect free as possible, in the case of a clear coat paint this will make it clear. In the case of a single stage paint this will maximize richness of color.

Make the paint as smooth as possible because this creates gloss.


Here's clear paint,

1977 Can Am Corvette - Modeled by Amy and Janna - Pictures and Video!

Note how the metallic flake POPS! after we applied Opti-Coat II


:laughing:

Note: You if you look at the below "BEFORE" pictures it's hard to see the multi-color metallic flake in the paint because all the surface defects cloud your ability to see past the clear to the flake below. The metallic flake certainly does NOT *pop*. :laughing:


BEFORE

Here's glossy paint,

1954 Ford F-100 - Modeled by Janna

Here's some pictures of how the clay looked after claying JUST ONE HALF OF THE ROOF AND THIS ROOF IS SMALL.

This truck was re-painted approximately one year ago but just from exposure to the outdoors has made the paint vulnerable to air-borne contaminants...

This shot was taken with my trusty, dusty Canon Rebel with the flash on after claying the roof...

Without the flash on here's what the clay looks like and this is what it looked like in person... The roof and the other horizontal panels pretty much felt like sandpaper before we started.

Ewww....

Besides restoring gloss, by removing the film of contaminants off the paint you'll make machine polishing easier, safer and more effective and enable your choice of wax or paint sealant to better be able to bond to the paint.

The black stuff on the clay is some type of ABOVE SURFACE BONDED CONTAMINANTS and contaminants create SURFACE TEXTURE and surface texture means the surface is no longer smooth so it's can never be as glossy as its potential.



If you want the metal flake, or metallic flake under your car's clear coat finish to *pop* then your goal is to,

• Make the paint as defect free as possible
• Make the paint as smooth as possible

Then pick your poison for your LSP and go for it!

 

[ScottB]

welcome my corvetteforum friend ....

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I had been reading some posts when one poster mentioned that he thought Meg's NXT made his paint look darker and he had switched to some other products.

If you have a black car and you apply a product and it makes the black paint look darker or 100% Black. (no shades of gray, like 99% black is actually a shade of gray), then this is a good product.

It looks like the product made the paint darker but in fact it restored the paint to its true color.

Now think about this... if a product does this for black paint, and the black paint has a clear coat over it, isn't this same product doing the same thing for all products?

What you're seeing Robert are people that don't know what they're talking about.

The goal for a person that wants the most out of their paint is to maximize clarity, gloss and richness of color. When someone states that they don't like a product because it makes their paint darker, what they are saying is they don't want to see the true color of their paint.

The opposite would be to want a product that makes their paint lighter. You can do this with an old school type rocks in a bottle abrasive compound with a wool pad or even inexpensive waxes that use harsh solvents as both abrasives and solvents will dull or haze the paint.

Here's hazy paint... the swirls are creating a grayish look to the paint, that is it's not as dark as it could be.

Here's the same paint after making it darker...

Besides the swirls being removed, which color of black looks best? Gray Black or Black Black?

The same hold true for all colors.

A polish or a wax that darkens the paint is a good thing, it's not just darkening the paint it's revealing the true color versus a hazy version of the color.

I've seen and been posting about this confusion over darkening paint on detailing discussion forum for over 10 years now... it will never go away but that's because the people stating that darkening is a bad thing don't know what they're talking about. It's not their fault, they just don't know any better.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Welcome to Autogeek Online!

I guess I had never really thought of it before. I have a Monterey Red Vert and am always looking to get as much pop as possible out of the metal flake.

I'm not sure this is Monterey Red but if it's not it's close. Note how clear and dark the paint looks and also how beautiful.


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NHma2mlPaI&hd=1]Detailing Classes at Autogeek's Show Car Garage with Mike Phillips - YouTube[/video]

 

[BillE]

That is a super vid Mike!

Every time I see that red Vette (in the beginning of the tape), I just drool. Isn't that Max's?

Bill

 

[Waxmax]

Mike, Thanks for your comments.

I also have never really bought into a quailty LSP muting flake. The prep is what brings the flake out and after that good LSPs have excellent clarity so rather than muting they add some gloss/wetness....maybe some consider that muting?

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Mike, Thanks for your comments.

I also have never really bought into a quality LSP muting flake. The prep is what brings the flake out and after that good LSPs have excellent clarity so rather than muting they add some gloss/wetness....maybe some consider that muting?

The topic of pop and mute when it comes to metalflake always makes me laugh and laughing is healthy for you!

I'm happy to say that the quality of car care products is a lot higher today than it was 10, 20 and 30 years ago. There have been in the past and there probably still are some today, waxes that use inexpensive solvents that can actually dull a highly polished surface. So if a person were to apply a low quality wax or paint sealant to a highly polished finish it could "mute" the flake but what it's really doing is dulling down the top surface of the clear layer of paint.

When I was younger I use to give paint care products the "Smell Test", I wouldn't recommend this to anyone as it's probably not a healthy thing to do and hopefully I never caused any real or long term harm.

It used to be a lot of low-end products would use Stoddard Solvent or Naptha as a carrying agent to hold the other products in a suspension. Anyone that's ever worked in an automotive machine shop or repair shop knows what Stoddard Solvent is, it's non-flammable parts cleaning solvent.

That is it's a solvent used to clean old grease out of wheel bearings and such. It's non-flammable so Old Jim, the mechanic doesn't blow up the shop as he cleans old car parts and smokes his cigarette at the same time.

Point being, these types of solvents are less costly then more refined solvents and you get what you pay for.

If you wiped a polished clear coat finish with a rag drenched in Stoddard Solvent, the effect would not be to make the paint look better. The more you did the the less better the paint would look. That's the dulling effect of an inexpensive solvent to car paint.

I once asked a chemist at Meguiar's what the difference was between a good solvent and a bad solvent he simply said, a good solvent is one where all the nasty V.O.C.'s have been removed through more refining steps.

The more V.O.C.'s that are removed the less odors you'll smell. So when I was doing the "Smell Test", years before I met a Meguiar's chemist, I was unknowingly checking products for a strong odor of harsh solvents to help myself to know if the products were Caveman quality or something using more costly solvents.

Of course today with the implementation of more strict V.O.C. regulations by our friends at the EPA, the quality of even inexpensive products has increased in order to comply.


Stick with name brands you know, trust and have a time-proven track record and your cars will reflect your choices.

 

[mg6045]

I dont know. I can tell a clear difference when using a product like Souveran on a white car, compared to using Fuzion.

The Fuzion makes the car look brighter and give sharper reflections.

I guess i just dont know what i'm talking about and my eye's are worthless.

I have also seen threads where half a hood was waxed with Souveran and the other half with Supernatural, and one side of the hood was darker than the other.

 

[Waxmax]

Depends how the light hits the paint and is refracted/reflected. I too have seen some LSPs slightly brighten or slightly darken, but the clarity to "see" the paint was still there (hand no trouble seeing the flake). It's all in the eye of the beholder...all good.