Removing fine swirls from headlight lens

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rob42

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Hey all

I sanded and polished some hazed headlight lenses, but I can't get these fine swirls out.

My process was wet sanding with 800, 1200, then 2000 grit (in straight lines). I then used Meguiars M105 on an orange foam pad to remove the 2000 grit sanding marks - which are now all gone.

In their place are fine swirls (see image) that I'm guessing come from the M105. I've been completely unable to remove those swirls. I've tried using M205 on a white foam pad - I tried a generic pad as well as a Chemical Guys white hex pad.

I don't have a polisher, so I've been using 4" pads on a drill at between ~500 and 1500rpm (didn't seem to make a difference). Applying medium pressure to where the pad compresses a bit, and moving at around 1 inch per second. I'm not seeing any improvement after 4-5 passes, it's as if the 205 is doing nothing.

I also used M105 on a microfiber applicator by hand to strip the clear coating off the inside of the lenses too - since it was failing. I have similar swirls on the inside too.

The lens looks perfectly clear until I shine a flashlight on it, which reveals all the swirls. I'm worried that if I reassemble the headlights, I'm going to see lots of swirls in the sun or with the headlights on

Does anyone have any ideas for how to fix this or things to try? Am I right in assuming the swirls are from the M105? Why wouldn't the 205 be making any difference?

Thank you!

Here is an images of the lens under a flashlight, as well as two showing it under normal interior lighting.

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b0cec819a1e061c68b94e9cb9a91ddab.jpg
 
Using a drill it is similar to using a roatory buffer. If its used incorrectly it will cause swirls. With that said I would slow it down and use a polish to remove the swirls. I have also had a lot of success using meguiars plastic polish. Hope this helps.
 
Just a thought; maybe those are 205 scratches, instead of 105. Maybe try an even finer polish. If you don't have a finer polish, try cutting the 205 with water.
Try very light pressure combined with low rpms. If your going to use pads you used 105 with, clean them thoroughly because 105 doesn't break down.
 
I (of course if you ever read any of the other threads about headlights) recommend the DP Headlight polish available here on AG
 
I have since tried using 205 cut with water and light pressure on a fresh white pad - no effect.

I then tried PlastX - applied with medium-light pressure by hand with a microfiber pad for about 2 minutes in a small spot. No change. I even masked off an area to be sure, and after removing the tape you couldn't tell any difference.

Lastly, I had some Mothers plastic polish (less abrasive than PlastX), so I used that on a black pad. I made about 4 slow passes, but again, no difference.

Is it likely that the headlight lens is very soft, and all these products are just introducing their own swirls?

Is it possible that I'm being too harsh a judge and have unreasonable expectations? After all, I can only see these swirls under my phone's flashlight.

This is driving me nuts!
 
If you don't have any other polishes and buying a different polish is just not that important to you, maybe you could try less 105 on a pad, or water it down some? I hate to see you try and try with no results, but I know those swirls are bugging you.
 
Thanks for the advice everyone!

The DP polish looks interesting - but I want to be sure it will solve my swirl problem before ordering and waiting a week for it to arrive!

I did some more experimenting to work out where the swirls are coming from. I wet sanded with 3000 grit paper in a single direction until all the swirls were gone. I then applied m205 by hand - on a brand new microfiber applicator. That cleared the haze from the 3000 grit paper - but reintroduced the swirls.

I repeated the whole process with mothers plastic polish. Swirls again!?

I'm wondering if my lens is very very soft, and even very mild compounds/polishes are swirling it. Is that even possible? It's from an 01 Mazda Miata.

Either that or my technique is somehow causing this?

Is there a polish that has even less cut/marring than mothers plastic polish?
 
I'd stop with the microfiber applicator and stick with foam (like the ones that come free with Meguires products). Sounds like that MF might be the culprit. Honestly, I think a foam applicator and PlastX would solve your problem. I use PlastX on all kinds of different plastic around the house, in addition to headlights. I like it. Works great. But before purchasing, you could try the mothers plastic polish with a foam applicator.

I swirled the crap outta my dads black Nissan with a brand new MF applicator and a paint sealer. Foam solved the problem.

Some MF can be pretty abrasive and that becomes evident on clear plastics. Also, lighten your pressure with the polish, but polish a little longer. Just kinda find the right balance. You'll find it.
 
Are you using a microfiber applicator or foam?
 
Has anyone reported back with poor results from using the DP headlight polish? Just asking because I haven't seen any.

I bought some awhile ago. Left it sitting on the shelf until I started seeing all the great reports. Took it out and tried it on a 10 year old Corolla. Absolutely blown away with the ease and results. I have only restored one car with it, so different plastics could give different results (The reason why I asked if I had missed a bad review somewhere.). But at this point, I would think the OP should give it a try.

That being said, I didn't have scratches to clean up - just a fully clouded over lens.
 
I've been using new Chemical Guys MF applicators this whole time. I just ordered some Meguiar's soft foam applicators and will try those by hand with PlastX and the Mothers polish.

If that doesn't work, I'll order the DP headlight polish. I'm avoiding buying it because of how long it will take to arrive to me in CA! Ground shipping is the only affordable option.

It's hard to beat free same day delivery from Amazon for the Meguiar's products.

Thanks for all the advice so far - I will report back soon!
 
Some updates.

I ordered the DP polish, but it's not going to arrive for a week :(

I decided to repeat the process from start to finish - to see if maybe I'd missed or screwed up a step before.

1. M105 on orange foam pad. Drill at half pressure (est. 1000~1500rpm). Did about 8 slow overlapping passes over the lens, moving at about 1in per second. Took a few minutes. Light-medium pressure, where the pad was compressed between 1/8 and about 1/4 (since the lens is curved). Finished with a lighter pressure pass. Result: Looks clear under inside lights, but I see a lot of swirls with my flashlight, similar to the photo. Doesn't seem to be any different to when I started.

2. Wipe down with 25% IPA. M205 on a yellow foam pad. Same process as M105. Result: no change - but maybe I just can't perceive it?

3. Same process with PlastX, but on a black pad. Looks a tiny bit less hazy, but otherwise no change that I can see.


I'm wondering whether:
- My RPMs are too fast or slow?
- I'm not making enough passes?
- The products or pads I'm using are too aggressive and are polishing out the previous step but leaving similar swirls.
- The products or pads I'm using are not aggressive enough, and there's somehow some very deep swirls in the lens that even M105 isn't removing?

It seems like something is wrong here! It's also very hard to judge progress because I'm dealing with swirls on two sides of a clear plastic lens.
 
I don't know who makes your pads but in the LC realm the yellow is more aggressive than the orange and if that's the same with yours then I wouldn't use the yellow with the 205 I would use orange with 105 and something lighter like white or green or pink with the 205.

I use either a cutting pad or light cutting pad with my DP stuff. If the picture gallery was fixed I was going to post a pic for you of some headlights I just did.

Ive also not seen someone go at the insides of the headlights, can you let us know why you decided to take them apart and do it that way?
 
Good catch on the pads if they are LC or B&S. You also said you had a white pad. If it is either of the above, it would have less cut than the yellow or orange.

I have polished the outside and inside of one of my headlights. I did mine because wanted to rebuild my broken lens for cheap and found a set of poorly retrofitted lights as a donor. Mine were scratched up from poor handling and the HID basically sat touching the lens.

To help me see better, I worked one side at a time and taped off the other side with blue painters tape. I think black electrical tape would show the defects better.

Once I was satisfied, I did the same with the other side.
 
rob42 said:
Thanks for the advice everyone!

The DP polish looks interesting - but I want to be sure it will solve my swirl problem before ordering and waiting a week for it to arrive!

I did some more experimenting to work out where the swirls are coming from. I wet sanded with 3000 grit paper in a single direction until all the swirls were gone. I then applied m205 by hand - on a brand new microfiber applicator. That cleared the haze from the 3000 grit paper - but reintroduced the swirls.

I repeated the whole process with mothers plastic polish. Swirls again!?

I'm wondering if my lens is very very soft, and even very mild compounds/polishes are swirling it. Is that even possible? It's from an 01 Mazda Miata.

Either that or my technique is somehow causing this?

Is there a polish that has even less cut/marring than mothers plastic polish?
Click to expand...
Just a thought:
•What product are you going to use to
"seal" the lens with?

-Some "sealers" may require a roughed-up
surface...so they have something to bite into.
-In that case:
A totally scratch-free lens just may not be ideal.


Bob
 
dcjredline said:
Ive also not seen someone go at the insides of the headlights, can you let us know why you decided to take them apart and do it that way?
Click to expand...


The headlights had a very thin clear finish on the inside that was failing ("holes" were appearing). Not sure what caused it to fail, but I had no choice but removing it.

As far as pads go, I had been using a generic set of 4" pads, where the orange was firmest. I've just ordered a set of 4" Chemical Guys Hex-logic pads in orange, white and black. Hopefully the better quality pads will make a difference. I'll try M105 on the orange, and 205 on the white. Probably starting with the 205 first. Maybe some polish on the black if things look good. The blue tape idea sounds good too - I'll pick up a roll.

These lenses are annoying because there's a tight corner that's impossible to get to with a pad, and there are raised grooves in some places.

For sealing the lens, I was going to apply X-Pel clear vinyl to the outsides to protect the lenses once the defects are gone. I hadn't thought much about the insides. I wouldn't want them to UV haze on the inside now the existing coating is gone - what a pain to fix! Would a UV resistant clear on the inside be a good idea? I suppose it might fill in the fine swirls? I wouldn't want to lose clarity of the lens though.
 
I'm not sure on the UV clear coats. I went with Opti-Lens inside and out. It's pricey but seems very good, and you can get a lot of applications out of it if you keep it sealed up tight. It also seems to act how some people talk about paint coatings acting in that it seems to be self cleaning and the not much sticks to it.

If you are only planning on doing yours, you could use it then offer it up as a trade in the samples thread for something you want. Just a thought.
 
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