Is it really true?
- Thread starter Largebore
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StephenK
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- Jul 23, 2006
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not sure if this is what you are looking for but here i go.
you car's paint can only take in so much of the oils and wax before it starts to repel it, if that happens it will be hazy and streaking. plus thick layers will "kill" you are trying to remove it.
you car's paint can only take in so much of the oils and wax before it starts to repel it, if that happens it will be hazy and streaking. plus thick layers will "kill" you are trying to remove it.
scottburton11
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- Jun 8, 2008
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According to Ultraviolet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Right now a skeptic should be thinking "I wonder how much octyl methoxycinnamate is in my Fuzion?"
Right now a skeptic should be thinking "I wonder how much octyl methoxycinnamate is in my Fuzion?"
ScottB
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- Mar 3, 2006
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Im sure they've been tested like sunscreen, some samples without and some with to see if a difference is noted. The real question is how much is needed, and how can you be sure enough is left on surface, after all you buff off some of the product. I am no scientist, but sure there are some factors to it. Wheres TOGWT when we need him ...
XR5Turbo
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- Apr 26, 2007
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I'd really like to know the answer to how long these UV inhibitors last in waxes and sealants? I mean, we all know sunscreen is effective on skin but it usually only last 4 hours or so, even less with water.
So, what magical ingredient do car products that claim UV protection have in them that are so much more durable than the stuff we put on skin?
I know a lot of car product manufacturers claim UV inhibitors in their products but I don't remember any stating how long it lasts, could be 4 hours for all I know. I think ultimately it might be a bit of marketing hype.
So, what magical ingredient do car products that claim UV protection have in them that are so much more durable than the stuff we put on skin?
I know a lot of car product manufacturers claim UV inhibitors in their products but I don't remember any stating how long it lasts, could be 4 hours for all I know. I think ultimately it might be a bit of marketing hype.
Largebore
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Seems like maybe it is hype. But if so it is kind of serious in the sense that we are all content thinking our LSP is protecting our finish against UV and premature color loss...I mean that is one of the chief reasons to be for these waxes and sealants. Additionally, I would like to know what these LSP actually do protect against. I mean my car was bathed in the best wax and one bird poop and not three hours later the stain was so badly etched into my car that I had to compound it.
Beading water tricks look impressive but really, other than marketing talk has ANYONE any proof that LSP's do anything other than add some shine for awhile ?
Beading water tricks look impressive but really, other than marketing talk has ANYONE any proof that LSP's do anything other than add some shine for awhile ?
budman3
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- Mar 3, 2006
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Sounds like a good time for a test ... take half of your car and wax it as you normally would. Leave the other half untouched and allow to bake in the sun for a few years, preferably in Arizona. Come back and report if you have the same thoughts. Of course that's unrealistic but sounds like the only answer for your questions.
Have you used a wax or sealant and still had UV paint damage - either fading or CC failure? If not, then the LSP is doing its job. Also the clear coat is applied to cars now to prevent the color pigments from oxidizing in the paint, unlike single stage paint jobs which can oxidize quickly without the proper care. I think Optimum is the only line that have UV absorbers in their products. What that is ... you've got me. All I know is keeping vehicles with a fresh coat of LSP I haven't seen any paint damages ...
As for the bird bomb, what "best wax' did you use? Traditional carnauba paste waxes usually protect better than show car waxes and especially sealants. One major downside to Zaino is that it stinks at protecting against the elements. Also, depending on what the bird ate depends on the etching. If they ate something acidic, guess what, it's going to etch if you don't remove it immediately.
Largebore
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hmmmm you would think that with most manufacturers touting the benefits of uv protection they would have done a test or consulted a chemist etc. I think that is their job not mine. It is my money they want. Now I say ok, I will part with my dough, but just prove your claims in the real world not on some young gals sun tanned backside with claims that it works on skin so it must work on cars.
Largebore
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WOW found this doing some research on top manufacturers website q&a...
"Some waxes do contain UV-protection agents, but the amount of protection that a microscopically thin layer of wax can provide is limited
The primary goal of a wax is to protect the top layers of paint that contain UV-protection agents from the paint manufacture. If you wash and wax your car regularly, your paint will be protected and you should suffer no major UV damage over the normal course of the life of the car.
Don't be fooled by some companies that lead you to believe that it is the UV protection in a wax that protects your car's finish from fading and failure, this is dishonest and simply not true. Taking care of the paint you presently have will go further to protect your finish than relying on protection supplied by a liquid you pour out of a bottle, or a wax you scoop out of a can. UV protection in a car wax formula is only an extra-dose of preventative maintenance, not the end-all, cure-all that some companies would lead you to believe.
UV protection for paint is much different from UV blocking ingredients for human skin. The two formulas are nothing alike and work in drastically different ways. There is no correlation between the ratings applied to the different levels of sun blocking protection for products intended for use on human skin and the ingredients available for use in an automotive wax formula. Sad to say, much of what you see advertised about the protective qualities of most car care products on the market today is simply over-exaggerated hype used to separate you from your hard earned dollars."
"Some waxes do contain UV-protection agents, but the amount of protection that a microscopically thin layer of wax can provide is limited
The primary goal of a wax is to protect the top layers of paint that contain UV-protection agents from the paint manufacture. If you wash and wax your car regularly, your paint will be protected and you should suffer no major UV damage over the normal course of the life of the car.
Don't be fooled by some companies that lead you to believe that it is the UV protection in a wax that protects your car's finish from fading and failure, this is dishonest and simply not true. Taking care of the paint you presently have will go further to protect your finish than relying on protection supplied by a liquid you pour out of a bottle, or a wax you scoop out of a can. UV protection in a car wax formula is only an extra-dose of preventative maintenance, not the end-all, cure-all that some companies would lead you to believe.
UV protection for paint is much different from UV blocking ingredients for human skin. The two formulas are nothing alike and work in drastically different ways. There is no correlation between the ratings applied to the different levels of sun blocking protection for products intended for use on human skin and the ingredients available for use in an automotive wax formula. Sad to say, much of what you see advertised about the protective qualities of most car care products on the market today is simply over-exaggerated hype used to separate you from your hard earned dollars."
Last edited:
ScottB
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I can tell you that a sealant seems to offer a lower degree of protection from doo-doo. I have been hit or miss (no pun) when using a wax, but most the time the sealant seems to scar with these droppings.
ScottB
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I can tell you that a sealant seems to offer a lower degree of protection from doo-doo. I have been hit or miss (no pun) when using a wax, but most the time the sealant seems to scar with these droppings.
What I will offer in closing, why not do a scientific test and stop waxing and sealing all together. Lets see how the finish fares at 1, 2, 3, 4 year marks. I can tell you unscientifically that cars that are kept up through washing and waxing are more attractive as used cars and normally seem in better condition from at least a finish stand point. Plus I prefer standing out and looking good, versus blending in to a crowd. Cars are depreciating items so no real benefit other than its a hobby.
XR5Turbo
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- Apr 26, 2007
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I don't think anyone here would disagree with that, having owned one of my cars 20 years now I can attest that regular washing/polishing/waxing does protect the paint, as the car still looks superb. it's a single stage paint as well.
I put that down to keeping the paint clean and not allowing the harsh elements and contaminants to breakdown the surface over time.
I'm pretty certain that for most of those years the products I used contained no proclaimed UV inhibiting capabilities and that's why I still think it's marketing speel to promote this, particularly as it's very difficult to prove otherwise.
TOGWT
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- Dec 4, 2006
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The A B C of UV Radiation- One type of invisible radiation is infra-red radiation, which generates heat. The other variety is ultraviolet (UV) radiation.UV radiation is made up of three components: UV-A, UV-B and UV-C.
The harmful effects of UV-B and UV-C have been known for some time (no UV-C from the sun reaches the earth’s surface; it is all absorbed by the ozone layer). UV-A was, until recently, thought to be relatively harmless, but evidence is emerging that UV-A not only contributes to skin damage but also increases the risk of developing skin cancer. Remember, UV radiation is present in the sun’s rays throughout the year in varying amounts. Ordinary car window glass filters out about 97% of the UV-B radiation and about 37% of UV-A radiation. It is approximately equivalent to a good sunscreen, which means that if you’re sitting in the sun during a long trip you could still get burnt from the amount of radiation coming through the glass. Laminated windscreens block all of the UV-B radiation and about 80% of the UV-A radiation.
Information resource - http://www.publichealthgreybruce.on.ca/cancer/Sunsense/UV_Radiation.htm
Ultraviolet Radiation (UVR) [:so named because the spectrum starts with wavelengths slightly shorter than the wavelengths humans identify as the colour violet (purple)]:
Ultra violet (UV-B) radiation is a paint film surface's greatest enemy, causing more damage than any other airborne contaminant and affecting both the interior and exterior of a vehicle. The light in this spectral range is responsible for photo degradation. Photo degradation results in discoloration, fading, embitterment, cracking, chalking and/or loss of mechanical properties.
Chalking gel coat fibreglass, yellowing plastics, fading and weakening fabrics and sunburned skin are all familiar problems caused by UV light. Infrared radiation (IR) is a light source that transmits heat that when combined with a UV source will cause oxidation by drying out the material. Ultraviolet Light Absorbers (UVA) are molecules used in organic materials (polymers, paints, etc.) to absorb UV light in order to reduce the degradation (photo-oxidation) of a material. A number of different UVA exist with different absorption properties. UVA can disappear over time, so renewing UVR protection is necessary
Before UV light can cause harm, it must first be absorbed. If it is not turned into heat or transferred to a nearby stabilizer molecule called a quencher, it breaks weak chemical bonds. This is the beginning of UV damage; some materials absorb UV light more readily than other materials. Materials that readily absorb UV light are quickly damaged...rubber, vinyl, gel coat fibreglass, and many other plastics. Acrylic is slow to absorb UV light and accordingly very resistant to photo degradation.
Competitive absorbers (i.e. the carbon black in tyres) provide protection by converting UV light to heat so it can dissipate harmlessly. All UV stabilizers are consumed as they do their job. In a way, they serve as sacrificial molecules, taking the abuse from UV light instead of the material they are protecting. When UV light is absorbed, it starts to break (cleave) weak chemical bonds, which leads to bleaching (fading), discoloration, chalking, brittleness and cracking - all indications of UV deterioration.
Thus, it is important to provide UV protection with agents that use competitive absorption to convert the light wave energy into harmless heat (like the carbon black in tyres) Untreated rubber, vinyl, and other plastics readily absorb and are degraded by UV light 303 ™ Space Protectant is a product that will provide most surfaces with UVR protection
Carnauba and synthetic waxes do not inherently provide UVR protection because of there (to varying degrees) optical clarity (i.e. it lets the paint colour come through (and of course its gloss) conversely it can do nothing to shield the paint from UV radiation, the some is true of a polymer. Some Carnauba and polymer suppliers (but not all, as it is a very expensive addition) formulate UVR protection into their product.
Clear coat paint (polyurethane) provides the colour and base coats with protection, and usually has UVR protection added in the final coating; this tends to migrate towards the upper level of the clear coat (this is why it’s important to check how much of the paint surface you are removing with an abrasive polish)
Many polymers are degraded by Ultra violet radiation (UV) absorption leads to chain degradation and loss of strength as it breaks the molecular bonds on polymer type materials (i.e. plastics, paints and rubber). Once its molecular bond has been compromised materials are more susceptible to oxidation, UVR damage also increases the rate of oxidation. In addition, many pigments and dyes absorb UV and change colour
Heat is also harmful to exposed materials, the heat you feel from the sun, on the dash, etc, is the infra-red (IR) waves at the other end of the spectrum.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultraviolet
The harmful effects of UV-B and UV-C have been known for some time (no UV-C from the sun reaches the earth’s surface; it is all absorbed by the ozone layer). UV-A was, until recently, thought to be relatively harmless, but evidence is emerging that UV-A not only contributes to skin damage but also increases the risk of developing skin cancer. Remember, UV radiation is present in the sun’s rays throughout the year in varying amounts. Ordinary car window glass filters out about 97% of the UV-B radiation and about 37% of UV-A radiation. It is approximately equivalent to a good sunscreen, which means that if you’re sitting in the sun during a long trip you could still get burnt from the amount of radiation coming through the glass. Laminated windscreens block all of the UV-B radiation and about 80% of the UV-A radiation.
Information resource - http://www.publichealthgreybruce.on.ca/cancer/Sunsense/UV_Radiation.htm
Ultraviolet Radiation (UVR) [:so named because the spectrum starts with wavelengths slightly shorter than the wavelengths humans identify as the colour violet (purple)]:
Ultra violet (UV-B) radiation is a paint film surface's greatest enemy, causing more damage than any other airborne contaminant and affecting both the interior and exterior of a vehicle. The light in this spectral range is responsible for photo degradation. Photo degradation results in discoloration, fading, embitterment, cracking, chalking and/or loss of mechanical properties.
Chalking gel coat fibreglass, yellowing plastics, fading and weakening fabrics and sunburned skin are all familiar problems caused by UV light. Infrared radiation (IR) is a light source that transmits heat that when combined with a UV source will cause oxidation by drying out the material. Ultraviolet Light Absorbers (UVA) are molecules used in organic materials (polymers, paints, etc.) to absorb UV light in order to reduce the degradation (photo-oxidation) of a material. A number of different UVA exist with different absorption properties. UVA can disappear over time, so renewing UVR protection is necessary
Before UV light can cause harm, it must first be absorbed. If it is not turned into heat or transferred to a nearby stabilizer molecule called a quencher, it breaks weak chemical bonds. This is the beginning of UV damage; some materials absorb UV light more readily than other materials. Materials that readily absorb UV light are quickly damaged...rubber, vinyl, gel coat fibreglass, and many other plastics. Acrylic is slow to absorb UV light and accordingly very resistant to photo degradation.
Competitive absorbers (i.e. the carbon black in tyres) provide protection by converting UV light to heat so it can dissipate harmlessly. All UV stabilizers are consumed as they do their job. In a way, they serve as sacrificial molecules, taking the abuse from UV light instead of the material they are protecting. When UV light is absorbed, it starts to break (cleave) weak chemical bonds, which leads to bleaching (fading), discoloration, chalking, brittleness and cracking - all indications of UV deterioration.
Thus, it is important to provide UV protection with agents that use competitive absorption to convert the light wave energy into harmless heat (like the carbon black in tyres) Untreated rubber, vinyl, and other plastics readily absorb and are degraded by UV light 303 ™ Space Protectant is a product that will provide most surfaces with UVR protection
Carnauba and synthetic waxes do not inherently provide UVR protection because of there (to varying degrees) optical clarity (i.e. it lets the paint colour come through (and of course its gloss) conversely it can do nothing to shield the paint from UV radiation, the some is true of a polymer. Some Carnauba and polymer suppliers (but not all, as it is a very expensive addition) formulate UVR protection into their product.
Clear coat paint (polyurethane) provides the colour and base coats with protection, and usually has UVR protection added in the final coating; this tends to migrate towards the upper level of the clear coat (this is why it’s important to check how much of the paint surface you are removing with an abrasive polish)
Many polymers are degraded by Ultra violet radiation (UV) absorption leads to chain degradation and loss of strength as it breaks the molecular bonds on polymer type materials (i.e. plastics, paints and rubber). Once its molecular bond has been compromised materials are more susceptible to oxidation, UVR damage also increases the rate of oxidation. In addition, many pigments and dyes absorb UV and change colour
Heat is also harmful to exposed materials, the heat you feel from the sun, on the dash, etc, is the infra-red (IR) waves at the other end of the spectrum.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultraviolet
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