New California member! Need help with choosing pads.

[Chaotic29]

4 oz should be plenty for one car.

thanks

If you're having to prime 6-8 pads for a single process though, it might drive you crazy knowing you're limited on product.

If you're open to stepping outside of the cg line, you can pick up meguiars ultimate compound or scratch x OTC for under $10

I already have some meguires UP, need to get the UC and scratch x also. thanks for the reminder. I love trying new products, but cg is what the wife's parents got me for christmas and im just wanting to try it.

Totally agree with the white, green and blue ccs pads being versatile.

Meguiar's used to do all their demos with UC, UP, and SX on their yellow polishing pad. According to one of Todd Helme's charts, the white and green ccs is right there with that yellow Megs pad.

Pink ccs might be worth looking into as well.

thanks. Im liking the idea of the white ccs

Well if you are considering doing a few vehicles for others.... I'd definitely get more pads!

Go ahead and go with all 5½" because the PC, and especially the GG6 can run them like crazy. AND.... they are considerably cheaper!

I'd get 6 orange, 6 white, (in the 5½" flat pad).For the CCS you could get the 3 pink and 3 green. The pink cuts less than orange but is still a firm pad, where the green still cuts (they say more than white) but is a REALLY soft foam. The CCS pads are the only ones that have pink and green. Then get 4 blue and 2 black (or 3/3) in either CCS or flat.

I mentioned 6 white, again because they can be both a compound and polishing pad. I have more white pads than anything, from flat, to hydro, to hybrid, to constant pressure, to CCS, over 2 dozen.

The thing with about working with Menzerna (DAT) product is you have to work them through their complete cycle to get the most out of them. This means you might end up with 8~10 section passes whether it's compounding or polishing.

With Meguiar's (SMAT) products they cut hard, first time, second time, each time. When working on your "process" you'll not want to go more than 4 section passes, keep the speeds down to 4~5 tops, and a nice even arm pressure and arm speed. Wipe it clean and inspect the process. It may be you can go 6 passes, but don't go in doing that until you know what 4 does with your paint, especially Subaru paint. They don't break down, therefore you end up with more spent product and abraded paint piled up around the micro-abrasives, which makes it important to not work SMAT based products too long.



Thanks for reminding me about the pink pads! :dblthumb2: I've been using so many others lately that I forgot I had them. (Mentioned them above for the OP.... and the difference between them and the green ones.)

White is seeming like a good happy medium that i can use more often and just use either a lighter or heavier cutting compound or polish depending on what i am doing at the moment. Seems versatile, thanks for the info.

 

[cardaddy]

White is seeming like a good happy medium that i can use more often and just use either a lighter or heavier cutting compound or polish depending on what i am doing at the moment. Seems versatile, thanks for the info.

Yup.... white pads are a good happy medium, (in several different configurations). The pink pads may indeed be a great choice, especially with soft paint as they'll cut less than orange, hence less chance of micro-marring. :xyxthumbs:

 

[dlc95]

Yup.... white pads are a good happy medium, (in several different configurations). The pink pads may indeed be a great choice, especially with soft paint as they'll cut less than orange, hence less chance of micro-marring. :xyxthumbs:

The pink are pretty porous though, and they feel much rougher than the orange, and even the yellow pads.

On that note, the Rupes blue foam is reportedly very coarse, and porous also. It's also reported to cut and finish well.

Mike Phillips indicated that abrasive type is the most critical factor in cutting / polishing, and I have to agree with that. This also makes good sense to at least start out with the white flat or ccs to do the compounding and polishing.

 

[Chaotic29]

The pink are pretty porous though, and they feel much rougher than the orange, and even the yellow pads.

On that note, the Rupes blue foam is reportedly very coarse, and porous also. It's also reported to cut and finish well.

Mike Phillips indicated that abrasive type is the most critical factor in cutting / polishing, and I have to agree with that. This also makes good sense to at least start out with the white flat or ccs to do the compounding and polishing.

Well is orange going to be overkill? should i just get 4 white and 2 black,... or 2 orange,5 white and 2 black? or another combo lol idk yet

Im trying to stay with either 6 or 9 pads if possible to keep cost low right now. haha the wife already thinks im dumb buying car cleaning supplies. But then she doesnt complain too much because her car is always clean

 

[Guessless]

Well,
here is what Mike Phillips said on another thread, it should help you in deciding.

Just a couple of notes from your's truly:
-Always best to have a couple of extra pads on hand in case of damage to a pad, or running short of them while doing corrections etc. etc., you can keep them unused until the time comes when you need them rather than waiting for a shipment to come in.
-If you know the condition of your paint then you know which pads to get, so if your ride doesn't need compounding well then you don't need those pads now (you'll probabaly need them in the future though specially if you work on other cars too).

Some guys try to buff out entire cars with a single pad per product. That's usually due to inexperience. Thus when they make their initial purchase they don't know to get more pads versus less pads.

Once a person gets into the middle of the correction step and their one or two foam pads are wet with product, (pad saturation), and if they're paying attention they notice it's taking longer to get the same work done than when they first started with a clean, dry pad, then it starts to sink in that more pads are better.

The correction step is the most pad intensive step so get more correction pads, these would be cutting pads.

Polishing goes faster as you're only cleaning up what the correction step left behind and maximizing gloss and clarity.

If you machine apply your waxes and sealants then you really only need one pad for this step.


For a 1965 Mustang or for a 2015 Honda Accord and the paint is trashed, that is filled with swirls, scratches, water spots and oxidation, then here's a good rule of thumb for the optimum number of pads to have on hand assuming you're using a Porter Cable type dual action polisher.

Porter Cable 7424XP
Correction = Orange LC Flat Pad
Polishing = White or Black LC Flat Pad
Sealing = Blue LC Flat Pad

Correction step = 6 pads
1 for the hood
1 for the roof and trunk lid
2 for driver's side
2 for passenger side


Polishing step = 4 pads (You could probably get away with 3 if you use 1 for hood, roof and trunk lid)

1 for the hood
1 for the roof and trunk lid
1 for driver's side
1 for passenger side

Sealing the paint step = 1 waxing pad
Use over entire vehicle




For a Flex 3401
Correction = Orange Hybrid
Polishing = White Hybrid
Sealing = Black Hybrid

From experience, you can push the orange hybrid pads further than most pads plus the Flex 3401 simply doesn't care if the pads are wet with product it's going to rotate them no matter what. Not that using a squishy wet pad is a good thing just saying...

One thing for sure, a fresh, clean, dry orange hybrid pad with a top notch compound cuts fast on the Flex 3401.

Correction step = 6 pads
1 for the hood
1 for the roof and trunk lid
2 for driver's side
2 for passenger side

Polishing step = 4 pads (You could probably get away with 3 if you use 1 for hood, roof and trunk lid)

1 for the hood
1 for the roof and trunk lid
1 for driver's side
1 for passenger side

Sealing the paint step = 1 waxing pad
Use over entire vehicle



For Rupes Bigfoot

Same as pads for a Porter Cable. Basically, more is better and as soon as any pad starts to become wet with product it's going to be faster and more effective to switch to a clean, dry pad.




Big picture...

Being able to switch to a clean dry pad always trumps plowing through with a wet soggy pad. Foam pads become wet or saturated with product the longer you buff, that's just the nature of foam and liquids.

A fresh, clean dry pad works better, whether it's for major correction work or minor polishing work.

A fresh, clean dry pad make you and your time more effective and enables you to do any paint polishing process as fast as possible.

Switching to a fresh clean, dry pad OFTEN means less wear-n-tear on pads in general and you'll get more use or extended life out of each pad overall. Pushing a pad to the point that it's completely saturated with product wears out the foam, the Velcro and the adhesive faster than stopping the use of the pad after a panel or two.

Buffing with wet pads increases the heat retention inside the pad and to the backing plate and heat is never a good thing in any buffing process.

There's only positive aspects to having more pads as compared to having less pads.

 

[cardaddy]

The pink are pretty porous though, and they feel much rougher than the orange, and even the yellow pads.

On that note, the Rupes blue foam is reportedly very coarse, and porous also. It's also reported to cut and finish well.

Mike Phillips indicated that abrasive type is the most critical factor in cutting / polishing, and I have to agree with that. This also makes good sense to at least start out with the white flat or ccs to do the compounding and polishing.

The pink are porous, but they do cut less than the orange ones. Then they 'say' the green ones cut more than the white, but as you may already know.... the white ones are very dense, where the green ones are pretty darned soft. Go figure..... :dunno:

I couldn't agree MORE on those Rupes blue pads. Oh My Freaking GOD are they scary to look at and feel! I've used them a couple times with my Duetto (on hard paint) and was simply blown away at how well they finished. Remembering of course that the "Rupes System" doesn't require priming a pad like we normally do, just a few drops. Seemed weird the first time, and still freaks me out when I 'get out of my comfort zone' and go to the Rupes chemicals.

FWIW I use their pads on my Duetto (along with LC pads) with both Megs SMAT and Menz DAT products.

Well is orange going to be overkill? should i just get 4 white and 2 black,... or 2 orange,5 white and 2 black? or another combo lol idk yet

Im trying to stay with either 6 or 9 pads if possible to keep cost low right now. haha the wife already thinks im dumb buying car cleaning supplies. But then she doesnt complain too much because her car is always clean

Orange will not be overkill, but using them with a really heavy cut SMAT compound will. Stay away from Megs M105 at all cost (especially as a newcomer to DA polishing no matter WHAT paint you're working on) and with soft Subaru paint I'd stay away from

Megs M101 (although it's a GREAT compound). Megs UC, ScratchX, 205 and UP are all great contenders.

Then you could go with Menzerna FG400 for heavy correction yet it'll finish down really well, or on that Subaru paint you might want to look at Menz 1000 followed by 4000.

Remembering that you are wanting to stick with 5½" pads, that'll keep the cost down. There is just no way though that I can see making 6 pads work. Like I mentioned before, I'd like to see a "Detailers Dozen" with 13 but I've been saying that for years and nobody has picked up on it yet. Are you listening AGO??????? If you get only white, and you can't get the job done you will STILL have to order 4 orange at least to get your compounding done. I'd still say 4 orange, 4 white, 3 blue, 1 black. (or 2 blue, 2 black). The thing about black is they literally are not doing any work, it's just the product that is cutting at that point. I use black for applying sealant and wax and that's it. Blue OTOH can actually cut a bit. These are of course in the realm of flat pads.

The CCS pads having a straight, flat, sharp edge are better for getting right up to edges.

On the cut side of things.....
Where it got a bit tricky was thinking of the CCS pads where you get the pink that's a firm foam and is thrown there between orange and white, then the green says it cuts more than white but it's a really soft pad. I tend to think it cuts less than white but more than blue (FOR SURE). One thing is the green ones break in really quickly and become even more soft after just the first use. I don't have but 3~4 of those in each size (5½" & 6½") and just don't use them much.

 

[dlc95]

The pink are porous, but they do cut less than the orange ones. Then they 'say' the green ones cut more than the white, but as you may already know.... the white ones are very dense, where the green ones are pretty darned soft. Go figure..... :dunno:

I couldn't agree MORE on those Rupes blue pads. Oh My Freaking GOD are they scary to look at and feel! I've used them a couple times with my Duetto (on hard paint) and was simply blown away at how well they finished. Remembering of course that the "Rupes System" doesn't require priming a pad like we normally do, just a few drops. Seemed weird the first time, and still freaks me out when I 'get out of my comfort zone' and go to the Rupes chemicals.

FWIW I use their pads on my Duetto (along with LC pads) with both Megs SMAT and Menz DAT products.



Orange will not be overkill, but using them with a really heavy cut SMAT compound will. Stay away from Megs M105 at all cost (especially as a newcomer to DA polishing no matter WHAT paint you're working on) and with soft Subaru paint I'd stay away from

Megs M101 (although it's a GREAT compound). Megs UC, ScratchX, 205 and UP are all great contenders.

Then you could go with Menzerna FG400 for heavy correction yet it'll finish down really well, or on that Subaru paint you might want to look at Menz 1000 followed by 4000.

Remembering that you are wanting to stick with 5½" pads, that'll keep the cost down. There is just no way though that I can see making 6 pads work. Like I mentioned before, I'd like to see a "Detailers Dozen" with 13 but I've been saying that for years and nobody has picked up on it yet. Are you listening AGO??????? If you get only white, and you can't get the job done you will STILL have to order 4 orange at least to get your compounding done. I'd still say 4 orange, 4 white, 3 blue, 1 black. (or 2 blue, 2 black). The thing about black is they literally are not doing any work, it's just the product that is cutting at that point. I use black for applying sealant and wax and that's it. Blue OTOH can actually cut a bit. These are of course in the realm of flat pads.

The CCS pads having a straight, flat, sharp edge are better for getting right up to edges.

On the cut side of things.....
Where it got a bit tricky was thinking of the CCS pads where you get the pink that's a firm foam and is thrown there between orange and white, then the green says it cuts more than white but it's a really soft pad. I tend to think it cuts less than white but more than blue (FOR SURE). One thing is the green ones break in really quickly and become even more soft after just the first use. I don't have but 3~4 of those in each size (5½" & 6½") and just don't use them much.

Before I even knew of the Rupes technique for applying their polishes to pads, I adopted that technique to my first set of hex logic (buff & shine), which were open cell pads (green & blue). That technique of using less product on the pad, or the non kbm. I don't even spritz with detail spray.

While the green hex logic is listed as third most agressive, but I've burned paint on a pc with that pad and uc. Again, like the Rupes using almost no pressure. With their orange, and yellow I have to use much more downward pressure to achieve the same results.

I guess it's just the technique I developed from my rotary days.

With the orange and yellow ccs, I can't seem to get the same "bite" than I do with the pink. Heck, I was able to remove 2000 grit with uc, and a green ccs on the pc.

Another thing I learned about the hex logic / b&s flat line up of pads specifically, is that their are two lines within the line.

1. Reticulated - green (60 ppi), blue (70 ppi), grey (80 ppi). All of these pads should offer assistance to any polish in the correcting / refining process.

2. European Prepolymer - Yellow, orange, white, red. I've even noticed that while they position the yellow as the most agressive, it actually has a closer compression rate to the white pad, bit with a slightly rougher surface, and the orange is as smooth as the white, but more resilient than either the yellow or white.

So here is how I line them up for myself:

1. Green (correction), blue (polish), red (wax)

2. Yellow (correction), white (polish), red (wax)

3. Blue (one step), red (wax)

4. Orange (one step), red (wax)

5. Green (correction), blue (polish), grey (ultra fine polish), red (wax)

6. Grey or white (cleaner wax)

If I need more defect removal capabilities I reach for my Rupes microfiber!

The one thing is that I use very light pressure with those open cell pads. The blue hex and green ccs have a very similar degree of cut. Also, again, with the harder pads, I have to exert much more pressure to get the same cut.

Cardaddy, I know the old green ccs was listed to cut more than the white, but it was replaced with the pink foam.

 

[Chaotic29]

The pink are porous, but they do cut less than the orange ones. Then they 'say' the green ones cut more than the white, but as you may already know.... the white ones are very dense, where the green ones are pretty darned soft. Go figure..... :dunno:

I couldn't agree MORE on those Rupes blue pads. Oh My Freaking GOD are they scary to look at and feel! I've used them a couple times with my Duetto (on hard paint) and was simply blown away at how well they finished. Remembering of course that the "Rupes System" doesn't require priming a pad like we normally do, just a few drops. Seemed weird the first time, and still freaks me out when I 'get out of my comfort zone' and go to the Rupes chemicals.

FWIW I use their pads on my Duetto (along with LC pads) with both Megs SMAT and Menz DAT products.



Orange will not be overkill, but using them with a really heavy cut SMAT compound will. Stay away from Megs M105 at all cost (especially as a newcomer to DA polishing no matter WHAT paint you're working on) and with soft Subaru paint I'd stay away from

Megs M101 (although it's a GREAT compound). Megs UC, ScratchX, 205 and UP are all great contenders.

Then you could go with Menzerna FG400 for heavy correction yet it'll finish down really well, or on that Subaru paint you might want to look at Menz 1000 followed by 4000.

Remembering that you are wanting to stick with 5½" pads, that'll keep the cost down. There is just no way though that I can see making 6 pads work. Like I mentioned before, I'd like to see a "Detailers Dozen" with 13 but I've been saying that for years and nobody has picked up on it yet. Are you listening AGO??????? If you get only white, and you can't get the job done you will STILL have to order 4 orange at least to get your compounding done. I'd still say 4 orange, 4 white, 3 blue, 1 black. (or 2 blue, 2 black). The thing about black is they literally are not doing any work, it's just the product that is cutting at that point. I use black for applying sealant and wax and that's it. Blue OTOH can actually cut a bit. These are of course in the realm of flat pads.

The CCS pads having a straight, flat, sharp edge are better for getting right up to edges.

On the cut side of things.....
Where it got a bit tricky was thinking of the CCS pads where you get the pink that's a firm foam and is thrown there between orange and white, then the green says it cuts more than white but it's a really soft pad. I tend to think it cuts less than white but more than blue (FOR SURE). One thing is the green ones break in really quickly and become even more soft after just the first use. I don't have but 3~4 of those in each size (5½" & 6½") and just don't use them much.

Before I even knew of the Rupes technique for applying their polishes to pads, I adopted that technique to my first set of hex logic (buff & shine), which were open cell pads (green & blue). That technique of using less product on the pad, or the non kbm. I don't even spritz with detail spray.

While the green hex logic is listed as third most agressive, but I've burned paint on a pc with that pad and uc. Again, like the Rupes using almost no pressure. With their orange, and yellow I have to use much more downward pressure to achieve the same results.

I guess it's just the technique I developed from my rotary days.

With the orange and yellow ccs, I can't seem to get the same "bite" than I do with the pink. Heck, I was able to remove 2000 grit with uc, and a green ccs on the pc.

Another thing I learned about the hex logic / b&s flat line up of pads specifically, is that their are two lines within the line.

1. Reticulated - green (60 ppi), blue (70 ppi), grey (80 ppi). All of these pads should offer assistance to any polish in the correcting / refining process.

2. European Prepolymer - Yellow, orange, white, red. I've even noticed that while they position the yellow as the most agressive, it actually has a closer compression rate to the white pad, bit with a slightly rougher surface, and the orange is as smooth as the white, but more resilient than either the yellow or white.

So here is how I line them up for myself:

1. Green (correction), blue (polish), red (wax)

2. Yellow (correction), white (polish), red (wax)

3. Blue (one step), red (wax)

4. Orange (one step), red (wax)

5. Green (correction), blue (polish), grey (ultra fine polish), red (wax)

6. Grey or white (cleaner wax)

If I need more defect removal capabilities I reach for my Rupes microfiber!

The one thing is that I use very light pressure with those open cell pads. The blue hex and green ccs have a very similar degree of cut. Also, again, with the harder pads, I have to exert much more pressure to get the same cut.

Cardaddy, I know the old green ccs was listed to cut more than the white, but it was replaced with the pink foam.

 

[Chaotic29]

Holy information batman! Thanks guys haha there is alot of great things in here that i know i will use over time.

I figured out what pads i am going with thanks to everyone in here and @fly07sti for hopefully hooking me up with some pads to try when he is in my area.

 

[cardaddy]

Before I even knew of the Rupes technique.......

Great info there Don.

I'm saving that one in my file for sure. (Haven't used any Hex Logic).

Just wanted to drop ya' some kudos on that one (as I've not been online much at all this week).

We are EAT FREAKING UP with the flu around here this week!!!!!!! Me Nd CarMomma went to the doc, Wed/Thur and of course they don't really do anything for ya' (gave me a Decadron shot). All 3 of us have it with CarMomma taking of Wed, Thur, Fri due to the flu. She's not taken off but 3~4 times sick in 32+ years!

Fighting off bronchitis now.... hopefully by the middle of next week I can get something happening around here. (Like a C7 that got pushed back by monsoon season down this way.)



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

 

[dlc95]

Holy information batman! Thanks guys haha there is alot of great things in here that i know i will use over time.

I figured out what pads i am going with thanks to everyone in here and @fly07sti for hopefully hooking me up with some pads to try when he is in my area.

Right on, man!

Whatever you pick up, I hope you enjoy the process of using them!

 

[dlc95]

Great info there Don.

I'm saving that one in my file for sure. (Haven't used any Hex Logic).

Just wanted to drop ya' some kudos on that one (as I've not been online much at all this week).

We are EAT FREAKING UP with the flu around here this week!!!!!!! Me Nd CarMomma went to the doc, Wed/Thur and of course they don't really do anything for ya' (gave me a Decadron shot). All 3 of us have it with CarMomma taking of Wed, Thur, Fri due to the flu. She's not taken off but 3~4 times sick in 32+ years!

Fighting off bronchitis now.... hopefully by the middle of next week I can get something happening around here. (Like a C7 that got pushed back by monsoon season down this way.)



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

Thank you, sir!

I hope you get well soon!

 

[cardaddy]

I hope you get well soon!

As do I..... :dblthumb2:

Doctor said we'd get worse before we got betterm (and he was right). OH THANKS!

CarMomma just isn't used to getting sick, and I gotta' tell ya'.... she's about to cough up her freaking TOE NAILS! Can't get her to even TRY and stop coughing.