Help detailer trashed my paint!

392hemi

392hemi

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Hey guys recently had a well known detailer trash the paint on my new car. The car is a Torred 2016 Dodge Charger. Gave him 2 chances, didn't want him to ruin it anymore so went about myself. Had him repair minor body damage and ended up with fish eyes in the clear coat he did along with scratches and wet sand scratches.

He spent well over 8 hours the 2nd time using some of the best tools (Rupes, Flex and some more to name a few).

Fast forward to couple of rain showers and I# saw horrible scratches and swirls. Looks like the "detailer" couldn't fix most and just filled everything in using a glaze or polish with fillers.

Deciding I didn't want it butchered more I decided to fix it myself. Being in between places and jobs it was hard to find a time and place. I finally busted out my 15 year old PC and ordered some supplies from more autogeek.

I did a rinseless wash with some McKees N-914 and oh my God I love this stuff. Good scent, easy to mix and had very good lubricity and cleaning power. It wiped clean and did not haze in my apartment garage which was very humid.

I used with my PC coupled with Griots correcting cream with 5inch BP and 5.5 Orange LC thinpro pads. Wow I loved this combo and removed 98 or so percent of the damage. It unfortunately was hot and humid and was surprised how easily the Griots wiped off. I love this combo and will be my new go to, no fillers or silicone and easy to work. Very very little to no dust.

It took multiple passes in the worst parts, but is a lot better. The paint is a lot shinier and glossier!

I am wanting to apply a ceramic coat to my car and have Carpro Eraser and McKees-914.

I feel the car is 95 percent defect free. I still see micromarring and tried to remove it with no luck.

I have tried following combos l
1) Boss correcting cream with LC thinpro orange pad
2) Boss correcting cream with Buff and shine black and blue pads.
3) Ultimate polish with buff and shine black and blue pads.


Being anal and OCD I need help! I have following options.

1) Buy Boss Perfecting Cream and yellow 5.5 inch pads and hope it works?

2) Buy Carpro Essence and it's corresponding pad (white one I think)

3) Cut my loses and just apply the coating and accept it for my sanity? Or just apply Sonax PNS for now and try again with a new machine.

I've marked my PC# backing plate and I notice it stalling a lot, my car does have a curvy hood but it is getting annoying. I've been reading forever and would eventually like to purchase a newer machine (Boss 21, Rupes or Flex) to help save me time.

Now onto "compound splatter", I have some sort of splatter all over the inside of my vehicle. I tried following products to remove it with a microfiber cloth and small brush, Megs Quik Interior Detailer, Blackfire Interior cleaner, McKees N-914 and McKees Total Interior cleaner with no luck. Any idea what I can try? The detailer that did this told me to try vinegar or lemon juice... I haven't had a chance to try that yet.

I've read almost every article by Mike and read the forum and watched every video on YouTube as well lol to get some tips. I was on the sister site for a while as well back in early to mid 2000s so I feel like I have a slight idea of what I'm doing.
 
From reading your post, it sounds as if this "well known detailer" also did body work and resprayed the car with clear coat?

If so, he may be a good detailer (hence the "well known"), but a hack body man.

From the pics, looks like an improvement in swirl correction. But no buffer/orbital is going to correct fish eyes. That's a wet-sand/re-paint kind of problem.
 
PaulMys said:
From reading your post, it sounds as if this "well known detailer" also did body work and resprayed the car with clear coat?

If so, he may be a good detailer (hence the "well known"), but a hack body man.

From the pics, looks like an improvement in swirl correction. But no buffer/orbital is going to correct fish eyes. That's a wet-sand/re-paint kind of problem.
Click to expand...


Yes I gave him 2 shots to fix and didn't want him to ruin it. He tried to sand and respray and still got fisheyes. He attempted to wetsand and remove them but just ended up being unable to remove the wetsand marks ? (See pics)

At this point I'll live with the fisheyes, but want to restore the car back to not having any micromarring which I can't seem to remove and the interior splatter.
 
I'd go get an estimate from a good body shop.

Imo, I think if you had body damage you should have done that first.

Too new and beautiful is that Charger to do otherwise. Again, just my opinion.
 
From the looks of your "after" photos plus being 95% defect free---I think that's about all you can do at this point. I would relax, live with it and go ahead and apply coating.

If it still bugs you afterwards---make plans next season to have those issues corrected by a good body shop and do a re coat. (Even coatings will have contaminates after a year)

Tom
 
Micro marring on Dodge paint was also driving me crazy. In my case a 2016 black Challenger.

I managed to get it out of the factory paint using this combination after cutting with a Meg's MF pad and Ultimate Compound: Yellow Rupes Pad with small amount of Rupes Keramik Gloss Fine. Speed setting 5 with moderate pressure for 4 or 5 passes. This gets out the DA haze left behind by the MF pad, but does not make it perfect. Then I use a tangerine LC Hydro Tech with a small amount of Menzerna 3500 on speed 4 using light to moderate pressure for 4 or 5 passes. Seems counter intuitive, but a somewhat harder pad and polish works better on soft paint.

Then my front fender got hit with some traffic debris and I had to have it re-sprayed. Wound up going to a Dodge dealer body shop hoping it would be the same paint. Although it might be the same paint brand, I'm getting crazy micro-marring on that fender and nothing I have will get it out. I waited a month before working on it.

I just ordered a White LC pad, a white Rupes pad, Menzerna 3800 and Rupes Diamond Ultra Fine hoping some combo of those will work on the re-paint. Maybe the re-spray is harder?

Good luck. Please let us know what combo works if you decide to go further.
 
Thanks guys for the help.

I did pull the car into the sun today after trying Ultimate polish on the black buff and shine pads and seemed to be working! After using the Griots new Boss cream, it is a lot more work to remove 100 percent from the surface, seems to be greasing and oiler than I remember. Im using N-914 diluted as panel prep to check my work. Perhaps the Griots new cream spoiled me. As we all know, the more you wipe, the more you risk marring your newly polished surface.

So I read and watched a lot of videos again, ended up buying some Essence and Carpro gloss pads from here. I'm hoping to wash the car again with N-914, do some test spots with Essence, find best pad combo and then use that and follow up with my coating.

I know I mentioned before, I've used some Griots older stuff, the new line is phenomenal! The LC thinpro orange pad and the Boss correcting cream surprised me with how easy it was to use, smelled good l, long working time and easily wiped off. Barely got any dusting too! I'm sold on thier new system.

N-914 was also very easy to use, used it so far as a rinseless, waterless and panel prep! Glad such a product exists. Smells good and I actually used some on the interior of a new Mercedes where a Soda had exploded all over the interior in the summer heat and dried. My friend wanted to use Windex...... I pulled my bottle of N-914 mixed at waterless wash I had in my trunk. It cleaned Everything up and left nothing behind! We were both shocked as to how well it cleaned with no reside.

I'll definitely be buying more N-914 and use ECH2o as a "spray wax" when I'm done washing my car.

Now the search for a new polisher continues...
 
BMack said:
Micro marring on Dodge paint was also driving me crazy. In my case a 2016 black Challenger.

I managed to get it out of the factory paint using this combination after cutting with a Meg's MF pad and Ultimate Compound: Yellow Rupes Pad with small amount of Rupes Keramik Gloss Fine. Speed setting 5 with moderate pressure for 4 or 5 passes. This gets out the DA haze left behind by the MF pad, but does not make it perfect. Then I use a tangerine LC Hydro Tech with a small amount of Menzerna 3500 on speed 4 using light to moderate pressure for 4 or 5 passes. Seems counter intuitive, but a somewhat harder pad and polish works better on soft paint.

Then my front fender got hit with some traffic debris and I had to have it re-sprayed. Wound up going to a Dodge dealer body shop hoping it would be the same paint. Although it might be the same paint brand, I'm getting crazy micro-marring on that fender and nothing I have will get it out. I waited a month before working on it.

I just ordered a White LC pad, a white Rupes pad, Menzerna 3800 and Rupes Diamond Ultra Fine hoping some combo of those will work on the re-paint. Maybe the re-spray is harder?

Good luck. Please let us know what combo works if you decide to go further.
Click to expand...

Good to see a fellow Moparian! Do you also have a Scatpack?

Thanks i will keep you posted, seems to be if I used UP with black pad, doing 3 passes with pressure and then 2 with no pressure almost all the micromarring is gone. I did prime the pad with N-914 diluted at a rinseless ratio. UP was a pain for me to remove. It removed fine, but the panel wipedown caused a lot of smearing. I am seeing some dots but seems to be from all my road trips per this thread


https://www.autogeekonline.net/foru...pinhole-solvent-pop-common-paint-issue-3.html

I will say the UP was dusting a bit more and my PC was stalling on the hood with all the curves. So I decided to try essence, which I read a lot of people here used successfully on the new Mopars (a lot of hellcats). I'm all about saving my time at this point lol.

I liked the new Boss cream because it has no silicone or fillers. Being my car is daily driven sun or rain, I decided to let Essence full and make the paint pop rather than kill myself perfecting a daily driver.

I've had other Dodge Chargers and 300s (05 to 2013) prior to my 2016 and then defiantly had harder paint.
 
You'll have to forgive me, bad pain day and pretty strong drugs. It seems like you need to use a polish with a white polishing pad. From what I'm getting out of this your going from a pretty aggressive combo to a setup that has next to no cut. Another step may be required. Hopefully this helps, with the meds I may be totally off base...good night lol
 
392hemi said:
Good to see a fellow Moparian! Do you also have a Scatpack?

Thanks i will keep you posted, seems to be if I used UP with black pad, doing 3 passes with pressure and then 2 with no pressure almost all the micromarring is gone. I did prime the pad with N-914 diluted at a rinseless ratio. UP was a pain for me to remove. It removed fine, but the panel wipedown caused a lot of smearing. I am seeing some dots but seems to be from all my road trips per this thread


https://www.autogeekonline.net/foru...pinhole-solvent-pop-common-paint-issue-3.html

I will say the UP was dusting a bit more and my PC was stalling on the hood with all the curves. So I decided to try essence, which I read a lot of people here used successfully on the new Mopars (a lot of hellcats). I'm all about saving my time at this point lol.

I liked the new Boss cream because it has no silicone or fillers. Being my car is daily driven sun or rain, I decided to let Essence full and make the paint pop rather than kill myself perfecting a daily driver.

I've had other Dodge Chargers and 300s (05 to 2013) prior to my 2016 and then defiantly had harder paint.
Click to expand...

Yep, it's a Scat Pack. I love it.

I've got the same little dots all over the lower front bumper. I figured it was just from debris on the road and am not worried about it too much. Not enough to wet sand or re-spray anyway. The larger panels with marring concern me more.

I don't have any experience with Griot's polishes but you should be good since they don't have fillers. Should be just a matter of finding the right pad/polish combination, which can be frustrating.

What are you wiping down with? A good panel wipe should just clear off the UP and not leave any smearing.

Lots of good info here so I'm sure other people with much more experience than I can weigh in.
 
BMack said:
Yep, it's a Scat Pack. I love it.

I've got the same little dots all over the lower front bumper. I figured it was just from debris on the road and am not worried about it too much. Not enough to wet sand or re-spray anyway. The larger panels with marring concern me more.

I don't have any experience with Griot's polishes but you should be good since they don't have fillers. Should be just a matter of finding the right pad/polish combination, which can be frustrating.

What are you wiping down with? A good panel wipe should just clear off the UP and not leave any smearing.

Lots of good info here so I'm sure other people with much more experience than I can weigh in.
Click to expand...



Love the 392!

I'm wiping with n-914 diluted at 1:8 as a paint prep. I also have Eraser. Will finish Eraser up.

Wiping UP with just a MF cloth wipes clean, the will with N-914 started to show smears as it removed the polishing oils. I tried it with Griots and there was no oily residue being removed.

I'll update once I recieve my new shipment from here.
 
392hemi said:
Love the 392!

I'm wiping with n-914 diluted at 1:8 as a paint prep. I also have Eraser. Will finish Eraser up.

Wiping UP with just a MF cloth wipes clean, the will with N-914 started to show smears as it removed the polishing oils. I tried it with Griots and there was no oily residue being removed.

I'll update once I recieve my new shipment from here.
Click to expand...

Did you have any luck?

Nothing I ordered was able to finish off the re-sprayed panel correctly. I just ordered Griot's Perfecting Cream and their yellow pad so I'm hoping that might work better.
 
BMack said:
Did you have any luck?

Nothing I ordered was able to finish off the re-sprayed panel correctly. I just ordered Griot's Perfecting Cream and their yellow pad so I'm hoping that might work better.
Click to expand...



I recieved my package but unfortunately I pulled my back and can't do much of anything, I haven't even opened the box. The humidity and heat has also been horrible. I'm hoping I'm well enough to try it by this Sunday.

I also really badly have been wanting to upgrade to a G21 or Rupes, but an upcoming move in a week is holding me back (more #### to pack and move 😑)
 
392hemi said:
I recieved my package but unfortunately I pulled my back and can't do much of anything, I haven't even opened the box. The humidity and heat has also been horrible. I'm hoping I'm well enough to try it by this Sunday.

I also really badly have been wanting to upgrade to a G21 or Rupes, but an upcoming move in a week is holding me back (more #### to pack and move ��)
Click to expand...

Seems like something always comes up. I've been at this for 2 months. If I could have a do-over I'd go with a Rupes or Griot's Boss DA rather than a cheap TorqX. I way underestimated the amount of work. Almost done now, though, as soon as I can lock in the re-sprayed panel. If Griot's Perfecting Cream doesn't work my last alternative will be Scholl S-40.

Hope you can get back at it soon!
 
Thanks I'll definitely update my findings and pics. Keep me posted how it works for you.

I'm hoping to try again this weekend, sucks because I need to rewash. If I'm not feeling 100 percent maybe I'll wash and polish the car in portions lol.

My PC stalling is tempting me to get a new machine, just don't want to buy something to only have to put it in storage while I find a new place.
 
392hemi said:
My PC stalling is tempting me to get a new machine, just don't want to buy something to only have to put it in storage while I find a new place.
Click to expand...

The majority of my customers are modern Mopar. I normally don't bother with a free-spinning machine and use a Flex 3401 instead. Last year I went through phases where I'd use a Griot's Garage Boss G15 but this year I've used it maybe only a handful of times. Stalling on curved edges and contours is no fun, but can be mitigated. Some folks do edging work first with, for example, a smaller pad and machine, and then get the large and flatter pieces complete with a bigger pad. There are a lot of ways to use a free-spinning machine to get the job done, but everyone has a preference and opinion. I prefer a force-rotation machine and the Flex 3401 fits well.

A lot of folks want a two-step (cutting and then refinement) job on their Mopar. Below is a list of what I found works very well for all sort of refinishing scenarios for Challengers, Chargers and 300s.

1. Lake Country Hybrid Force grey heavy cut pads and Griot's Garage Boss Fast Correcting Cream. Change to an orange Force pad to level medium to minor defects.

2. Lake Country Hybrid Force white polishing pads and Meguiar's M205, Boss Perfecting Cream, or Optimum Hyper Polish. If the customer wants the job done sooner, and they're not getting a coating, then a finishing polish can be substituted for Boss Finishing Sealant, McKee's 360, or whatever high quality cleaner-wax/all-in-one product meets one's preference. CarPro Essence is a good choice too, but i wouldn't put much stock in its ability to protect the paintwork for an appreciable amount of time. Others may have a different opinion about the product Use a black Force finishing pad if there is very little micro-marring or hazing from the cutting step.

I use the same abrasive products with a G15, but the pads are replaced with Boss microfiber, white fast correcting, orange correcting and yellow polishing pads.

In regard to removing product residue after compounding and polishing, it is helpful to use a microfiber towel that is damp with rinseless solution. McKee's N914 and D114 work very well for this, but even a towel that is damp with distilled water will help to reduce accidentally marring the surface if there is a concern about it. A wet towel isn't a replacement for a real panel wipe but it helps to remove the bulk of the residue.
 
I've done some finishing with M205 on green buff and shine pads as a follow up to rotary/wool on an old PC 7424. Speed 5 works fine. Four small drops to start, and two or three to reload.

The guy at the helm of the shop likes Menzerna MC2500 as his follow up to the aggressive compounding step. He uses buff and shine urofiber pads, but I think I have him converted to foam. He likes the orange Lake Country CCS.

Today on a Dodge 200 I used the Rupes Duetto/Mini with their keramik fine cut Polish and yellow microfiber pads.

In general, the more humid the condition, the more dust I get. That day was the first time I ever had M205 dust on me - however, I've have that particular pour off bottle for a while now..

He only seems to call me in when he has black paint that needs heavy cutting/polishing lol!
 
osiapstndp said:
The majority of my customers are modern Mopar. I normally don't bother with a free-spinning machine and use a Flex 3401 instead. Last year I went through phases where I'd use a Griot's Garage Boss G15 but this year I've used it maybe only a handful of times. Stalling on curved edges and contours is no fun, but can be mitigated. Some folks do edging work first with, for example, a smaller pad and machine, and then get the large and flatter pieces complete with a bigger pad. There are a lot of ways to use a free-spinning machine to get the job done, but everyone has a preference and opinion. I prefer a force-rotation machine and the Flex 3401 fits well.

A lot of folks want a two-step (cutting and then refinement) job on their Mopar. Below is a list of what I found works very well for all sort of refinishing scenarios for Challengers, Chargers and 300s.

1. Lake Country Hybrid Force grey heavy cut pads and Griot's Garage Boss Fast Correcting Cream. Change to an orange Force pad to level medium to minor defects.

2. Lake Country Hybrid Force white polishing pads and Meguiar's M205, Boss Perfecting Cream, or Optimum Hyper Polish. If the customer wants the job done sooner, and they're not getting a coating, then a finishing polish can be substituted for Boss Finishing Sealant, McKee's 360, or whatever high quality cleaner-wax/all-in-one product meets one's preference. CarPro Essence is a good choice too, but i wouldn't put much stock in its ability to protect the paintwork for an appreciable amount of time. Others may have a different opinion about the product Use a black Force finishing pad if there is very little micro-marring or hazing from the cutting step.

I use the same abrasive products with a G15, but the pads are replaced with Boss microfiber, white fast correcting, orange correcting and yellow polishing pads.

In regard to removing product residue after compounding and polishing, it is helpful to use a microfiber towel that is damp with rinseless solution. McKee's N914 and D114 work very well for this, but even a towel that is damp with distilled water will help to reduce accidentally marring the surface if there is a concern about it. A wet towel isn't a replacement for a real panel wipe but it helps to remove the bulk of the residue.
Click to expand...

How long is the cutting step taking?

I'm also finding that the random orbitals give up the ghost on some of the curves and contours. Thus most of our heavy lifting is with the Makita 9237 / Megs wool pad / M100/HC400.

I want to say depending on the vehicle I'm at 2.5 - 3.5 hours to cut with that combo.
 
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