Rust or Rust Dust Spots or Something Else???

[whoRyou]

Hi everyone


N00bie here. Recently a stalker, nowa registered member. I hope some of you can advise me what to do with my predicament. I recently purchased a 2010 Acura TSX. I noticed my hood and trunk was lightly dusted white before purchasing it. My mechanic (who actually picked the car out for me and told me to buy it. He informed me not to worry about anything as he would take care of the situation. (In the past he has helped with my other cars, so I didn’t think anything of it.) After reading here and another forum I came to the conclusion that I either had a clear coat failure or an oxidation problem. We (myself and my mechanic) concluded that it was the former – clear coat failure.

Recently he finished waxing and repainted and I acquired the car the day before yesterday. Well, yesterday I noticed that there are 2 small sizes (attached picture) of rust on my hood. So, immediately I called my mechanic today and he said he I could come over and he would use touch up paint to fix the problem. I didn’t have time today to see him, but does that sound right??? So, tonight I dug a little deeper on here and was wondering are these “rail dust spots”? How to Remove Rail Dust with CarPro IronX and a Clay Bar | Ask a Pro Blog The 2 spots seem bigger than what is shown here on the link. So, I don’t know what to think. Or do you think it could be something else? Can it be fixed? Should I trust him again and let him ‘try again’ or what??? :dunno: Also, will touch up paint mess up my new paint and how can I take care of the repainted car once I fix this problem? If you can't see the pic let me know and I'll take another one. TIA Feed back please UGH!

 

[Eldorado2k]

I’m not sure if I’m seeing exactly what you’re talking about in the picture because I’m viewing it through my phone, but if you’re referring to the 2 spots just underneath the panel line then the 1st thing you should try is some Detailing Clay. You can order some here or pick up a Meguiars Detailing Clay Kit locally.

Follow the easy directions and if it is rail dust it’ll come off when you clay it.
As far as those iron removing sprays... Yea they work on a broad scale over the entire vehicle, but IME when it comes to distinct large spots that won’t come clean with a normal wash, it’s the clay that’s most effective.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

First - welcome to AutogeekOnline!


Second, here's your picture,

And I see the black dots on the bumper, is this what your talking about?

Can you feel them with your finger? Are they above the surface or below the surface.


I would tend to take it back to the guy that painted it and show it to him and ask him what he thinks it could be. Sounds like he's done a good job of taking care of you so far.

 

[whoRyou]

Thank you both for your prompt reply to my inquiry. I blew up the picture so hopefully you two can see the rust on my hood. Again if you can't see it, I'll have to wait it's quite cloudy today. If you don't like the weather, just wait a minute is a saying around here.

And I see the black dots on the bumper, is this what your talking about?
No, that is NOT what I'm referring to. I hope the blow up pic helps and it's on my hood. Can you see what I see?

Can you feel them with your finger? Are they above the surface or below the surface.
Yes, I can feel it with my finger.

I would tend to take it back to the guy that painted it and show it to him and ask him what he thinks it could be. Sounds like he's done a good job of taking care of you so far.

A up and close pic of what I believe is RUST. I can't get better lighting the weather is NOT cooperating with me today.

 

[RobertJ34]

Yeah, that looks to definitely be chipped paint and rust underneath

Touch up paint will be a temporary fix, once something rusts, it will continue to do so until fully fixed. Rust will remain underneath even with paint over top.

Iron remover also wouldn't be a perm. solution.

 

[whoRyou]

Yeah, that looks to definitely be chipped paint and rust underneath

Touch up paint will be a temporary fix, once something rusts, it will continue to do so until fully fixed. Rust will remain underneath even with paint over top.

Iron remover also wouldn't be a perm. solution.

How can you remove rust???

 

[whoRyou]

Mike, I saw a post on here regarding Dr. Colorchip, do you believe it could work on my car How to use the Dr. ColorChip Paint Chip Repair Systems or can you recommend something else? TIA

 

[RobertJ34]

I will begin my stating I am not a professional painter/body work guy. That being said, my understanding is the area needs to be properly sanded down to bare metal and then prepped for paint. (sand down to metal, prime, paint)

Nothing against your mechanic/friend but if he just paints over it, it will eventually come back. I would make sure its done properly.

 

[tomsteve]

im with robert. imo, IF that area was repainted, then prepwork fell short. its not the best of light or angles in the pic but it looks like filler was put over that rust then painted. no proper prep work and the filler popped off.
pictures in better light and from different angles would help.

 

[whoRyou]

I hope this pic is better, if not let me know.

View attachment 68511



The texture is smooth suprisingly. I tried to show 'layers' (not sure if that is the right terminology) of the paint and rust.

TIA everyone ...

 

[SWETM]

I hope this pic is better, if not let me know and I'll open the hood. The texture is smooth suprisingly. I tried to show 'layers' (not sure if that is the right terminology) of the paint and rust. TIA everyone ...

If I understand you right this hood was recently repainted? And if so did he paint the whole hood or just where it where needed as in touch up?

Either way it's not a good prep work. It's hard to see and know just from pictures. But it's on the edge and the metall can be comprimised so much of the rust so it's needed to be replaced. How does it look when you open the hood and how the edge looks from the other side of it? Is it rust there too or is the paint intact there?

It's very possible from a rock chip that where through the clearcoat and base coat layer and primer to the bare metall. And have been unprotected bare metall for a long time. The easiest fix honestly would be to buy a salvage hood and paint it in the color you have if you don't find the same color on it. The next depending on how it looks around the edge would be to cut out the bad metall and puncture weld a fresh peice of metall and use a filler to build up to the rest of the hood. This need some experience with it though. If you are going to be fixing it in a temporary way that can hold up a year or more it's hard to say. It's to sand it down so you don't have any rust. Paint with a self etching primer that you can use some filler on it. The self etching primer is to stop the rusting and needs to be done around the edge and maybe also right under on the other side of the chip. Filling and sanding and repaint or touch up paint it. It also depends on the look from it that you want to get. If you want to get it as new it's a replacement hood and repaint it. And if you can live with that you maybe not get it to look perfect. A very thorough prep work with stopping the rust and it's a sealer or a self etching primer I know of that's able to do it. But it's a hard spot to fix an edge like that. If you repaint the whole hood which is necessary when you have a base color coat and then clearcoat to have look good. Then if you do a touch up repaint you will be seeing it when you are close and depending on the skill of the prep work and painting. You will get close to notice it and you can notice it from afar if it's not any good.

Rail dust and brake dust you see as very small dots. It's very big if it's like a small pinhead needle for a reference. The problem is that it's usually very hot when it hits the paint and melts in the thin clearcoat. And in a microscope you would see it has jagged edges that gets like fish hooks holding on to the paint or in the paint. Then it oxidize/rust and gets bigger in volume so it's hanging on in the paint cause of that. So when you use an iron remover which these days has bleeding reaction. It desolves the oxidized/rusted parts and even the smallest size of the solid metall. When it does this it desolves to a liquid form with the iron remover and this liquid solution is purple colored. So if you don't have any kind of iron particals and industrial fallout on the paint you will not see any bleeding effect from it. Then it's hard to see the bleeding reaction on darker paints cause of the purple color from it. Before this they used acid to desolve the iron particals. When the iron partical is desolved if not the whole so the jagged edges or the rust it's usually just needed to be rinsed off. In some cases they may need to be aggitated a little for more effective desolving or even get pulled out with claying it off after the iron remover. Many times a claying does get it off but if it's stubborn and deep in the paint the clay can be just shaving off the top of the iron particals.

I use the iron remover first and then PW clean rinsing it off. And where I had the most bleeding reaction I test spot with apply the iron remover again and if it still bleeds. A second application with aggitate it when it's almost dwelled enough to be rinsed off. If I'm going to be polishing I will clay it anyways. And if not I test it again and on a small spot and see if it bleeds still. Then it's claying or plan of doing a polishing in the near future. Also a great iron remover desolves it better and it's not easy to know this if you don't compare different ones side by side on how effective they are. Cause it's not by how much it bleeds or how dark the purple gets or how fast it reacts. A safe choice to go with is Carpro IronX as it's known to be one of the most effective ones out there.

 

[whoRyou]

Sorry I just want to try to upload the pix again with the hood up

View attachment 68517

View attachment 68518

 

[vobro]

If that panel was repainted and you have that large of a rust area that means either the painter completely missed prepping the panel before paint or he haphazardly painted over the rust and the paint didn't adhere. I'm not sure of the agreement you had but if that panel was indeed painted I would not be happy, also that's a large chunk so a "touch up " job will also look awful

 

[tomsteve]

Sorry I just want to try to upload the pix again with the hood up View attachment 68517 View attachment 68518.

open the hood and look on at the underside of that edge. the sheetmetal should be folded over on itself right there. is that rusted up? if so, your best bet is a new hood becuase what youre seeing on the outside started on the inside.

looks like yer painter slathered some filler over the rust,feathered it out, and sprayed new paint

 

[whoRyou]

open the hood and look on at the underside of that edge. the sheetmetal should be folded over on itself right there. is that rusted up? if so, your best bet is a new hood becuase what youre seeing on the outside started on the inside.

looks like yer painter slathered some filler over the rust,feathered it out, and sprayed new paint

I opened the hood and no, it isn't rusted up.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Sorry I just want to try to upload the pix again with the hood up

View attachment 68517

View attachment 68518

I downloaded the above two pictures and then cropped out the fluff.

Those look like rust spots that were not correctly dealt with when the trunk like was re-painted. Any painter worth his salt would have removed the rust and then prepped the area for paint before painting.



From your first post on page 1 of this thread...

Hi everyone

N00bie here. Recently a stalker, nowa registered member.

Thanks for joining the forum. How long you been a Lurker?

I recently purchased a 2010 Acura TSX.

I noticed my hood and trunk was lightly dusted white before purchasing it. My mechanic (who actually picked the car out for me and told me to buy it. He informed me not to worry about anything as he would take care of the situation. (In the past he has helped with my other cars, so I didn’t think anything of it.)

After reading here and another forum I came to the conclusion that I either had a clear coat failure or an oxidation problem.

We (myself and my mechanic) concluded that it was the former – clear coat failure.

I'm pretty sure I have more articles showing pictures of clearcoat failure than anyone breathing including any YouTube Influencer. :laughing:

Here's a couple,

From 2007
The Clearcoat Failure Photo Archive

From 2009
The Clearcoat Failure Photo Gallery Archive


From 2010
Beginning Clearcoat Failure


What I see in the pictures is a place where the paint has chipped away and exposed rusting steel that's a part of the panel.

Recently he finished waxing and repainted and I acquired the car the day before yesterday. Well, yesterday I noticed that there are 2 small sizes (attached picture) of rust on my hood. So, immediately I called my mechanic today and he said he I could come over and he would use touch up paint to fix the problem. I didn’t have time today to see him, but does that sound right???

I don’t know what to think. Or do you think it could be something else? Can it be fixed? Should I trust him again and let him ‘try again’ or what???

Touch-up paint will cover the rust and stick for a while but the steel will keep rusting and this will cause the paint to lift off and you'll be back to the same problem.

The car is a 2010 Acura, it's 2019, let's just call it 2020. So the car is now 10 years old. Depending upon the geographical location the car has spent it's life, the small rust spots could be just that, 2 isolated rust spots. OR this could be a sign of a more rust hidden by the paint.

Also, will touch up paint mess up my new paint and how can I take care of the repainted car once I fix this problem? If you can't see the pic let me know and I'll take another one.

TIA

First - I have an article on how to use the Dr. Color Chip Paint Chip Repair System.

How to use the Dr. ColorChip Paint Chip Repair Systems



I think in post #9 I state,

The key to success with a business like this is a couple of things,

One is under promise and over deliver.

DON'T promise your customer they'll never be able to see where the rock chips were... because it's not that type of perfectionist work. It's vitally important that you set your customer's expectations accordingly.

If a person never wants to see where the rock chips were... tell them to get a paint job.

Keep it real. After using this system the owner can stand back about 5' from the car and not see the previously unsightly rock chips and that's what it's all about.

So I teach people that ANY brand of touch-up paint system will not fix the chips 100% without a LOT of time and work and even then, hard to say if it will look perfect.

Most people have SUPER HIGH EXPECTATIONS

That's because most people have not tried to fill in a rock chip. Most people think they should be able to put their NOSE against the panel and NOT see the repair. That's calla a NEW PAINT JOB. If you're good with not seeing touch-up paint from about 5 feet away, then someone that is truly GOOD with doing touch-up work will probably make you happy.

But the underlying problem is the visible rust. A proper repair means removing the visible rust and checking for MORE RUST further under the paint that's still adhering to the panel.


Me?

I don't know what you paid for this car but it is a "used car". If it's in great mechanical condition, I'd sand the rusted areas until the rust is gone and then apply matching touch-up paint and then stick a fork in it, call it done and get back to my life.

Over the last 26 years, I've answered a LOT of questions dealing with little tiny areas of a person's car when the REST OF THE CAR looks like crap because it's all swirled out. I tell people and teach people what I call,

Big Picture Detailing

Focus on the major portion of the panels, not the little tiny areas.

How does the rest of the car look in full overhead sunlight?


How to inspect paint for swirls using overhead sunlight


Swirls and scratches are the most common consumer complaint when it comes to a car's appearance. If you're new to detailing, here's one simple method you can use to inspect a car's finish for swirls.


First you need a sunny day with bright overhead sunlight.

Then stand to the side of your car where you can see the sunlight reflecting off the hood. If there are any swirls they’ll show up.

As I look at the finish on this brand new Audi, I happy to see that there are NO SWIRLS. This is how a nice or new paint job should look in the sun.

NOTE: This car would NOT work for a demo car at a car show to show attendees how to remove swirls.

You cannot inspect for swirls with the sun at your back as this is the wrong position to see sun rays bouncing off the car's finish.

What do swirls look like?
If you have a car that’s a few years older than chances are there are swirls in the clearcoat paint, especially if the car has been taken through an automatic car wash. To show you what swirls would look like using overhead sunlight, here’s the hood of an older BMW I detailed. These are the before shots when I was inspecting the paint.