New Optimum Polisher

Zubair said:
Competition breeds excellence, without it the leaders in any industry would grow fat and lazy. We the consumers only gain from it. Also dont knock something till you've tried it. Whos to say that the Optimum machine isn't well thought out and designed well? We need to get out of our bubbles guys.
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I have to laugh at this. You think knock-offs are good for anyone? Maybe for the factory in China where they build them. The people at Rupes developed and manufactured the first large stroke DA. This thing is a knock off down to the stroke, body style/shape - even the color.

All this does is make companies like Rupes not want to innovate new technology - because someone will reverse engineer it in China and the financial rewards may not be there long term.

Everyone here complains and moans when some other detailer uses a photo they took on their website. Imagine if a company basically stole a machine you came up with ??? I mean, it's hard to tell these machines apart from a few feet away. Then they want to price it just low enough to get low ballers to buy it. The guy assembling the machine prolly makes 9¢ an hour.

Rip off.

Knock off.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I'm not even knocking the existence of industry in China, or the skill of the knock-off experts. Without it, many things become available to hobbyists or homeowners that otherwise might not be. I own a knock-off Mercedes Benz Star Diagnosis machine to be able to work on my cars. The original is unavailable to anyone outside a dealership, and without the knock-off, I'd have to bring my cars in for every little thing. The fake is so good, my neighbor -- the service department foreman at the big Benz store near here -- said it is indistinguishable from the ones they were using at the dealership (before the wireless version came out).

All that said, my issue is with those who proclaim a new, untested knockoff of a respected model or brand to be great for us, a game-changer, breeds competition, etc. I ask, how so? The HF is a cheap knockoff of the already inexpensive PC, and it retails for less than half the price. The materials and workmanship of these more recent knockoffs are no different from that of the HF, yet OPT and CG have the balls to ask more than double the price of a PC just for the stolen look-and-feel of the high-end tools with which they purport to compete! Think about it for a minute. The same factories in China that churn out the $42 HF DA also make the Ansi/Optimum/TorQ etc. Same workers, same raw materials.
 
Zubair said:
Competition breeds excellence, without it the leaders in any industry would grow fat and lazy. We the consumers only gain from it. Also dont knock something till you've tried it.
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you bring up a valid point. give credit where it's do and yes porter cable came out with it first, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's the only and best option available out today (see video below). when the GG6 first came out I thought it would be the same thing as the PC in terms of power with just some cosmetic changes. then I ordered one and was blown away on how much more torque/power this thing had and not to mention the warranty Griot's offered with it as well. to me, it was a win/win situation and yes there is going to be competition that will take an existing product(s) and make it even better in which Griot's did. IMO this is the best traditional style random orbital out and for someone who is a hobbyist/enthusiast who does a few cars on the side and takes care of their own, this can do pretty much anything you need it too especially with the ever growing technology of different pads/liquids that are out today and in the future...

garry dean has ran the HF DA in this video hard for over 11 months (let's remember he does this as a profession and see's dozens and dozens of cars each month) and he gives his honest thoughts/feedback on it. like I said before, if I were to purchase a traditional style DA today, the PC would be the last choice with all the options available now...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0ZmjVJckbE
 
FWIW, I contacted a detailer in Australia about a couple months ago who has been using the Zentool and I asked him if the Zentool handles curved panels better than the Rupes since it has almost twice the power and this was his response:

"Hi Frank,

Its the same on the Zentool unfortunately. The extra wattage does not translate to more power to the paint..."
 
"Competition breeds excellence."

Great. But "competition" means you've designed your own machine, with new ideas, better materials, innovative engineering to solve tricky problems, and manage to bring it through the door at a reasonable, "competitive" price.

How does reverse-engineering an existing machine and having it built in China then charging marginally less than the original "breed competition"? In music and entertainment, that's called piracy.
 
FrankS said:
FWIW, I contacted a detailer in Australia about a couple months ago who has been using the Zentool and I asked him if the Zentool handles curved panels better than the Rupes since it has almost twice the power and this was his response:



"Hi Frank,



Its the same on the Zentool unfortunately. The extra wattage does not translate to more power to the paint..."
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Frank I hope he had more to say than that :)
 
dpk20x said:
Frank I hope he had more to say than that :)
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Here's the full response (his name is Frank also):

Hi Frank,

Its the same on the Zentool unfortunately. The extra wattage does not translate to more power to the paint.

What I use, is to use smaller pads such as 3" size. Works really well on curved areas.


Thanks
Frank

I didn't mention the 2nd part in my previous post because he's obviously using a different tool for the 3" pads and it didn't apply to the Zentool. He didn't mention what tool he uses for the 3" pads.
 
Thanks for sharing that.

Guess there's no reason to buy this machine now! I'm sure most of us were thinking a little more power was gonna translate to better pad rotation on concave and convex panels.
 
SameGuy said:
I'm not even knocking the existence of industry in China, or the skill of the knock-off experts. Without it, many things become available to hobbyists or homeowners that otherwise might not be. I own a knock-off Mercedes Benz Star Diagnosis machine to be able to work on my cars. The original is unavailable to anyone outside a dealership, and without the knock-off, I'd have to bring my cars in for every little thing. The fake is so good, my neighbor -- the service department foreman at the big Benz store near here -- said it is indistinguishable from the ones they were using at the dealership (before the wireless version came out).

All that said, my issue is with those who proclaim a new, untested knockoff of a respected model or brand to be great for us, a game-changer, breeds competition, etc. I ask, how so? The HF is a cheap knockoff of the already inexpensive PC, and it retails for less than half the price. The materials and workmanship of these more recent knockoffs are no different from that of the HF, yet OPT and CG have the balls to ask more than double the price of a PC just for the stolen look-and-feel of the high-end tools with which they purport to compete! Think about it for a minute. The same factories in China that churn out the $42 HF DA also make the Ansi/Optimum/TorQ etc. Same workers, same raw materials.
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:iagree: The first thing that people need to get unbutthurt about is that this isn't a knock off. Mechanically aside from the 21mm throw, it is completely different. Counter balance is different. Motor is different. Wiring is different.
Looks wise it is close but subtly different. Personally aside from the front handle, this version of rotary tools all look very much alike. And lol @ "they copied the color". Really? It's black. Get over it.
It is not the same tool, not the same mechanically, and no one has a monopoly on a "X-mm" throw.

And my only gripe, like yours, is the price. This thing is well south of $100 in wholesale. The sell price is solely determined by the current price of the Rupes. The wholesale could be $1 and the price wouldn't change. Hopefully HF comes out with their own 21mm throw rotary-looking DA with ergonomic front handle for $99.

Fortunately, we all know that there are other companies that will be selling clones of this polisher. Opt is not going to run the tables on this for very long. I give it less than a year before 2 or more variants are available for purchase on AG. That's just business, and IMHO it is a very good thing.
 
GanenR32 said:
I give it less than a year before 2 or more variants are available for purchase on AG. That's just business, and IMHO it is a very good thing.
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I would bet a bottle of M101 against that happening
 
SameGuy said:
I own a knock-off Mercedes Benz Star Diagnosis machine to be able to work on my cars. The original is unavailable to anyone outside a dealership, and without the knock-off, I'd have to bring my cars in for every little thing. The fake is so good, my neighbor -- the service department foreman at the big Benz store near here -- said it is indistinguishable from the ones they were using at the dealership (before the wireless version came out).
Click to expand...

hmm, pm'd
 
custmsprty said:
What a total rip off of the Rupes machine. So much for patents. I personally would never knowingly buy any machine or product that another company blatantly ignores the inventing companies patents. And I'm a proud owner of three Rupes machines.
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All the bravado ......then he buys a chinese made Griots copy of the Rupes....LOL!!!!!!!
 
d33p said:
All the bravado ......then he buys a chinese made Griots copy of the Rupes....LOL!!!!!!!
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Maybe it's a Chinese copy of the Optimum polisher, which is a Chinese copy of the Rupes. You'll need to keep your Chinese copies straight if you want to post here.
 
swanicyouth said:
Maybe it's a Chinese copy of the Optimum polisher, which is a Chinese copy of the Rupes. You'll need to keep your Chinese copies straight if you want to post here.
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All these copies make my head spin. I was just about to buy the waxedshine unit but I heard about the griots upcoming announcement like a day later so I waited and ended up ordering a g15. Hopefully it was worth it.
 
d33p said:
All these copies make my head spin. I was just about to buy the waxedshine unit but I heard about the griots upcoming announcement like a day later so I waited and ended up ordering a g15. Hopefully it was worth it.
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Dude, I don't even know what a "waxed shine unit" is - but I have my suspicions. Anyway, I'm sure the Griot's unit is pretty good.
 
I found them by accident while searching for Rupes on Ebay lol

The griots release was good timing for me but I really have no issues with people making knockoffs. At the end of the day they are only in business cause we as consumers keep buying it.
 
I don't see all the crying about people copying Rupes. Sam Walton said to take your competitors ideas and improve on them. Competition is a natural business cycle in any market. If the Rupes still are the best then they will remain the best, copies or not.
 
If they are improving on them, then great. If they are coping them, then they will probably be less than equal.

FrankS said:
Here's the full response (his name is Frank also):

Hi Frank,

Its the same on the Zentool unfortunately. The extra wattage does not translate to more power to the paint.

What I use, is to use smaller pads such as 3" size. Works really well on curved areas.


Thanks
Frank

I didn't mention the 2nd part in my previous post because he's obviously using a different tool for the 3" pads and it didn't apply to the Zentool. He didn't mention what tool he uses for the 3" pads.
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Does adding more power do anything for a non-forced rotation DA polisher?
 
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