Water in wax?

I'm guessing that is CG Black Wax? Looks to me like some sort of separation of the product. I wouldn't worry too much about it. Just stir it back up with a rod.

Traditional carnauba waxes do not have water as an ingredient. However, with that stuff it could be more like a low VOC sealant or wax emulsion that needs to be remixed every so often.
 
You sure it's water and not solvents separating from the solids in the wax?
 
That does not look good

Contact the manufacturer

Interested to hear what they say
 
Like suggested prior, stir it back up, and check the consistency, etc its most like separation from not begin used/mixed every so offen, you mostly see this on sealants/liquid type waxes
 
I do notice it as well on CG: Metal Polish in where I need to shake it in order to get the compound back to normal again
 
swanicyouth said:
low VOC sealant or wax emulsion that needs to be remixed every so often.
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You are awfully generous! Separating products are almost always a sign that the product isn't really market ready. You should be more firm with this - too many rope products being sold to detailers with the brand trying to bluff away!
 
PiPUK said:
You are awfully generous! Separating products are almost always a sign that the product isn't really market ready. You should be more firm with this - too many rope products being sold to detailers with the brand trying to bluff away!
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so there is no reason we should ever shake any bottle of anything we own before using??
 
PiPUK said:
You are awfully generous! Separating products are almost always a sign that the product isn't really market ready. You should be more firm with this - too many rope products being sold to detailers with the brand trying to bluff away!
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Umm, as I've seen Mike, Larry, etc. do, I shake every product before use.

And just checked, my Meg's and Menzerna products all say to shake well before use. Are you suggesting Meg's and Menzerna aren't market ready?
 
PiPUK said:
You are awfully generous! Separating products are almost always a sign that the product isn't really market ready. You should be more firm with this - too many rope products being sold to detailers with the brand trying to bluff away!
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Disagree with you. BFWD, CGs CWG, P21s Paint Cleaner, PB's Pro Polish, etc... all do this and have been top selling products for years. Because something needs to be shaken up / mixed periodically doesn't mean it's "not ready for market". If that were the case, we'd all be out a lot of salad dressing and liquid medication.
 
swanicyouth said:
Disagree with you. BFWD, CGs CWG, P21s Paint Cleaner, PB's Pro Polish, etc... all do this and have been top selling products for years. Because something needs to be shaken up / mixed periodically doesn't mean it's "not ready for market". If that were the case, we'd all be out a lot of salad dressing and liquid medication.
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Sorry but, as a professional formulator, a product which readily separates is not a stable product. Your examples are of products which have shelf lives and they should not separate out during their stated lifetime. I would actually flip your argument on its head - just because a product is a top seller, does not mean that it is technically strong. There are a great many average performing products which are top sellers - strength of marketing is potentially more important than performance.
 
PiPUK said:
Sorry but, as a professional formulator, a product which readily separates is not a stable product. Your examples are of products which have shelf lives and they should not separate out during their stated lifetime. I would actually flip your argument on its head - just because a product is a top seller, does not mean that it is technically strong. There are a great many average performing products which are top sellers - strength of marketing is potentially more important than performance.
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I'm not a professional formulator, I'm not arguing with you, just a question. It seems to me that most products with solvents the solvent is lighter than the solids so eventually they are going to separate aren't they?? Actually in a case of a soft wax aren't they designed so the solvents rise to the top and evaporate after application? Seems only logical that the solvents would rise to the top in a can sitting on a shelf...only they don't evaporate because they are in a closed container. Again not trying to argue, sounds like an opportunity for me to learn something.
 
DaveT435 said:
I'm not a professional formulator, I'm not arguing with you, just a question. It seems to me that most products with solvents the solvent is lighter than the solids so eventually they are going to separate aren't they?? Actually in a case of a soft wax aren't they designed so the solvents rise to the top and evaporate after application? Seems only logical that the solvents would rise to the top in a can sitting on a shelf...only they don't evaporate because they are in a closed container. Again not trying to argue, sounds like an opportunity for me to learn something.
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The stabilising of products is a bit of an art. Water miscible solvents tend to be fine, no matter how light. IPA, for instance, is not very dense but will basically never separate out. Solvents will start to cause issues, mostly, when they are non-polar. Whether they are 'light' or not, is almost secondary. The solvents just do not mix with water. So the job of the formulator is to get them to mix. We will use a range of additives, often surfactants, to make the oil and the water phases compatible. That will typically mean an emulsion, whether a micro/nano emulsion (which will be transparent) or a macro emulsion (which will be your opaque creams). The sign of a good formulation, is when your emulsion is stable. It is good practice that a formulation would not even make it out of the lab for testing, if it does not show a good level of stability (i.e. it does not start separating very rapidly). Assuming it does and that it then performs as hoped, a formulator should do much more in depth stability testing and should define a shelf life. It is standard practice that this process would include optimisation of the formulation to maximise the stability - this is almost a defining step between a product being a 'lash up' and one being fully developed.

The trouble with separation is that you cannot guarantee that a shake is going to return the product to the original format. Some products, it is possible but many will be manufactured using heat or high shear, which will be crucial to achieve the characteristics desired. In the absence of these, you get something that will perform differently. If you just shake such a product, then it will NOT be the same as it would have been when manufactured.

Basically, achieving stability should be something which defines a well developed product from one which is otherwise. I will admit that we do send out products which are not as stable as I would like but this tends to occur when the customer is unwilling to spend the necessary amount to get a more stable result. So, mostly, it will simple come down to money.
 
PiPUK said:
The stabilizing of products is a bit of an art.
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I have just a tiny bit of background experience working with chemists and science of creating an emulsion that does not separate and especially does not separate over time when subjected to various ranges of temperature change.


Here's what I practice and share with others and that is to always shake a product before use. Just do it. Just make it a habit. If you're using a quality product that has no separation issues at all then it certainly won't hurt to shake the product before use.

If you're working with a quality product or even a lesser quality product and there some level of separation inside the bottle the shaking won't hurt and it will help.

Most bottled products use a solid color for the plastic so there's no easy way for the human eye to see if there's any level of separation. Some companies use a clear type of plastic so you can readily see if there's separation.

Outside of throwing products away because of the unknown... just make it a "Best Practice" to shake everything that's been standing on a shelf before use.

You can even go so far when using spray-on product to "clear the pipes" which means to shake the product and then for the first pump or two spray the product into a garbage can to get rid of the product that was in the nozzle or pick-up tube so when you do start using product from the bottle it is freshly shaken, not stale from sitting isolated.


It's just a good practice if you're going to be in this for the long run.


Also, if after shaking a product you notice the product does not appear to have it's normal look or consistency, then move to the next step of either shaking it more or writing it off.


:)
 
Quite agree, shaking products should be best practice at all times, just as you should not use in direct sunlight/heat and should ensure that you don't let them dry on surfaces. The point I was making was that a well formulated product should not be separating out, if stored properly and that the market probably should question a manufacturer supplying a product which has obvious stability issues.

I would still worry about the original post, I really fear that that is an example where the separation may well be beyond acceptable repair.
 
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