Claying left scratches

Da Fats

Da Fats

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I was using XMT clay today (can not wait to be done with it I dislike this bar very much) on a brand new toyota avalon. The paint had never been washed or waxed after purchase and from the feel of it had no protection when it got to me.

I did a quick sunlight check before i got started and noticed some swirls from the dealer but I did not notice linear scratches on the hood. After claying I found linear scratches in the direction I clayed. I used ONR mixed to clay lube strength x2 as my lube. I did not pick up a tremendous amount of stuff off the paint but it did feel slightly gritty before I started.

Is it possible to clay without marring the paint? I am not using a lot of pressure and I fold the clay every 1/2 a panel regaurdless of appearance to a fresh side. This was a brand new chunk of clay and the hood was the first section i started on. Should I use a finer clay on softer paints like toyota and honda?

I also noticed my 530 grey micro's feel stiff... I worry this could also be the culprit.. any chance there is a way to soften them up again?

Thanks for any advice.
 
I feel your pain man. I used the Pinnacle Poly Clay which is very gentle and it left scratches all over my car (which is black too). I'm no expert but I'm of the opinion that any time anything comes into contact with paint there's always a risk. Therefore, the only time I'll ever clay my car is if I plan on polishing it. But I'm just not that sure that I'm ever going to clay it again, especially since it's usually in my garage.
 
Trying washing your Micro's in vinegar which should restore most of the softness. As far as claying, mostly every time you clay you will need to follow up with a polish. Some say they have successfully clayed without requiring a mild abrasive, but I am definitely not part of that lucky few despite how gentile I may be.
 
First off did you press really hard when claying becuase that will mar the finish. Second did you need the clay alot when claying the car because not doing so will marr the finish. Did you use enough lube? Did you clean the car properly before you started claying? What color is the car and how sof is the clear?

These are all questions that come into why the clay marred the surface.

I painted my brake red and had red fall out from the fumes all over my truck and I used XMT 360 with out marring the finish.
 
That's one reason why I don't clay if I'm not polishing.
 
claying is slightly abrasive, plain and simple. For best results it should be done prior to polishing as a specialized step. If not polishing, consider an AIO with some light filling ability or a glaze.
 
Well I had rad on here about claying even new cars to pull the rail dust and other contaminants out of the paint before putting down your First LSP. I did not plan on polishing this car out and luckily the Poli Coat+Colli 915 filled everything in until the car does warrant a full polish. I clay ed to try to get th emaximum life out of the sealent + colli combo

Thanks for the heads up. What vinegar/Water ratio do you use to soften your MF ?


Chris
 
Da Fats said:
Well I had rad on here about claying even new cars to pull the rail dust and other contaminants out of the paint before putting down your First LSP. I did not plan on polishing this car out and luckily the Poli Coat+Colli 915 filled everything in until the car does warrant a full polish. I clay ed to try to get th emaximum life out of the sealent + colli combo

Thanks for the heads up. What vinegar/Water ratio do you use to soften your MF ?


Chris
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I'd like to know this as well... I buy hundreds of microfibers from Sam's Club, they're not Auto Geek/Cobra quality (granted) but for the price they last and once they get worn out I simply switch them over to the interior/wheel rags ;)
 
Dynamic_Detailing said:
I'd like to know this as well... I buy hundreds of microfibers from Sam's Club, they're not Auto Geek/Cobra quality (granted) but for the price they last and once they get worn out I simply switch them over to the interior/wheel rags ;)
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Bump for the vinegar details to increase softness of microfibers in the washer :)

PS: Regarding the original post/thread topic - since I have a new car without any visible or obvious contaminants or blemishes of any kind, I would purchase a mild clay bar, not aggressive, correct? Would Griot's clay be appropriate for my finish - they only offer one type, so I wouldn't be able to choose soft or aggressive clay.
 
Dynamic_Detailing said:
Bump for the vinegar details to increase softness of microfibers in the washer :)

PS: Regarding the original post/thread topic - since I have a new car without any visible or obvious contaminants or blemishes of any kind, I would purchase a mild clay bar, not aggressive, correct? Would Griot's clay be appropriate for my finish - they only offer one type, so I wouldn't be able to choose soft or aggressive clay.
Click to expand...
Get the Pinnacle Poly clay which is mild.
 
Rsurfer said:
Get the Pinnacle Poly clay which is mild.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot for your help... I was going to go with Griot's or Meg's clay bars, but it seems like the Polyclay will be the most effective and forgiving at the same time for my finish. Have a good one :)
 
Dynamic_Detailing said:
Thanks a lot for your help... I was going to go with Griot's or Meg's clay bars, but it seems like the Polyclay will be the most effective and forgiving at the same time for my finish. Have a good one :)
Click to expand...
I have used Griots clay for years without any difficulty. The only time I have had a problem is if I have picked up something with it and then rubbed it on the paint. The same thing can happen with microfiber. They both like to pick up small particles then rub them on your paint. You have to knead the clay frequently and never let your MFs touch the ground. I always inspect the MFs for debris prior to using.
 
5.4 Shelby said:
I have used Griots clay for years without any difficulty. The only time I have had a problem is if I have picked up something with it and then rubbed it on the paint. The same thing can happen with microfiber. They both like to pick up small particles then rub them on your paint. You have to knead the clay frequently and never let your MFs touch the ground. I always inspect the MFs for debris prior to using.
Click to expand...

I noticed the very first nearly microscopic hairline scratches on my car's hood yesterday when the direct sunlight hit it :(

After only six days... the first scratches appear - kind of broke my heart a little. I used brand new (literally out of the plastic bag they came in) microfibers, and a TON of high lubricity detail spray (even spraying the microfiber first, AND the paint for extra protection) yet the powers at work in the universe frowned upon my endeavor to properly spray detail my car, haha! Now that I think about it though, I think I did forget to use my California duster to remove surface dust before QDing. Maybe that's why?

Anyway - are you saying the type of clay really doesn't matter, as long as I never drop it and knead it very often (is there a way to clean clay)? If that's the case, Wal Mart sells Meg's Clay Bar Kit (2 50g bars, Spray Detailer, Microfiber cloth, and 4oz Sample of liquid wax) for $15 ;)

I don't want to get myself too confused or make a mountain from a molehill... but I am just very concerned about doing what's best for the car's finish, but of course I also have an eye on budget.
 
My understanding is there are only 2 or 3 different types of clay. There was a thread on this forum a while back that talked about it. Apparently there is a patent on the clay and most if not all is made by the same company. I dont have time to search for it now. I will try later if I get the chance.

Had you been using your duster on that car prior to the clay? That might be your scratch source. The dusters pick up particles and can rub them on your paint. In my opinion, QDs are much safer than dusters in that they will lubricate the particles and help your MFs pick them up with less risk of scratching.

If I drop clay, I throw it away. Not worth the risk of picking up a small pebble or metal shaving or something else dangerous.
 
5.4 Shelby said:
My understanding is there are only 2 or 3 different types of clay. There was a thread on this forum a while back that talked about it. Apparently there is a patent on the clay and most if not all is made by the same company. I dont have time to search for it now. I will try later if I get the chance.

Had you been using your duster on that car prior to the clay? That might be your scratch source. The dusters pick up particles and can rub them on your paint. In my opinion, QDs are much safer than dusters in that they will lubricate the particles and help your MFs pick them up with less risk of scratching.

If I drop clay, I throw it away. Not worth the risk of picking up a small pebble or metal shaving or something else dangerous.
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I remember hearing that a while ago as well, now that you bring it up, the patent being held by Clay Magic (thread here: http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/auto-detailing-101/19532-clay-bar-any-real-difference.html). When you say 2 or 3 types of clay, do you mean softness/aggressiveness, or an actually different type/formulation altogether? I will search the forum and see what I can pull up. I received a PM from someone who really seems to know their stuff, suggestion that the Pinnacle Polyclay was 1,000x better than the Meguair's Detail Clay.

OH - YOU'RE RIGHT ABOUT THE DUSTER! I have owned and used it for YEARS, and even though they (of course) claim it won't scratch and 'works better when dirty' I am sure the California Duster is to blame - at least a majority of the scratches that are visible. I will continue to use fresh microfibers and be very generous on the QD spraying my cloth AND the paint! :)

PS: Someone mentioned earlier that regular clothing detergent + a little vinegar works excellent for removing waxes from the microfibers AND adding softness... how much vinegar should I use, and I'm suspecting it is the white vinegar - right?
 
I have been using Clay Magic brand clays for years. I find that even if I use the gentle, blue clay I will get some micro scratching. But generally one going over with the mildest of polishes will take care of them.

Now when I got my last brand new car (a Zinc Yellow 2003 Ford SVT Cobra) I had to go to the very aggressive red clay to remove all the embedded rail dust. I had to press quite hard to get it all to come off. And afterwards I had to polish the car to bring it back up to new car specs. And back then I only had Meguiars 83 and 82 to use.
It's a lot easier to get a perfect finish with today's products.
 
After only six days... the first scratches appear - kind of broke my heart a little. I used brand new (literally out of the plastic bag they came in) microfibers, and a TON of high lubricity detail spray (even spraying the microfiber first, AND the paint for extra protection) yet the powers at work in the universe frowned upon my endeavor to properly spray detail my car, haha!
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Right there is part of the problem. You never use MF towels without washing them first. There may be other things at play here but that's a contributing factor.
 
RTexasF said:
Right there is part of the problem. You never use MF towels without washing them first. There may be other things at play here but that's a contributing factor.
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(SLAPS SELF ON FOREHEAD) I had actually thought of that fact after the scenario played out... but had never read it explicitly stated anywhere - until now :(

Thank you so much for letting me know, although it can't help some of the other defects from the first QD wipe-down, it will certainly avoid many others into the future!

In fact... the scratches left behind are so fine, I am almost certain they can be removed by hand with a very mild polish; such as Meg's Scratch-X perhaps (although I have not had great results with that product in the past - but that could have been due to the product being quite old and applying to a warm paint surface).

Thank you sincerely for the tip - I will never forget it! :)
 
oldmodman said:
I have been using Clay Magic brand clays for years. I find that even if I use the gentle, blue clay I will get some micro scratching. But generally one going over with the mildest of polishes will take care of them.

Now when I got my last brand new car (a Zinc Yellow 2003 Ford SVT Cobra) I had to go to the very aggressive red clay to remove all the embedded rail dust. I had to press quite hard to get it all to come off. And afterwards I had to polish the car to bring it back up to new car specs. And back then I only had Meguiars 83 and 82 to use.
It's a lot easier to get a perfect finish with today's products.
Click to expand...

Hopefully I don't see any micro-marring from the clay bar. I will be using a good amount of lubrication and constantly kneading it to reveal a clean surface. I will polish the car afterward anyway, just for peace of mind I suppose, followed by a sealant and a top carnuaba wax. This coming week I believe I have two days in a row completely off - a rarity! Since I don't have a garage, I am unsure how to seal the paint, and allow it to cure for 12 hours before applying the wax, without letting the evening/morning dew collect on the vehicle.
 
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