Electric cars...neutering gearheads and freedom, HOW DID WE GET HERE!

[PaulMys]

I'll say just two things on this subject:

1) Words/phrases mentioned above were "Balance, fairness, working together, caring" etc.

All of this sounds great to me. But sadly, these words/ideas mean absolutely nothing. The most powerful groups of people on this planet have zero interest in anything but making insane profits. And caring for the environment, balance, and working together are in direct conflict with their agendas.



2) When we destroy something, it will not be the planet. It will be ourselves.

This planet has survived many more catastrophic things than even man could imagine. Look at the surrounding areas of the Chernobyl disaster like the town of Pripyat. When the accident happened in 1986, every "accredited" scientific body told us that any life would be impossible in that area for hundreds of years.

Yet, only 35 years later there is not only life, but wildlife is thriving.

The bottom line is this: When humans finally destroy themselves, the Earth (and whatever scars we left on her) will shake us off like a bad case of fleas. And if it could, it would belly laugh at a species that just happened to be arrogant enough to think it had some kind of power over it.

 

[Klasse Act]

I'll say just two things on this subject:

1) Words/phrases mentioned above were "Balance, fairness, working together, caring" etc.

All of this sounds great to me. But sadly, these words/ideas mean absolutely nothing. The most powerful groups of people on this planet have zero interest in anything but making insane profits. And caring for the environment, balance, and working together is in direct conflict with their agendas.



2) When we destroy something, it will not be the planet. It will be ourselves.

This planet has survived many more catastrophic things than even man could imagine. Look at the surrounding areas of the Chernobyl disaster like the town of Pripyat. When the accident happened in 1986, every "accredited" scientific body told us that any life would be impossible in that area for hundreds of years.

Yet, only 35 years later there is not only life, but wildlife is thriving.

The bottom line is this: When humans finally destroy themselves, the Earth (and whatever scars we left on her) will shake us off like a bad case of fleas. And if it could, it would belly laugh at a species that just happened to be arrogant enough to think it had some kind of power over it.

No argument from me here Paul

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[Jayfro]

A real “conversation” has happened!


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[opie2]

I'll say just two things on this subject:

1) Words/phrases mentioned above were "Balance, fairness, working together, caring" etc.

All of this sounds great to me. But sadly, these words/ideas mean absolutely nothing. The most powerful groups of people on this planet have zero interest in anything but making insane profits. And caring for the environment, balance, and working together are in direct conflict with their agendas.



2) When we destroy something, it will not be the planet. It will be ourselves.

This planet has survived many more catastrophic things than even man could imagine. Look at the surrounding areas of the Chernobyl disaster like the town of Pripyat. When the accident happened in 1986, every "accredited" scientific body told us that any life would be impossible in that area for hundreds of years.

Yet, only 35 years later there is not only life, but wildlife is thriving.

The bottom line is this: When humans finally destroy themselves, the Earth (and whatever scars we left on her) will shake us off like a bad case of fleas. And if it could, it would belly laugh at a species that just happened to be arrogant enough to think it had some kind of power over it.

Ive watched a couple great documentarys on that. Documentarys on superfund sites are really interesting as well. Speaking of nuclear energy. You really think anyome will ever figured out how to properly dispose of spent fuel rods once they are pulled from a reactor? Far as i know they just get put into large pools of water in storage tanks.

Makes me wander if they honestly know how to dispose of or recycle the ev batteries. Clean energy my a$$. Wind and solar will save us all...yeah right, more like big waste of tax payer dollars just like solyndra was.

Dont forget gotta stop eating meat, cow farts are hurting our environment.

And come on ppl we are not the jetsons!:laughing::laughing:

 

[DUBL0WS6]

The governments that detonated nukes are concerned about the little pollution my car makes. Ya right, it's just an excuse for a power grab.

 

[57Rambler]

It seems that every YouTuber has just laid down and accepted this concept of no more ICE cars in the somewhat near future. I mean the U.K. has banned the sale of ICE cars by 2030 or so.

You might think "what can we do", aren't WE the consumer here? Manufactures have made cars safer and CLEANER for quite some time now, I mean Porsche is developing their own fuel even that's SUPER clean.

I don't want this to turn into a political debate but it's pretty well known who's behind this and who's corner they're in, so no need to sling the mud but HOW DID WE GET HERE and why did the pendulum swing so far to the left and now it's stuck

As a 40+ year veteran of the industry, where to start ...

First off, I am afraid you have succumbed to one of the bazillion+ conspiracy theories out there ... there's literally one for any topic you choose.

The auto industry is probably the most consumer-focused and consumer-responsive of any large manufacturing industry out there. They are giving people what they (mainly) are asking for. For example, do you think Mary Barra listens to what AOC says ? Ha ha. I know Mary personally & professionally (starting with being classmates for 5 years at GMI/Kettering), she isn't responding to any of those idiots; rather, her customers. And her customers are far from being just Leftists. [Note: She is also bound to listen to/respond to her company's investors, which also has ZERO to do with politics.]

Additionally, I worked in Advanced Planning for some time. 10 years ago, the future plan was to go to fuel cells from ICE's, using electric as merely a transition at best. And to be skipped if possible, though there was considerable concern over the timing req'd. for infrastructure buildout to support fuel cells, spec. hydrogen.

All that has changed now due to public sentiment. A majority of people want something done now, and electric is far and away the quickest move. Note that I didn't say best. I have always believed the hydrogen fuel cell route was the right path. It's only just the most abundant element in the universe. And clean to boot.

You can chalk up another conspiracy theory shot all to heck ...


:rant:

 

[Dr Oldz]

Just ordered a new vehicle. I’m happy to pay the gas “guzzler” tax. Again

 

[psnt1ol]

As a 40+ year veteran of the industry, where to start ...

First off, I am afraid you have succumbed to one of the bazillion+ conspiracy theories out there ... there's literally one for any topic you choose.

The auto industry is probably the most consumer-focused and consumer-responsive of any large manufacturing industry out there. They are giving people what they (mainly) are asking for. For example, do you think Mary Barra listens to what AOC says ? Ha ha. I know Mary personally & professionally (starting with being classmates for 5 years at GMI/Kettering), she isn't responding to any of those idiots; rather, her customers. And her customers are far from being just Leftists. [Note: She is also bound to listen to/respond to her company's investors, which also has ZERO to do with politics.]

Additionally, I worked in Advanced Planning for some time. 10 years ago, the future plan was to go to fuel cells from ICE's, using electric as merely a transition at best. And to be skipped if possible, though there was considerable concern over the timing req'd. for infrastructure buildout to support fuel cells, spec. hydrogen.

All that has changed now due to public sentiment. A majority of people want something done now, and electric is far and away the quickest move. Note that I didn't say best. I have always believed the hydrogen fuel cell route was the right path. It's only just the most abundant element in the universe. And clean to boot.

You can chalk up another conspiracy theory shot all to heck ...


:rant:

Hydrogen is the cleanest solution since the byproduct from it is H2O. The only potential issue would be the water vapors. Too much of it in the atmosphere would also cause the greenhouse effect. It never ends... back to global warming again. LOL

From my understanding .... Detroit had a few working experimental hydrogen vehicles over 15 years ago. The investment in making the fuel cheaper was never made so the technology got stalled out. If the government made such investment back then....we wont be talking about EV right now.

 

[Coatingsarecrack]

Well when you take something away that people want and replace it with something everybody DOESNT want I'd say your losing some freedom

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Everybody? Broad term.


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[Coatingsarecrack]

I consider myself a gear head and have burned a gallon or 2 in my life. Over 1000 whp and happy if i could get 17 miles per gallon.

Not respecting an Electrics performance is just as ignorant as a v8 american muscle driver not appreciating the performance you can get from a Lotus or a modified Suburu. It’s just a different experience in performance.

To nix it because it doesn’t use gas....... silly. A driver drives.... period.

And i do believe there is climate change happening. We may not kill off the earth itself and we may. We are definitely changing it and do need to take care of it as we do our own bodies.

Ice caps are melting species will die. We will adapt or migrate to adjust.

I would gladly give up my gas guzzlers to help keep the earth in better shape but just don’t know if current electric’s are the solution.

I would enjoy driving a Tesla plaid up pikes peak as much as a Huracan. Just can’t get myself to look at tesla cuz I’m not a fan of Musk.


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[Big DaveBig Dave is verified member.]

An ICE ban, like a lot cities, states, or countries are planning in the next decade or so, won't work here in Australia. The infrastructure isn't in place, and won't be for some time, if ever. The vast distances between population centres isn't compatible with purely electric vehicles. Think of a country the size of the mainland United States, but with a population of only 25 million, most of which lives around the coasts.

In saying that, we are a 2 vehicle household, and I would happily change one to an electric vehicle. The Qashqai obviously, never the FJ. As for the power to charge it, we have solar panels on the roof, and in the middle of summer we are producing more than 3 times the amount of power than we consume. So we could easily cover it.

We are a weird country though, we have the highest uptake of solar panels in the world, but we're also one of the biggest suppliers of coal for power generation, and our politicians are addicted to the industry and the mining jobs it brings. If you threaten the industry, you'll probably lose the next election. Most people I talk to accept that the weather patterns are changing.

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[Klasse Act]

The only thing constant is change, right

Can someone please tell me how electricity is produced because I know coal plants are one way and another way is solar panels, but what happens when there's no sun for a couple days In the case of midwest USA in the winter that's alot of days

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[Big DaveBig Dave is verified member.]

The only thing constant is change, right

Can someone please tell me how electricity is produced because I know coal plants are one way and another way is solar panels, but what happens when there's no sun for a couple days In the case of midwest USA in the winter that's alot of days

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There's also hydroelectric, if you've got dams near you, wind farms, and of course nuclear, which we don't have over hear. I seem to remember one of the Scandinavian countries built a big incinerator, that burns huge amounts of rubbish while generating electricity. I'm sure there is some others I've forgotten.

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[Klasse Act]

There's dozens and dozens of windmills on I-65 going through Indiana when I head to "God's country", Tennessee and I'm glad I see them there and not ruining the beautiful state Tennessee is, thank you God!

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[joebruin77]

The only thing constant is change, right

but what happens when there's no sun for a couple days In the case of midwest USA in the winter that's alot of days

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Here is a good explanation (see below). Plus, keep in mind that solar power systems have batteries that can store a large amount of energy. For example, the latest Tesla Power Walls can store 13.5 kWh of electricity. That is enough to power a typical house for up to 18 hours.

Do solar panels work on cloudy days?
The simple answer is that solar panels do work on cloudy days – they just do not perform as well as they would on a bright sunny day. Though estimates range, solar panels will generate about 10 – 25% of their normal power output on a cloudy day. It would be accurate to say that solar panels do not work as well in rainy or cloudy weather.

It’s important to mention here that, contrary to what you might expect, cloudy and rainy climates are still often popular places for solar energy installations. The most indicative factor for the popularity of solar panels is the cost of electricity, not the amount of sunlight a city sees. Many of the top cities for solar in the U.S. are not particularly sunny. Rather, they have high electric rates, with the result that homeowners reap major benefits in terms of bill savings and a quick break-even point.

As an example take San Francisco, famous for the fog that hovers over the city for most of the year. And yet, San Francisco is a top-five city for solar as a result of its high cost of energy and a generally warm climate that yields soft but consistent sunlight all year long. This example helps to illustrate why sunlight alone cannot determine how effective solar will be at generating energy savings.

In some cases, clouds can actually result in better panel performance than standard sunny weather. A cloud can reflect or sometimes even magnify sunlight, which results in additional power output from your solar panels.

 

[opie2]

There's dozens and dozens of windmills on I-65 going through Indiana when I head to "God's country", Tennessee and I'm glad I see them there and not ruining the beautiful state Tennessee is, thank you God!

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yeah except turbine blades can not be recycled. thats one unmentioned issue we will have to face at some point.

natural gas is another means of electricity, we have those power plants now in the rust belt.

question about solar panels that are connected to the power grid....do folks that have them get a discount or a check from the power company?? for the extra energy that their home panels produce but cant store...which in turn gets back fed into the power grid.

and as far as GM goes....i wish i could tell mary barra to stop producing such ugly pickup trucks and camaros....good grief are they ugly. im holding out until they change. Sorry im not meaning to offend any folks that have them...remember thats just my opinion :laughing::laughing:

and maybe by that time they will remove the auto start stop feature, and the active fuel management....how stupid. they just create more issues when they come out with stuff like that. good thing atleast a tune will fix that.

 

[opie2]

Here is a good explanation (see below). Plus, keep in mind that solar power systems have batteries that can store a large amount of energy. For example, the latest Tesla Power Walls can store 13.5 kWh of electricity. That is enough to power a typical house for up to 18 hours.

Do solar panels work on cloudy days?
The simple answer is that solar panels do work on cloudy days – they just do not perform as well as they would on a bright sunny day. Though estimates range, solar panels will generate about 10 – 25% of their normal power output on a cloudy day. It would be accurate to say that solar panels do not work as well in rainy or cloudy weather.

It’s important to mention here that, contrary to what you might expect, cloudy and rainy climates are still often popular places for solar energy installations. The most indicative factor for the popularity of solar panels is the cost of electricity, not the amount of sunlight a city sees. Many of the top cities for solar in the U.S. are not particularly sunny. Rather, they have high electric rates, with the result that homeowners reap major benefits in terms of bill savings and a quick break-even point.

As an example take San Francisco, famous for the fog that hovers over the city for most of the year. And yet, San Francisco is a top-five city for solar as a result of its high cost of energy and a generally warm climate that yields soft but consistent sunlight all year long. This example helps to illustrate why sunlight alone cannot determine how effective solar will be at generating energy savings.

In some cases, clouds can actually result in better panel performance than standard sunny weather. A cloud can reflect or sometimes even magnify sunlight, which results in additional power output from your solar panels.

its also a top five city for solar because it is heavily mandated by their government policies.

 

[Klasse Act]

its also a top five city for solar because it is heavily mandated by their government policies.

San Fran, no way

Also about the Camaro and pick up trucks, they just can't get out of their way, can they I mean aren't they (Chevy) tired of Ford kicking their ass' the past 44 years. Now I know when you combine GMC & Chevy sales it's different but still. I'd think someone at Chevy, in a board room setting, would stand up and slam something on the table and shout "IM TIRED OF THESE UGLY TRUCKS AND LOSING TO FORD, EVEN RAM PASSED US!!"
As far as the Camaro goes, well, it drives great and has a great drivetrain and I think they only care about SUVs and got lucky with the C8 selling so great, I guess bad vision is a thing out there because that thing is FUGLY

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[dgage]

One thing you’re trying to use is that our freedoms are being taken away because some cities, states, countries “stated” that they’ll stop allowing or stop selling gas cars at a certain point. That’s a goal and will change in the future. So no freedoms being removed from us. As Coatings said, ultimately the consumers will guide these decisions.

 

[opie2]

San Fran, no way

Also about the Camaro and pick up trucks, they just can't get out of their way, can they I mean aren't they (Chevy) tired of Ford kicking their ass' the past 44 years. Now I know when you combine GMC & Chevy sales it's different but still. I'd think someone at Chevy, in a board room setting, would stand up and slam something on the table and shout "IM TIRED OF THESE UGLY TRUCKS AND LOSING TO FORD, EVEN RAM PASSED US!!"
As far as the Camaro goes, well, it drives great and has a great drivetrain and I think they only care about SUVs and got lucky with the C8 selling so great, I guess bad vision is a thing out there because that thing is FUGLY

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hahaha i know right. and im sure the new camaros drive great..never been in one, i just dont care for the look. sometimes status que isn't a bad thing. atleast the challengers have stayed somewhat true to their looks from the past.

as far as rams sales....well they did it right by selling them so cheap, and i hear they ride nice. I mean you get so many more bells and whistles at a cheaper price than gm or even ford, so no wonder so many ppl buy them. although rams resale value is not as good.

and yeah focusing on suvs for sure, they fazed out most models of cars. now most folks want a "pickup" with a tiny bed and huge cab :doh:

One thing you’re trying to use is that our freedoms are being taken away because some cities, states, countries “stated” that they’ll stop allowing or stop selling gas cars at a certain point. That’s a goal and will change in the future. So no freedoms being removed from us. As Coatings said, ultimately the consumers will guide these decisions.

will it though unless big goverment tells you...hey you have to do this or else. i think we can agree we already have seen that start to show its ugly head in the last year or so.