Sealant and Wax

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mattruggiero

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Hey guys - I'm new to this and have a question regarding sealants and wax. I've noticed some, not all, people use a combination of both so they get protection and the look they want. What I have also noticed is usually people who use both use an expensive sealant and a top end wax.

Can you even visually tell that a nice sealant has been applied with the wax covering it? I would think it'd be better to use something like Klasse High Gloss and then top with a nice wax. Anyway, I'm just curious. Thanks.
 
another option is to just do two coats of the same wax or sealant...
 
I do the sealant and wax and IMO I can see a difference. I use Menzerna Powerlock Sealant and then I top it off with an excellent wax. Currently, I have Pinnacle Souveran Paste wax on it (2 coats) and IMO the wet look and depth is 2nd to none.

That is me...some others may disagree. IMO, you can tell the difference.

So visually I can tell on my ride....
 
Kamakaz1961 said:
I do the sealant and wax and IMO I can see a difference. I use Menzerna Powerlock Sealant and then I top it off with an excellent wax. Currently, I have Pinnacle Souveran Paste wax on it (2 coats) and IMO the wet look and depth is 2nd to none.

That is me...some others may disagree. IMO, you can tell the difference.

So visually I can tell on my ride....
Click to expand...

Good to know! Can I ask why you use a sealant? Is it for protection purposes?
 
VISITOR said:
another option is to just do two coats of the same wax or sealant...
Click to expand...

Yeah, I guess this is where my cards lie. Never really tried layering LSPs. Never really considered it. What is LSP? Last Step Product. Maybe great or not, just not interested. I may be missing out, I truely don't think so. Good luck & take care.

Peace,

Darrin
 
mattruggiero said:
Good to know! Can I ask why you use a sealant? Is it for protection purposes?
Click to expand...

I use a sealant for the longer lasting protection. The addition of wax is for the gloss and wet look. The wax will wear off sooner but the sealant still protects. I know you are going to have a lot of people saying that you can't tell the difference. In my OWN experiments, I have a Black car and I could tell the difference. No need for me to show or prove to anyone anything. This is for me. You are going to have a lot of people disagreeing with what I think.

If I am in the minority or majority or if I am smoking crack than so be it. It's all fun detailing stuff for me.
 
mattruggiero said:
What I have also noticed is usually people who use both use an expensive sealant and a top end wax.
Click to expand...

•In your way of thinking:
-What's the price-range where a Sealant
becomes expensive?
-What is a "top end" Wax?

For example:
I've used a Sealant/Wax combination of Meguiar's M21 2.0
and Meguiar's M26...and didn't feel they came anywhere close to being expensive/"top end".

mattruggiero said:
Can you even visually tell that a nice sealant has been applied with the wax covering it?
Click to expand...
No...Not me.

Even though I know (i.e.: hope) the Sealant is (still) there...I can only see the characteristics of the last
product that's been applied. In this scenario:
That'd be the Wax's characteristics.


Bob
 
IME/IMHO layering wax over sealant for durability sake is a waste of time. I have seen zero evidence. and have zero experience of the LSP lasting longer.

My theory why this is, is because I believe the solvent in the wax is removing the sealant when you apply the wax. If the solvent in a hybrid wax is strong and plentiful enough to emulsify a sealant in the hybrid - why wouldn't it remove a different sealant from your paint???

Instead of doing that, just get a good hybrid wax from Dodo, Wolfgang, Collinite, Pinnacle, or Blackfire .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Souldetailer said:
Yeah, I guess this is where my cards lie. Never really tried layering LSPs. Never really considered it. What is LSP? Last Step Product. Maybe great or not, just not interested. I may be missing out, I truely don't think so. Good luck & take care.

Peace,

Darrin
Click to expand...

if you do two layers of the same lsp, that will help insure uniform coverage...
 
swanicyouth said:
IME/IMHO layering wax over sealant for durability sake is a waste of time. I have seen zero evidence. and have zero experience of the LSP lasting longer.

My theory why this is, is because I believe the solvent in the wax is removing the sealant when you apply the wax. If the solvent in a hybrid wax is strong and plentiful enough to emulsify a sealant in the hybrid - why wouldn't it remove a different sealant from your paint???
Click to expand...

So IYO something like 845 can actually be detrimental after using (for example) a combo of Duragloss 105/111/610?

*Matt-if my question is OT to your thread then I apologize :hijacked:
 
swanicyouth said:
IME/IMHO layering wax over sealant for durability sake is a waste of time. I have seen zero evidence. and have zero experience of the LSP lasting longer.

My theory why this is, is because I believe the solvent in the wax is removing the sealant when you apply the wax. If the solvent in a hybrid wax is strong and plentiful enough to emulsify a sealant in the hybrid - why wouldn't it remove a different sealant from your paint???

Instead of doing that, just get a good hybrid wax from Dodo, Wolfgang, Collinite, Pinnacle, or Blackfire .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

And to think that years ago people were worried about wax "build up", and yellowing.

I have to admit that your theory makes sense. I'd like to see it tested somehow.
 
swanicyouth said:
IME/IMHO layering wax over sealant for durability sake is a waste of time. I have seen zero evidence. and have zero experience of the LSP lasting longer.

My theory why this is, is because I believe the solvent in the wax is removing the sealant when you apply the wax. If the solvent in a hybrid wax is strong and plentiful enough to emulsify a sealant in the hybrid - why wouldn't it remove a different sealant from your paint???

Instead of doing that, just get a good hybrid wax from Dodo, Wolfgang, Collinite, Pinnacle, or Blackfire .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I have, likewise, no experience that layering does any good. I do know that many people will insist on 'sealing in' a glaze and my experience it that this is worse than useless - the sealant does not enhance the durability of the glaze and the glaze will tend to damage the durability of the glaze.

I, again, agree with just selecting the correct product in the first instance. I find it odd that people jump up and down about products and then turn around and use something over the top or as a base. The truth is that the product doesn't do what they want, in isolation, so why the massive praise?
 
I have found that a finishing polish or AIO/ Cleaner wax works better than any glaze and also agree that the last product used will be the finish in the end and will have that products characteristics only. I used to layer-sealant then wax or glaze then sealant and it later proved useless. We learn as we go along.
 
swanicyouth said:
IME/IMHO layering wax over sealant for durability sake is a waste of time. I have seen zero evidence. and have zero experience of the LSP lasting longer.

My theory why this is, is because I believe the solvent in the wax is removing the sealant when you apply the wax. If the solvent in a hybrid wax is strong and plentiful enough to emulsify a sealant in the hybrid - why wouldn't it remove a different sealant from your paint???

Instead of doing that, just get a good hybrid wax from Dodo, Wolfgang, Collinite, Pinnacle, or Blackfire .


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

PiPUK said:
I have, likewise, no experience that layering does any good. I do know that many people will insist on 'sealing in' a glaze and my experience it that this is worse than useless - the sealant does not enhance the durability of the glaze and the glaze will tend to damage the durability of the glaze.

I, again, agree with just selecting the correct product in the first instance. I find it odd that people jump up and down about products and then turn around and use something over the top or as a base. The truth is that the product doesn't do what they want, in isolation, so why the massive praise?
Click to expand...

I'm also in the anti layering camp. I have limited experience with layering waxes over sealants (the BF system and various Collinites over Duragloss 105) but I have not seen significant increases in longevity. What I have seen is that you get the downside of waxes (dust and pollen adhering more). When I want the waxed look I'll opt for a wax that really delivers that juicy and deep look and just anticipate having to reapply in six to nine weeks. Too many people seem to assume that the virues of the layered products are additive and somehow magically without the downsides and IME that is not what layering delivers. People layering waxes over coatings are as mad as hatters as far as I'm concerned.
 
I don't think layering is even a real thing. Applying wax and sealant should be maintenance things. I don't care how expensive the wax, sealant or COATING is...in the hot sun and weather, none of it lasts anymore then a few months, IMHO. I apply my wax and sealant the 1st weekend of EVERY month. I paid a good amount of money for my vehicles and to keep a fresh coat of a sacrificial layer is cheap insurance. I use my GG6; therefore, to apply my sealant and a thin coat of pure carnuba or just 845 or 476...takes 30 minutes!
 
LSPs start deteriorating as soon as they are applied, regardless of what layer they are on...so topping a sealant with wax doesn't make the sealant last longer. Topping a coating doesn't make it last longer. Topping one LSP over another is pure BS imo. Boosters can help a bit once a month and frankly is all that is required to put back on what had deteriorated between booster applications...but LSP layering is the biggest myth and a complete waste of time and money. Put on your LSP of choice and hit it with D156 once a month...done.
 
silverfox said:
LSPs start deteriorating as soon as they are applied, regardless of what layer they are on...so topping a sealant with wax doesn't make the sealant last longer. Topping a coating doesn't make it last longer. Topping one LSP over another is pure BS imo. Boosters can help a bit once a month and frankly is all that is required to put back on what had deteriorated between booster applications...but LSP layering is the biggest myth and a complete waste of time and money. Put on your LSP of choice and hit it with D156 once a month...done.
Click to expand...

After researching, this much debated topic over the years, I decided to try WGDGPS 3.0 on my 11 year old black GM paint.
It is all I need.

An uncomplicated, beautiful sealant that looks great and works great.
I can re-apply with little effort if the need is there.
 
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