Transition from Polymer to Ceramic??

BenThere · Dec 31, 2020

I'm sure there's a bunch of threads on ceramic vs polymer, but my search didn't bring up specifics on making the transition from using a high-tech polymer protectant like Meguiar's NXT and going with a ceramic protectant.

If I do make the switch, a few questions:

I presume that I need to remove all the polymer from the paint surfaces since to be effective the ceramic needs to bond directly with the paint, right?
How do I get all that (years!) of polymer off and expose the virgin paint surface?
Can I seriously expect the ceramic coating to provide physical protection of the paint in the same manner as the polymer? Like parking lot brushing or shrubbery "scrapes" (like that stuff you get when 4x4'ing?
Do I/Can I add additional physical protection over the ceramic with a polymer synthetic?
- Does that even make any sense?
Maybe it's best to just stay with the NXT or other polymer synthetic and save myself the trouble; they're both about the same in overall effectiveness (physical protection as well as UV and environmental contaminants)?

I've been using NXT for years and have been pretty satisfied with the stuff. But I've noticed lately that it's not as available as it used to be; same as other polymer/synthetic protectants. The shelf space seems to be overtaken by ceramic offerings. I want to keep up with technology and use what's the best protectant for my machines, but I'm not looking for extra work that won't add value.

Whatdaya think? Am I over-analyzing? Anybody gone through this "transition"?

Mike Phillips · Dec 31, 2020

Because this is your first post,

Welcome to AutogeekOnline! :welcome:

I was just about to push away from the keyboard as we get off work early being it's the last day of the year. But - I'll do my best to answer some of your questions.

BenThere said:
I'm sure there's a bunch of threads on ceramic vs polymer, but my search didn't bring up specifics on making the transition from using a high-tech polymer protectant like Meguiar's NXT and going with a ceramic protectant.

If I do make the switch, a few questions:

[*]I presume that I need to remove all the polymer from the paint surfaces since to be effective the ceramic needs to bond directly with the paint, right?

Correct.

BenThere said:
[*] How do I get all that (years!) of polymer off and expose the virgin paint surface?

Wash and dry
Clay if needed
Machine polish
Chemically strip the paint
Install the coating

BenThere said:
[*]Can I seriously expect the ceramic coating to provide physical protection of the paint in the same manner as the polymer? Like parking lot brushing or shrubbery "scrapes" (like that stuff you get when 4x4'ing?

Nope. I've done a little wheeling in my life. You drive your truck against the bushes and the paint is going to get scratched.

That said, it used to be everyone went GA-GA over the video of a guy taking a Bic Lighter and striking coated paint.

That was supposed to be the proof of the Holy Grail of paint protection is finally here. :laughing:

BenThere said:
[*]Do I/Can I add additional physical protection over the ceramic with a polymer synthetic?

You can but you don't need to. Kind of defeats the point.

BenThere said:
[*] Does that even make any sense?

Sure does. I installed my first coating in the year 2011 - been doing it ever since and answer questions about it ever since. LOTS OF CONFUSION.

BenThere said:
[*]Maybe it's best to just stay with the NXT or other polymer synthetic and save myself the trouble; they're both about the same in overall effectiveness (physical protection as well as UV and environmental contaminants)?
[/LIST]

I've been using NXT for years and have been pretty satisfied with the stuff. But I've noticed lately that it's not as available as it used to be; same as other polymer/synthetic protectants. The shelf space seems to be overtaken by ceramic offerings. I want to keep up with technology and use what's the best protectant for my machines, but I'm not looking for extra work that won't add value.

Whatdaya think? Am I over-analyzing? Anybody gone through this "transition"?

I'm the guy that wrote the concept paper for NXT Tech Wax. Some at Meguiar's will say this isn't true. But the Vice President, Atticus Firey, (no longer there), Dick Koeth, the Strategic Planner, (since passes away), and the Head Chemist all told me it was page 31 in the report I wrote for Meguiar's called,

The Zaino Case Study

That led to the creation of NXT Tech Wax.

It's a great product. Has a little light cleaning, insane gloss and shine. Super fast to apply and get great results using a simple Porter Cable Polisher.

Here's a little write-up I did in 2004 - good read. This wax did something no other wax had ever done in the history or retail car waxes.

NXT Tech Wax the Number One Selling Liquid Wax in America!

According to NPD, Meguiar's new NXT Generation Tech Wax is the Number One selling liquid wax in America! It was released in January of 2004 and by August of 2004 (that's 8 months), it had become the number one selling wax in America. No wax had ever went from Zero to Hero that fast in the automotive retail world.

Lil Octane

I don't use it much anymore, not for any reason, just using other things. For the average Joe - good stuff. And we carry it here,

Meguiars NXT Generation Tech Wax is unlike any other car wax! Tech Wax, a synthetic, scientifically engineered paint sealant, is an alternative to

Mike Phillips · Dec 31, 2020

Mike Phillips · Dec 31, 2020

A few questions for you...

Do you currently own any type of car polisher?

Do you ever clay your truck's paint?

When is the last time you did the Baggie Test?

BenThere · Dec 31, 2020

Mike Phillips said:
A few questions for you...

Do you currently own any type of car polisher?

Do you ever clay your truck's paint?

When is the last time you did the Baggie Test?

Wow, Mike - :wow:

Great responses, and Fast! Really appreciate it! A lot to read, but I'll probably go through most of it - eventually :xyxthumbs:

Yep. A Flex DA.

Every 3 - 6 months, depending on when I wax. Not jut the truck, BTW, but the 2008 Z06 and the 2010 Challenger, both black.

~ 6 months ago. Did the Challenger and the Vette before and after a 2-step polish and the NXT.

Mike Phillips · Dec 31, 2020

BenThere said:
Wow, Mike - :wow:

Great responses, and Fast! Really appreciate it!

A lot to read, but I'll probably go through most of it - eventually :xyxthumbs:

Yeah, it's just me waxing on at length....

BenThere said:
Yep. A Flex DA.

I wrote this yesterday, I know what I share is an anathema to RUPES Fan Boys, whatever. :dunno:

The new 7" yellow and white RUPES CP foam pads are really nice on any orbital - including the BEASTS.

Buffing Pad Recommendations for the FLEX BEASTS Trio - BEAST - Supa BEAST - CBEAST

Lake Country and RUPES Foam Buffing Pads for the FLEX BEAST Trio

:buffing:

The Guz · Dec 31, 2020

BenThere said:
I'm sure there's a bunch of threads on ceramic vs polymer, but my search didn't bring up specifics on making the transition from using a high-tech polymer protectant like Meguiar's NXT and going with a ceramic protectant.

If I do make the switch, a few questions:

I presume that I need to remove all the polymer from the paint surfaces since to be effective the ceramic needs to bond directly with the paint, right?

How do I get all that (years!) of polymer off and expose the virgin paint surface?

Can I seriously expect the ceramic coating to provide physical protection of the paint in the same manner as the polymer? Like parking lot brushing or shrubbery "scrapes" (like that stuff you get when 4x4'ing?

Do I/Can I add additional physical protection over the ceramic with a polymer synthetic?

Does that even make any sense?

Maybe it's best to just stay with the NXT or other polymer synthetic and save myself the trouble; they're both about the same in overall effectiveness (physical protection as well as UV and environmental contaminants)?

I've been using NXT for years and have been pretty satisfied with the stuff. But I've noticed lately that it's not as available as it used to be; same as other polymer/synthetic protectants. The shelf space seems to be overtaken by ceramic offerings. I want to keep up with technology and use what's the best protectant for my machines, but I'm not looking for extra work that won't add value.

Whatdaya think? Am I over-analyzing? Anybody gone through this "transition"?

Mike gave you many good resources.

In short you are going to need to prep the surface to your liking.

1. Wash
2. Chemical Decontamination aka iron remover
3. Mechanical Decontamination aka claying
4. Polish. At a minimum a polish will be fine as it will remove some defects. Remember you are going to be locking in the condition of the surface so this step is going to be based on your overall satisfaction of the paints condition
5. Panel wipe. Most coating manufactures offer one. Forget the IPA.
6. Apply Coating
7. Maintain. Most coating manufactures offer directions on how to maintain.

One this to keep in mind is that coatings are not scratch proof. You want paint protection film if that is what you are after.

No need to use a polymer synthetic. You will negate the coatings characteristics. There is no rule against doing it. As I mentioned most coating manufactures offer directions and maintenance products on how to maintain their coating.

What coating(s) are you looking into?

BenThere · Dec 31, 2020

The Guz said:
Mike gave you many good resources.

In short you are going to need to prep the surface to your liking.

1. Wash
2. Chemical Decontamination aka iron remover
3. Mechanical Decontamination aka claying
4. Polish. At a minimum a polish will be fine as it will remove some defects. Remember you are going to be locking in the condition of the surface so this step is going to be based on your overall satisfaction of the paints condition
5. Panel wipe. Most coating manufactures offer one. Forget the IPA.
6. Apply Coating
7. Maintain. Most coating manufactures offer directions on how to maintain.

One this to keep in mind is that coatings are not scratch proof. You want paint protection film if that is what you are after.

No need to use a polymer synthetic. You will negate the coatings characteristics. There is no rule against doing it. As I mentioned most coating manufactures offer directions and maintenance products on how to maintain their coating.

What coating(s) are you looking into?

Well, I've mostly been a Meguiar's guy, so I'll start there first. Haven't made the decision to move over to ceramic yet, so I haven't checked 'em out much yet. Guess I outta look into what's out there and read the comments, hunh?

The Guz · Jan 1, 2021

BenThere said:
Well, I've mostly been a Meguiar's guy, so I'll start there first. Haven't made the decision to move over to ceramic yet, so I haven't checked 'em out much yet. Guess I outta look into what's out there and read the comments, hunh?

Stick with one of the big names in coatings and you will be fine.

Transition from Polymer to Ceramic??

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