Tough removal of Sonax EX 04-06 - fun turned frustrating

[WorldMattyBlue]

I finally tried the EX 04-06 for the first time and had very mediocre results. A lot of elements here so I'll try to keep it short. It's a daily driven BMW 5-serires. I wanted to try something new going into this winter, so i went with the Sonax EX 04-06 and Chemical Guys Hex-Logic green pads. I've used my PC 7336 for close to 15 years so i'm familiar with the machine, but the pad/polish combo is new for me. Car was prepped as i normally would - wash, decon, clay, and prep spray.

During the test spot, application went smooth, nothing out of the ordinary. When wiping clean, it didn't immediately buff off and I had to really work the towel. I tried using less product, and more product, same results. I tried a new test spot, again had the same results. I increased the machine speed, no luck. I tried working with fewer passes, and then more and longer passes. Same outcome. Pads were blowing out clean and as expected.

I broke out some Megs Ultimate Compound with a fresh pad, and tried on the same spot, and a new test spot and it buffed out clean and easy both times. Immediate reaction was that the Megs seems like you're working with more product, something i never noticed until the back to back with the 04-06. Sonax was still visually there, but it was much harder to see the product, even when i increased the amount used.

The Megs also gave a better result, better cutting and better finishing.

Questions:
1. Think it's possible i was still using too little product?
2. Could i have been working it too long, or too short?
3. Pad/polish combo not ideal?
4. Is this expected behavior?

Any thoughts or feedback?

Thanks!

 

[WorldMattyBlue]

Some pics for fun

Sent from my iPhone using Autogeekonline mobile app

 

[Desertnate]

I'm not familiar with the pad, so I can't comment on what effect it may have on your issues.

I have used 04-06 before and never had an issue with removing it. Without being there to see what is going on in person, it sounds to me like you worked it way too long. How many passes did you make of that area?

One thing I've noticed with 04-06 is, despite Sonax's description of it being a "medium poslish", it has very little cut. When I used it on my black metallic 4-series, it offered almost no correction at all on the harder BMW paint. These days I only use it on soft Japanese paint, but even then I'd say it corrects less than Optimum Hyperpolish. The gloss is pretty good, but correction is really low.

 

[WorldMattyBlue]

I started with 4 quick passes, then tried 4 longer passes, then 2 quick, 2 long, and then 6 quick. Essentially the same results each time.

I saw very little cut as well, so it certainly seems like this isn't the combo for me with this car.

Did you find a solution you were happy with on the 4 series?

 

[Dr Oldz]

How much product are you using?

 

[Desertnate]

How much product are you using?

This is a good question and a possible factor if overwork is the culprit.

Did you find a solution you were happy with on the 4 series?

I really liked Blackfire's Compound paired with a white Lake Country Flat or ThinPro pad. At the time, I was using a Harbor Freight DA polisher, not all that different from your PC polisher. With the Blackfire and the white pads I was able to do a one-step polish every couple of years when I was replacing the coating. When I bought the car it was a little rough in spots, but I was able to step up to an orange LC pad and use the same Blackfire product to clean up those spots.

The Blackfire Compound really isn't that aggressive. I'd put it as somewhere between what most people call a compound and a medium polish, which is actually why I liked it when dealing with harder paints. It has a good bite, yet finishes out really nicely.

 

[WorldMattyBlue]

How much product are you using?

I started with 4 blueberry size dots, but also tried 3 and 5. That's what I've used with other polishes in the past.

Something else i'm wondering about, maybe there was still some Beadmaker on the paint and the Megs was able to cut through it, and the Sonax wasn't.

I went to do more testing today but i tore the backing plate when changing pads. I'm going to use that as an excuse to get a new machine I'm leaning towards the Hercules forced rotation DA that people seem happy with. The PC was very sensitive to stalling so it would be a nice change to be able to focus a little less on keeping the pads moving.

Thanks again!

 

[Paul A.]

Tearing a BP doesn't really mean replacing the machine...it means replacing the BP.

I'm confused...

My PC7336 served me well for 10-12 years. Use speed 6 and vary machine down pressure to "finesse" either pad/product or paint...or both. Even though Sonax products work better with rotary applications doesn't mean you can't finesse it with a PC DA. I've never had a problem with Perfect Finish and a DA. 3 blueberry size product and work til it almost disappears.

 

[Bri26]

In general, I have found hard to remove polish is due to using either using too much product and/or not breaking the product down enough. Generally, it will turn clear when it's been broken down enough which is usually at least two really slow passes or 3 or 4 slow to medium arm speed passes.

I follow Esoteric on YouTube and they highly recommend Sonax perfect finish which should be really similar to EX 04-06. They only use three pea size drops and 4 section passes. I have also used perfect finish, it's really important to shake the bottle really well before use, less product is better and to make sure you let the product break down all the way. I would try it again with a speed of 5 or 6, 3 or 4 pea size drops, slow to medium arm speed, light pressure, work a 2x2 section using 4 section passes.

If it still doesn't work well, see if the bottle has a date on it. Perhaps it's a few years old and has gone bad.

 

[Lance Mark]

I've had some product sit a bit too long after i polished, or I used too much or too little....not sure, but generally, after a correction step, one swipe of a microfiber pulls up the lion's share of the spent product on the paint

every once in a while, it doesn't cooperate....I usually don't try to buff it too much at this point if I can avoid it

rather than work the surface with the MF to get it off, I'll usually do a quick sprits of prep, and it cleans up slick and quick

 

[Desertnate]

I've had some product sit a bit too long after i polished, or I used too much or too little....not sure, but generally, after a correction step, one swipe of a microfiber pulls up the lion's share of the spent product on the paint

every once in a while, it doesn't cooperate....I usually don't try to buff it too much at this point if I can avoid it

rather than work the surface with the MF to get it off, I'll usually do a quick sprits of prep, and it cleans up slick and quick

I've experienced something similar. Before I started using coatings and had a panel prep on hand, a spritz of QD spray would help remove and stubborn polish remnants.

 

[dlc95]

That green pad, wether it be the Hex Logic of the Buff and Shine is my most used pad for starting paint corrections. And that machine is my most used tool.

A lot of times when I have issues removing polish it's from generating to much heat via pressure, and tool speed. That being said I've never tried that particular polish.

That pad with Ultimate Compound was the majority of what I used for heavy cutting situations when I started using the PC in 2013 (I bought it in 2011, but was still mostly using the rotary). I've read that Meguiar's adds certain cleaners that help cut through the road grime and water spots in the formula. These ingredients could help cut through previously applied protection, which could also be a culprit in difficult wipe off.

I did a car for a co-worker. I started it at the shop, but had to finish it at home. In the interim I applied Optimum Car Wax to protect it for the week until I could get to it. Big mistake. On this car I started with 3D ONE on a Buff and Shine Uro-Fiber, and on the outside perimeter of the work area therer was a build up that didn't want to wipe off. So I did a panel wipe with Optimum Power Clean to remove the wax, and a "rinse" with ONR in a spray bottle. This took care of that situation.

 

[WorldMattyBlue]

Thanks all! I did a few more tests, and also bought some new goodies, including the Hercules forced rotation DA.

I put a new backing plate on the PC, broke out the Sonax and a green pad, and tested on my wife’s VW Atlas. All the same equipment and prep as with my car.

Experience was pretty different and results were good. Aside from just being another car, another color…it did not have any Beadmaker on it for at least a couple months.

So I’m thinking there was still some Beadmaker on the paint, and the Megs UC had enough cut to get through. The Sonax didn’t have enough cut, and was being pushed around with some Beadmaker.

It does make sense, and I’m going to say that was the issue so I can stop thinking about it.

Next up, test out the new DA!!


Sent from my iPhone using Autogeekonline mobile app