For all the naysayers who say you can’t clay black paint w/o marring
- Thread starter Eldorado2k
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Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
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For everyone that will read this into the future...
Paint is different.
The paint sprayed on a car at the assembly line changes. So the paint on a 2018 Honda can be different than the paint sprayed on a 2017 Honda - or ANY make and model.
Paints can be soft or hard or somewhere in-between. You will NEVER know if a paint is hard or soft until YOU do a Test Spot. This is one of the reasons you should always do a Test Spot to every car you work on (if you've never worked on the car in the past).
It's only by experience that you can tell if a paint system is hard or soft, there is no other way to know. You can't ask on a Facebook group or even this forum and get a answer that actually means anything. It's only by going out into the garage and doing some testing with a product that uses GREAT ABRASIVE technology and then if you've paid attention to all the car that you've buffed out in the past and how easy or how difficult the defects buffed out and then use this EXPERINECE to gauge what the paint is in front of you in the moment.
So with the above all said, a good rule of thumb is....
If you're going to mechanically decontaminate the paint in any way, including conventional detailing clay or some form of clay alternative, like a Nanoskin towel or a Griot's Garage Surface Prep Mitt or a Mothers Speed Clay 2.0, etc. if you want to be on the safe side, then you should already be planning and scheduling the time to do at least one machine polishing step. This could be something as simple as using a one-step cleaner/wax or a fine cut polish but doing at least one step will remove any marring you can see or cannot see and thus restore the paint to pristine condition.
Paint is different.
The paint sprayed on a car at the assembly line changes. So the paint on a 2018 Honda can be different than the paint sprayed on a 2017 Honda - or ANY make and model.
Paints can be soft or hard or somewhere in-between. You will NEVER know if a paint is hard or soft until YOU do a Test Spot. This is one of the reasons you should always do a Test Spot to every car you work on (if you've never worked on the car in the past).
It's only by experience that you can tell if a paint system is hard or soft, there is no other way to know. You can't ask on a Facebook group or even this forum and get a answer that actually means anything. It's only by going out into the garage and doing some testing with a product that uses GREAT ABRASIVE technology and then if you've paid attention to all the car that you've buffed out in the past and how easy or how difficult the defects buffed out and then use this EXPERINECE to gauge what the paint is in front of you in the moment.
So with the above all said, a good rule of thumb is....
If you're going to mechanically decontaminate the paint in any way, including conventional detailing clay or some form of clay alternative, like a Nanoskin towel or a Griot's Garage Surface Prep Mitt or a Mothers Speed Clay 2.0, etc. if you want to be on the safe side, then you should already be planning and scheduling the time to do at least one machine polishing step. This could be something as simple as using a one-step cleaner/wax or a fine cut polish but doing at least one step will remove any marring you can see or cannot see and thus restore the paint to pristine condition.
TTQ B4U
Well-known member
- Jan 20, 2016
- 5,504
- 70
Agree 100%. I use Nano Sponges and Clay mitts exclusively and so long as the vehicle is washed correctly and the products used with a light touch and plenty of VERY soapy water (I use Meg's Gold Class) as the lube, it doesn't hurt it one bit. Key is to keep the mitt super lubed up and a light enough touch to remove materials and viola! I've done this on our previous van and simply topped off the already applied coating with a topper and moved on without issue.
Here's one of the last clean pics prior to use getting rid of it last week. Just before this photo, I had decontaminated the four doors on the vehicle as that's where it seemed to have some bonded contaminants from winter's muck.
Nice job on this vehicle overall too.
Here's one of the last clean pics prior to use getting rid of it last week. Just before this photo, I had decontaminated the four doors on the vehicle as that's where it seemed to have some bonded contaminants from winter's muck.
Nice job on this vehicle overall too.
Was going to say the same thing. At least looks like some swirls there
For everyone that will read this into the future...
Paint is different.
The paint sprayed on a car at the assembly line changes. So the paint on a 2018 Honda can be different than the paint sprayed on a 2017 Honda - or ANY make and model.
Paints can be soft or hard or somewhere in-between. You will NEVER know if a paint is hard or soft until YOU do a Test Spot. This is one of the reasons you should always do a Test Spot to every car you work on (if you've never worked on the car in the past).
It's only by experience that you can tell if a paint system is hard or soft, there is no other way to know. You can't ask on a Facebook group or even this forum and get a answer that actually means anything. It's only by going out into the garage and doing some testing with a product that uses GREAT ABRASIVE technology and then if you've paid attention to all the car that you've buffed out in the past and how easy or how difficult the defects buffed out and then use this EXPERINECE to gauge what the paint is in front of you in the moment.
So with the above all said, a good rule of thumb is....
If you're going to mechanically decontaminate the paint in any way, including conventional detailing clay or some form of clay alternative, like a Nanoskin towel or a Griot's Garage Surface Prep Mitt or a Mothers Speed Clay 2.0, etc. if you want to be on the safe side, then you should already be planning and scheduling the time to do at least one machine polishing step. This could be something as simple as using a one-step cleaner/wax or a fine cut polish but doing at least one step will remove any marring you can see or cannot see and thus restore the paint to pristine condition.
So Mike, this light marring we get from claying is this just superficial? It always comes out super easy even with a jeweling polish like 3800. I'm guessing you could go through this process of light marring and removing it with jeweling polish many many times before you would wear through the clearcoat?
Mike Phillips
Active member
- Dec 5, 2022
- 51,004
- 7
If by the word superficial you mean "light" or "shallow" then I would say yes but regardless, a defect is a defect when it comes to car paint and in order to remove deep defects or shallow defects you must use something that has the ability to abrade the surface to level it without leaving behind it's own defects.
TTQ B4U
Well-known member
- Jan 20, 2016
- 5,504
- 70
Eldo noted that just above those last two pics. IMO those are always tough areas of a vehicle to correct and were likely already present.
Eldorado, you must be very good at keeping even pressure with the mitt. I tend to push too hard with the tips of my fingers and the heel of my palm when using a mitt or towel. I can judge that pressure better with a piece of clay bar applying pressure with the ends of my fingers. I just like the tactile feel that real clay bar provides. I know by the feel if the section is clean or not. I don't get the same sensory feedback from mitts or towels and rely on making sure I make a certain amount of passes to ensure a section is cleaned.
I still think that a real clay bar will out clean any mitt or towel. Marring aside.
I still think that a real clay bar will out clean any mitt or towel. Marring aside.
Eldorado2k
Well-known member
- Nov 9, 2015
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- Thread starter
- #31
Are you talking about these 2 pictures? If so, please point out the marring you’re referring to? All I see is minor swirls and some water spots.
Yes there are some minor swirls, that and the water spots were the whole reason the customer was paying me to polish the paint. They were already on there prior to using the clay towel.
I didn’t have marring on 2 panels, it was just the rear door handle.
I feel the same way about waterless washing. I’m never hesitant to do a waterless wash, even on black paint. I have faith in the product, and trust my technique.
Here’s an example on a black Mercedes Benz.
Before:
After: Yes I know there’s swirls, but I didn’t instill any more with my waterless wipedown.
I later corrected the paint on that vehicle.
Eldorado2k
Well-known member
- Nov 9, 2015
- 14,544
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- Thread starter
- #33
You can’t go wrong with the OTC Meguiars claybar. It’s mild but not weak, it’s white which is ideal to see the contaminants you’re picking up, it’s pliable. No complaints.
IMO Meguiars Mirror Glaze Professional Detailing Clay is slightly better than the OTC version. If I could only have 1 it’d be this clay.
Mike Phillips recommended this Pinnacle Ultra Poly Detailing Clay and I really like it. It’s mild and that makes it perfect for the vehicles here at home which well cared for and are never heavily contaminated.
