very disappointed

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ViGi

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this is my firs read on MSDS, I`m interested for buying a shampoo for pressure washer. I use a lot of mafra products and they are all good products but this...???

Even sonax has a very good products but pressure washer shampoos are very strong, with high ph balance.

I don`t have other companies in my country.

Cars here in my country are very dirty and i need a good cleaner, but I`m educated from autogeek and i can`t use something that can do harm in to the vehicle even they aren`t mine, all of car washes use this kind of product, but i want to be different and not use harsh product.

I need shampoo like this if someone can help me, cleaning ability 10/10,ph neutral, quik and easy I`m talking for car wash service not detailing service and of course cheap this jeddy 2.0 and that of sonax that i mentioned they are from 25kg 70$ and dilution 1/50.

Just take a look of this product, i can never use this after i read the MSDS.

http://www.reserved.mafra.com/publi...fety Data Sheets/2014/GB/JEDY 2 0-663(GB).pdf
 
Quality and cheap are more often than not polar opposite terms. I don't know much about mass market "car wash" shampoos beyond them being pretty bad in every country (and the brushes even worse). Unfortunately when trying to avoid hand washing (cutting corners) I'm not sure you will find anything worth endorsing.
 
I found the newest line of Mafra is ECOMAF the ph scale is from 4/7 i dont know about the cleaning abilities, but may work for me. In this time that we live we have solution for everything that we could think of.

1322757484banner_ecolabel.jpg
 
the ph of m62 is 8-9.5 it is going to strip LSP this shampoo, what is all about PH in a car shampoo, I found some from sonax that are neutral 7 pH, are this ones good in cleaning abilities
 
ViGi said:
the ph of m62 is 8-9.5 it is going to strip LSP this shampoo, what is all about PH in a car shampoo, I found some from sonax that are neutral 7 pH, are this ones good in cleaning abilities
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No...M62 is not going to strip an LSP!
I've never used any of Sonax's car shampoos...No comment.


Bob
 
Don't get too worked up about pH. In this instance, I tend to agree that the product is not best suited to high end vehicle care. The details on the MSDS sheet would indicate to me that it is better described as an industrial vehicle cleaner. That said, the same 'nasty' ingredients are used in numerous products which are routinely used by UK detailers and at least one product which is also sold to the US market. I have tried to argue that this sort of product is not correct but many detailers use the products because they work. Contrary to popular belief, most LSPs are actually very hard to strip, chemically, so LSP is not a concern unless you are using the products too strong.

If you do go for neutral (ish) pH you have to accept that cleaning power is decreased. This is simple fact.

I would also encourage to not use the term 'shampoo' with regards to this type of product. A shampoo is something that is safe to use with skin contact. By that definition, almost everything with high pH is not shampoo. The product you note would be a Traffic Film Remover (TFR). The US market isn't very good at subdividing external body cleaners in this way.
 
PiPUK said:
Don't get too worked up about pH. In this instance, I tend to agree that the product is not best suited to high end vehicle care. The details on the MSDS sheet would indicate to me that it is better described as an industrial vehicle cleaner. That said, the same 'nasty' ingredients are used in numerous products which are routinely used by UK detailers and at least one product which is also sold to the US market. I have tried to argue that this sort of product is not correct but many detailers use the products because they work. Contrary to popular belief, most LSPs are actually very hard to strip, chemically, so LSP is not a concern unless you are using the products too strong.

If you do go for neutral (ish) pH you have to accept that cleaning power is decreased. This is simple fact.

I would also encourage to not use the term 'shampoo' with regards to this type of product. A shampoo is something that is safe to use with skin contact. By that definition, almost everything with high pH is not shampoo. The product you note would be a Traffic Film Remover (TFR). The US market isn't very good at subdividing external body cleaners in this way.
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Thanx PiPUK this was my goal to get a better idea about some misconceptions that I had. It was hard because here in Autogeek I don`t see people use this kind of TFR as much and always talking about using some with lower then 8 pH, and so for me 12-13 pH was something stratospheric.

I would like to go with neutral (ish) but you can`t believe how dirty cars we have in my country, and I must go with something stronger, It`s not stratospheric anymore if I go with something stronger it`s just stronger and this one It`s NOT SHAMPOO.:xyxthumbs:

Some pics what i did today with that 12/13 pH

1912219_1486090894935967_4239019400384591929_n.jpg


10259714_1486090904935966_2856802816980502923_n.jpg


10176128_1486090974935959_8004952728469474477_n.jpg


10289884_1486090991602624_3893141412992440291_n.jpg
 
Looking good. Honestly, in moderation, pH is not a big concern. AG might go on about it but many will use away at extremely high pH products thanks to the suppliers just not telling them the facts.

From my perspective, high pH is only really when you are talking about 13+. As I have noted elsewhere, even then it is not necessarily a big concern. The product you have noted would probably be one I would advise against, unless as a last resort, because it does contain a lot of the hydroxide ingredients. These are the big concern to private vehicles because the hydroxides can do a lot of damage to the likes of chrome trims, if used too strong. As you will appreciate, commercial vehicles don't tend to have that sort of thing so this sort of product is ideal for them.
 
PiPUK said:
Looking good. Honestly, in moderation, pH is not a big concern. AG might go on about it but many will use away at extremely high pH products thanks to the suppliers just not telling them the facts.

From my perspective, high pH is only really when you are talking about 13+. As I have noted elsewhere, even then it is not necessarily a big concern. The product you have noted would probably be one I would advise against, unless as a last resort, because it does contain a lot of the hydroxide ingredients. These are the big concern to private vehicles because the hydroxides can do a lot of damage to the likes of chrome trims, if used too strong. As you will appreciate, commercial vehicles don't tend to have that sort of thing so this sort of product is ideal for them.
Click to expand...

This is a bit off topic, but everyone always seems to want pH neutral wheel cleaners and soaps. I saw this product for sale the other day and it made me think of detailing... It's drinking water with a pH of 9.5:

3uda7ezu.jpg


Wondering if any geeks would drink it. I know they wouldn't use it to wash their car.
 
swanicyouth said:
Wondering if any geeks would drink it. I know they wouldn't use it to wash their car.
Click to expand...

Ha ha, that's kind of like people complaining about the price of gas, but then buy their cup of Starbucks coffee at what $40/gallon?
 
As said before, don't look strictly at the ph. But if you do and since you are based in germany I would look at Sonax Multistar (ph 11) or Sonax active foam cleaning energy (ph 6,5). Mix multistar with water and make if a 5 % solution and the ph will drop to a, for you, acceptable level. I am mostly using Multistar and it will clean very good. The foam is not as a good cleaner but better ph.

If you are using Ma-Fra, wich are good products, I would use silver foam cleaner. Great foam and nice cleaning.

Tar removers that are very common in Germany and Sweden is almost never used on cars in the states, only before correction, but here everyone is using them. All the time as well.
 
When I see a post like this, I like to point out that in 2014, there are COATINGS available to use as protection. No need to worry about PH issues. You are a perfect candidate for a permanent or semi permanent coating.
 
PiPUK said:
The product you have noted would probably be one I would advise against, unless as a last resort, because it does contain a lot of the hydroxide ingredients. These are the big concern to private vehicles because the hydroxides can do a lot of damage to the likes of chrome trims, if used too strong. As you will appreciate, commercial vehicles don't tend to have that sort of thing so this sort of product is ideal for them.
Click to expand...

Amazing. I asked for help but never believed that i will get this kind of help. "Hydroxides can do a lot of damage to the likes of chrome trims" This is my biggest problem, more specific trims that are around windows, I damaged some and was very angry, I will never want to damage someones car, I relly want to care for my consumers cars like they are mine.



porta said:
As said before, don't look strictly at the ph. But if you do and since you are based in germany I would look at Sonax Multistar (ph 11) or Sonax active foam cleaning energy (ph 6,5). Mix multistar with water and make if a 5 % solution and the ph will drop to a, for you, acceptable level. I am mostly using Multistar and it will clean very good. The foam is not as a good cleaner but better ph.

If you are using Ma-Fra, wich are good products, I would use silver foam cleaner. Great foam and nice cleaning.
Click to expand...

I`m from Macedonia and the car that I worked here was from Germany. Anyway we have dealers of Sonax and Mafra here and I use some of them.

I`m using Sonax Intensive Cleaner, and this is one that makes damage to trims, or i don`t use it correctly, i use with 1.5 gallaon spray pump, those who use this kind of products, use them with compressed air pumps.

How you use Multi-Star.

I asked one that uses Ma-Fra Silver Foam Cleaner, was very happy, then asked dealer of Ma-Fra he told me Jeddy 2.0 is more safe.

Will see what PiPUK thinks about this. I need to find MSDS for Silver Foam.


tdekany said:
You are a perfect candidate for a permanent or semi permanent coating.
Click to expand...

YOU KILLED ME. I have just one month education with detailing. BUT my mind is in bad condition (i feel this) it wants to blow, I even searched in Google for my problem. 8-10 hours a day reading and reading and reading, the other part of 24 hours is thinking and sleping.

More interesting people in my town with 70 000 residents, and for sure 20 000 cars. They don`t have idea what is coating.

What I learned, and chosed for working.
Flex 3401
Menzerna FG400 & SF4000
Duragloss 501 for one step polishing.
LC Hybryd Pads
Collonite 845
Cquk for coating
CarPro CeriGlass with Rayon pads
Eraser, IronX, Gold Plush Jr, Microfiber etc..

Looks easy, BUT before one month i didn`t have idea what are they.

Thanks to all:xyxthumbs:
 
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