Antique cars - need advice

Calendyr

Calendyr

New member
Joined
Jun 9, 2013
Messages
3,996
Reaction score
0
Hey guys,

I have just been contacted by the president of the local Antique Car Club regarding an email I sent him offering to raffle a free 1 step polish detail for one of their members.

I am meeting them next week at their weekly event.

I need some advice regarding this.

I am planning to talk about washing methods with them. Should I suggest ONR as a good way to wash antique cars? I was planning on showing them the improved Garry Dean method with 1 bucket, and 6 microfiber towels. What do you guys think?

Also I plan to talk about Dressings, I am sure most of them are Armor All addicts and I hope to get them clean ;)

Also if some of you have experience dealing with Antique car clubs any advice would be welcome. My hope is to pick some restoration work but since I am starting out, any work would be good.
 
I think it's a great idea to introduce them to rinseless and waterless washes.

I'm a member of several local clubs and recommend them all the time.

Most members cars are garage queens that seldom get more than dusty. Plus as our cars get older weather seals aren't as effective. Using those products helps reduce water damage where you don't want it going.

Also members complain about swirls, etc. Teach them the correct way to maintain their paint.

A local detailer is a member of several clubs in the area also. He gets a lot of work from members that want perfect paint but don't want to do it themselves.
 
I think it's a great idea. The dealership where I work hosts an All- Chevy show each year, sponsored by the local Corvette Club and I've been thinking about doing the same thing. Some of the cleaning habits these people use on very expensive cars is just atrocious. Focusing on rinseless and waterless washes first is a good itinerary. Many of the folks just don't know of anything beyond spray detailer or bucket wash. Nick did a tutorial some time ago, showing a very good waterless technique. It's worth searching for. Also, if you're looking for business, a demonstration of the safety of a D/A polisher like Mike does with his hand on the hood of a car might also be a good idea. Folks who are very proud of their vehicles might be more inclined to trust someone who uses better processes than the old familiar rotary and wool. Go to Mike's links on his various TV spots for presentation tips. He gets his message across in a very short time frame.
Good luck!

Bill
 
Mike wrote an article regarding antique cars and it says you should go with waterless instead.

"First things first... start with a clean car...
The first thing you want to do is wipe the paint clean using a waterless wash. Generally speaking you don't wash classic and antique cars using a normal car wash approach because you introduce water to all the cracks and crevices throughout the vehicle that you cannot get to in order to dry and this promotes rust in places you cannot see nor reach."

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/ask-expert-featuring-mike-phillips/25304-secret-removing-oxidation-restoring-show-car-finish-antique-single-stage-paints.html
 
Calendyr said:
I am planning to talk about washing methods with them.
Click to expand...


Not "Rinseless" but "Waterless"


How To Wash a Classic Muscle Car


The idea is to reduce water that will run down cracks and crevices.

Also, 100% take some "thin" sandwich baggies with you, a full box. Show them the "Baggie Test" even on new cars in the parking lot.

Encourage them to take a baggie, put it in their pocket and go home and feel the paint on their antique car FIRST with their clean hand, SECOND with the Baggie Test.

Afterwards, at least some of them will know you know what you're talking about and that's a step towards earning their trust.

Take my word for it... "Car Guys" spray paint, whether it's rattle can or spray gun, maybe not on their "special car" but on some other project and it drifts in the air and lands on their "special car".

Just look through how many of the project cars I have here at Autogeek that have overspray on them, like the 1947 Buick in this thread...


1955 Chevy & 1947 Buick Slantback - Show Car Makeover! - Pictures & Videos


Like the 1949 Chevy in this thread,

1949 Chevy 5-Window Pickup Extreme Makeover - Pictures & Videos


The "Baggie Test" uses the "Curiosity Factor" to hook your audience.



:)
 
BillyJack said:
Go to Mike's links on his various TV spots for presentation tips. He gets his message across in a very short time frame.
Good luck!

Bill
Click to expand...

This covers a lot in a short time and includes the baggie test... with one of the original TV Car Guys, Dave Bowman.




Removing Swirls and Oxidation By Machine
[video=youtube_share;PWdYCHZrpd8"]How To Remove Oxidation by Machine Polishing with...[/video]​






After this episode, Dave called and ordered everything we used to decontaminate and de-swirl his own cars.


:xyxthumbs:
 
This is a great idea. I own an old Corvette convertible and the car is far from waterproof. A full wash means a wet trunk carpet so waterless washes work great. I am positive a lot of other older cars have similar issues.

I don't know if people would pay to have you teach them but that would be great if they did. I do know a lot of older car owners know nothing about taking car of their paint. Just walk around any cruise-in and you'll get dizzy seeing all the swirls.
 
Thanks for the advices guys. Would you suggest I do test pannels at their meeting? Of so, combination of M105/M205/Meg Liquid Wax good?

I have never done waterless washes, I am a bit afraid of scratching the paint with that method. I will Watch a few videos this weekend but I have read several places how dangerous waterless is for the paint. Putting almost no lubricant between the paint and the towel with lots of dust and grim in between seems like a receipe for disaster to me. But, I will still check it out.

Is M105 too agressive for single stage paint? Should I go with something softer?
 
Calendyr said:
Putting almost no lubricant between the paint and the towel with lots of dust and grim in between seems like a recipe for disaster to me. But, I will still check it out.
Click to expand...

You've missed the point.

The primary difference between using spray detailer to remove light dust and a waterless wash to clean a car is the AMOUNT of product you lay down on the surface.

With a waterless wash the idea is not to be stingy with the product but hyperlubricate the surface to provide LOTS of LUBRICATION to help reduce the potential for instilling swirls when cleaning a car.

I see people get really hung up on using waterless, rinseless and spray detailers to get cars clean and too often these people completely forget two important factors.

1. SOME PEOPLE IN SOME SITUATION DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO RUNNING WATER.

In these situations... they don't have any other option. Can't believe how many comments I remove from our YouTube video when some keyboard commando makes a stupid comment about how they'll ONLY use a hose and bucket when in the video it is stated that NOT EVERYONE HAS ACCESS TO A HOSE AND A BUCKET.

Maybe there should be an IQ test before letting some guys have Internet access?


2. If a car is dirty, light or heavy, and you want to clean it, at some point YOU HAVE TO TOUCH THE CAR. No matter what cleaning method a person chooses, sooner or later "something" has to "touch" the paint. And as soon as "something has to touch the paint" the potential now exists to instill swirls and scratches.

It's your job to reduce the potential and you do this by using the best product you can obtain and use the best technique you can muster.

There is no perfect way to remove any level of dirt off the car. There's only really good ways.


When it comes to classics, antiques and streetrods, the kind of cars you would be speaking about at a "Car Club", (well you could be the speaker for the Prius Club), most of these types of cars are garage kept and NOT VERY DIRTY and using waterless wash, and laying down an ample amount, is a very good way to get them clean.

As far as instilling swirls in the process, heck most of these cars have swirls, just look at ALL the write-ups I've done for all the cool cars we've buffed out here at Autogeek. About 99.9% of them are swirled-out messes. No car owner with a swirled out mess should be getting all worked up about a waterless wash when their car already looks like dog doo.


So keep all the above in mind.

PLUS - If you do the baggie test on a way cool 1963 Impala and discover above surface contaminants... the ONLY way I would clay or decontaminate that car is if I was already planning to machine polish the paint to perfection and when that is the case any light swirls, marring or scratches inflicted while the car is being cleaned using a waterless wash is a mute point.

Think things through.




Calendyr said:
Is M105 too aggressive for single stage paint? Should I go with something softer?
Click to expand...

Yes. You don't always need to start out with a compound on single stage paint especially if it's older or antique and especially if it's original.

I think I have something written on this somewhere....


Great questions...



:)
 
Well Mike has given you some really great stuff and just remember
That using the least aggressive method to get the job done is key with the older cars. This is why you so a test spot not to just dial in your process but to start at your least aggressive point and achieve maximum results all while preserving good paint.

You never want to start out too aggressive and end up removing good paint that didn't need to be removed. It's all about paint preservation not paint destruction.

http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...se-least-aggressive-product-get-job-done.html
 
Ok, watched a few videos last night. Don't have waterless wash in my arsenal, will have to add some. Probably go with Ultima, it seems to be popular.

I understand the concept of WW, it just seemed like the most dangerous way to wash for me. The cars at the club I am going might be garage cars but they are also driven. The meet I am going to will have the guys with their cars there. They have a weekly meet and they have a large event about once a month. At their weekly meet they have 30 cars on average and at the monthly event they have about 400. So I am not sure these cars will be super clean, probably but not certain of it.

I agree that if they are already super swirled out and all, won't matter much how they are washed ;) So for demonstration purposes, maybe I could use a rinseless wash (Optimum) at much higher concentration in the way a Waterless wash is used? Or is that crazy?

So if I decide to do a test pannel, what should I use? Reconditioning creme? Ultimate Compound? Ultimate polish? I don't want to go too agressive but I would like the pannel corrected as well ;)

And yes, I will definatelly do a baggie test, this is one of the most effective way to make an owner realise there is something wrong with the paint, same for Windows. Thanks for that tip Mike, I am sure I will get a lot of business just with that test over the years!
 
I'm reading through this thread and you seem to be jumping around just a bit. As many have already suggested, a rinseless wash is your best bet when washing, as classics and antiques aren't sealed the way new vehicles are. Can you wash using the traditional method, of course, just understand that water will get through and you'll have to keep and eye on it. I recently performed a mild restoration on an all original 67' single stage Camaro that I washed using the traditional wash method.

I would suggest looking over this thread by Mile Phillips. It's an excellent read: http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...w-car-finish-antique-single-stage-paints.html

I have a few suggestion for you:

If left all original, classics and antiques are unique opportunities that don't come that often, so enjoy working on them!

Secondly, make sure you have Megs #7 on hand, if the vehicle is a single stage paint and your planning on polishing. Take a look at my thread on te mild Camaro Restoration. http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...w-car-finish-antique-single-stage-paints.html
 
I know, that is how my brain works. Someone will say something and 10 different ideas will pop in my head. Then I will have tons of questions and things I want to look at ;) It's my process. I try not to put any filter on it and like to ask questions no matter how far fetched or strange they are. It's the way I work problems and learn.

I had written off waterless washes after reading a few things saying they were the best way to damage your paint. Since Mike suggested I look at it again I did and now I understand how they can be used without too much danger to the paint. It's all a matter of how dirty the car is. In the process I learned the three stages of dirt accumulation so I did learn something extra.

I do have #7 Glaze on hand. About 32 ounces of it (over 32 ouces spilled during shipping, see unboxing thread for pictures ;)

So tomorrow is the day. Expecting light rain so I hope they won't cancel the meet. Also would be nice if it wasn't raining so I could do a demo of the wash technique and do a test pannel for them.

Will have a raffle of a detail package at the end for one of them too.
 
Calendyr said:
And yes, I will definatelly do a baggie test, this is one of the most effective way to make an owner realise there is something wrong with the paint, same for Windows.

Thanks for that tip Mike, I am sure I will get a lot of business just with that test over the years!
Click to expand...


I can't think of a time when I've shown the baggie test to a group of "Car Guys" that it didn't work. In fact not only does it open their eyes, but it helps you to earn their trust.



Calendyr said:
So tomorrow is the day. Expecting light rain so I hope they won't cancel the meet.
Click to expand...


How did it go?



:)
 
Went well.

Was a rainy night but 20 people did show up anyway ;) We were Lucky it did not rain even though weather was really ugly.

Some of the cars present:
- 70 Challenger with 440 Magnum (almost as beautiful as the Cuda to me)
- 68 Fury
- 76 Convertible Mercedes Benz
- Not sure of the exact year and model but Ford around 1930 entirelly restored and looked awesome!
- 57 Chevy (can't remember model name)
- Dodge Tornado (not sure of the year, looked mid-60s)
- lots of others but I have bad memory ;)

Cars were in decent shape, paint on some of them needed love. Mostly oxidation and maybe swirls (light was really ugly to look at paint so hard to tell).

I gathered the guys and said I wanted to give them a bit of info about car care. Said it would take maybe 15 mins.

So I started talking about paint system, explaining they had Single stage paint unless their car were repainted recently and explained why it was important to take good care of it.

Then I asked how they washed them. No one was using automatic car washes so that was good. I asked about 2 bucket system no one knew what it was so I explained in detail. Then I explained about dirt level and how to use waterless system when car had no bonded dirt.

This led to armor all and why to avoid it. Talked about paint contamination and had them do the baggie test ;)

I finished with asking them if they had any questions before we did the raffle. They asked questions for about 90 minutes ;)

All and all it went really well. I hope it will lead to some work. They have a big event coming this weekend, about 400 cars usually present. So I will make sure to go!

Funny thing is that the president of the club won the raffle so I will be doing 5 hours of work for him for free. Could not have worked out better I think. If I can do a good job for him, I am sure this will be very good for future leads.

They offered to put my business card on their website and in their membership application brochure for 200$ for a year. If I get a contract or two with them I think I will do it.
 
Calendyr said:
Went well.


Talked about paint contamination and had them do the baggie test ;)
Click to expand...

How did the baggie test go with the guys?

Did it look like it "opened their eyes?




Calendyr said:
They asked questions for about 90 minutes ;)
Click to expand...


If they're asking questions that means they were listening to you and interested.


Good job. It just gets easier from here forward. The more times you make presentations, the more comfortable you will get and the better you will get at getting your message across.


Congratulations!


:dblthumb2:
 
Yes, I had the owner of the car do the baggie test on his own car after I asked him to rub his paint with his bare hand and ask him if he could feel roughness. Once he was done he passed the bag to someone else and said : "Try this" ;) Everyone tried it ;)

I am comfortable making présentations, been doing them all my life in my previous fields of work. I found that getting started is always the hardest for me because there are a hundred things I want to say and have to find the right order to do it in. But once you start it usually takes about 2 to 3 minutes to feel comfortable talking to a group and then it becomes really easy.

Thanks for the good words.

BTW I am attending their large car show this weekend. I won't be able to do a presentation like I did this time because there will be about 400 cars present and I expect everyone to either stay with their own cars to talk to people wandering or wander around to see other people cars.

So how should I approach this? I was thinking going to see each car and maybe take pictures with my DSLR and give my business card to each owner individually.

I was also thinking about selling tickets for a raffle for a paint correction/polishing package for say 3$ for one ticket and 5$ for 2. Is that a bad idea? I could go lower on the prices as well. Idea is to get them to fill a form with their name phone and email so I can send them advertizing later. And having 1 detail to do for the winner would be a plus of course with the ticket prices paying for a part of the work.
 
Calendyr said:
paint correction/polishing package
Click to expand...


i hate to work on old cars ,most of them are restored on budget, so multiple repaint panels, bondo done ghetto style, trims falling apart , cracked paint , rubber falling in pieces , and most owners don`t pay a penny for a correction cause they know their car is perfect and they know "how to" better than your professional results. :))
also watch for thin paint , single stage ... another animal.
in 3 years of business i found 2max cars that had quality paint after restoration everything else was trash/junk from the repaint.
also owners know that the car has original paint and are visible at least 2-4 panels of respray :))

in my opinion , use this network to steer your business to new cars, hi-end if possible , is where the money are.
 
Thanks for the advice Cosmin, I was thinking the exact opposite of pretty much everything you said. I was thinking that single stage paint is usually much thicker than B/C. And that people would not mind paying for a good job to make their baby more beautiful.

I guess I will need that paint gauge if I am to work on these cars... an other big expense with still no revenue. Starting to get seriously annoyed at the phone not ringing no matter what I try.

Gonna start working on dealerships tomorrow. Don't care if the money is bad, I need to do detailing, and right now I am not. And I don't want to do any more free détails for friends, I want to see some money come in for the work. Good thing I have a steady job ;)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top