Test sometime to use your prewash foam in a regualar sprayer. Most solution clinging rather well to be able to desolve the grime and contaminants during the time it needs to be dwelling. Then you will see how much the foam it self is able to desolve the grime and contaminants when not haveing the foam. I have used degreasers that works great without foaming. Sure many times you get a longer dwell time from the foam. And I am a foamcannon man LOL. But a too thick foam can actually be working backwards in the cleaning ability. And it's when it's so thick it won't run off mostly and the foam don't burst or how you describe it. Then you have only bubbles against the surface and that don't cover the surface as a liquid does. Which foam are suposed to do is to desolve into a liquid form slowly and gets a higher dwell time that way. And thicker foam and too thin foams runs off faster. So it's just testing out the right concentration of the prewash foam you use to get the most effective foam.
Pump up Sprayer/Foamer Question
- Thread starter oneheadlite
- Start date
Test sometime to use your prewash foam in a regualar sprayer. Most solution clinging rather well to be able to desolve the grime and contaminants during the time it needs to be dwelling. Then you will see how much the foam it self is able to desolve the grime and contaminants when not haveing the foam. I have used degreasers that works great without foaming. Sure many times you get a longer dwell time from the foam. And I am a foamcannon man LOL. But a too thick foam can actually be working backwards in the cleaning ability. And it's when it's so thick it won't run off mostly and the foam don't burst or how you describe it. Then you have only bubbles against the surface and that don't cover the surface as a liquid does. Which foam are suposed to do is to desolve into a liquid form slowly and gets a higher dwell time that way. And thicker foam and too thin foams runs off faster. So it's just testing out the right concentration of the prewash foam you use to get the most effective foam.
Klasse Act
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It does run down and right now, due to temps, dwell time isn't an issue. Its going to be interesting to see how the IK Foam 9 works as the weather warms up, or should I say the various soaps I have work that is.
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It can be that you have used a product or it's was that since you got it. But an O-ring or rubber seal could be damage don't know the english word for it LOL. Make a call or email the US distributor of Kwazar and ask if they have the repair kit of rubber seals for your version of pump sprayer. Is it a foaming sprayer a regualar pressure sprayer?
There is a huge difference in how the foaming sprayer and a regualar pressure sprayer works. When create the foam it needs air so a foam sprayer needs a lot of air to work. Hence the need of needing to pump up the air pressure more than the other ones.
And also when filling the bottles with your solution. Don't overfill them over the recommended level. Rather fill a little less of product around 3/4 or 2/3 of the recommended volume. That way even if you need a little more pumps to get the pressure up first. It will be working longer before re-pump it.
@oneheadlite
Try to find a pump sprayer or a valve that you mount the same way you do the air filling valve. That has a max pressure release and useally with plastic bottles it's around 40-45psi or 3bar. There are ones with higher pressure but those are often in some sort of steel. But have not seen a foaming system with that higher pressure bottles or tanks. The pressure is 6bar or 80-90 psi on those with some kind of steel tanks and they are bigger from 1.5 gallon and up in size. Be carefull when testing with air pressures cause even low pressure can hurt you if things goes wrong. And the chemicals used is almost every one not so good to get in the eyes. So safety glasses on
/ Tony
No, everything seems legit, the ring sits properly I'm not only one who have an issue. BTW, it's a foamer. People who experience the same issue laugh at it saying you need to have Arnold's hands to cover a car with a foam. And later I noticed that all YouTube video reviews don't last more that 3-4 sec of working time before next cut and different camera position. That's why Germans moded it attaching an electric pump to it.
Yeah a foam pump sprayer uses a lot of air and it would be great to have Arnolds hands LOL. The cordless bicycle electric pumps seems like a great DIY to help with holding the pressure up. I have noticed too that just a little less air pressure and the foam pattern weakends. And need to be pumped up again. It's not so with the regualar pump sprayers though which works good longer even when the pressure goes down a bit. One thing is to get a IK9 foamer that has more room for the air pressure than what a handheld one has. I sometimes use a handheld foamer to get a longer dwell time for the tire cleaner. And it could be used when you cleaning the engine compartment. To do a lot of surface I find them not worth useing. And also if used I only fill 2/3 of the recommended volume. Over that is just too much pumping needed.
Coach Steve
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I just bought the Adam's Polishes 1.5 Foam Sprayer and it rocks! I was hesitant to pull the trigger on spending the $$ for one but, my hand gets so fatigued when using the spray trigger on the disposable bottles of tire/wheel cleaner and the amount of time pulling that trigger to adequately coat the wheel/tire, oy!
After using it the first time, I swear I'll never squeeze a spray bottle trigger for wheel cleaning again! The foam sprayer coats the entire wheel and tire in less than 5 secs. and I can adjust the width of the spray. In my opinion, it was worth every penny!
The biggest hurdle you're going to run into is not having the seals deteriorate from the chemicals we use. Those o-rings are really thin and not chemical, resistant in the least. It will be interesting to follow your progress to see what you eventually come up with. Who knows, we could be witnessing the birth of the next revolutionary tool for our biz!
Good luck and keep trying different approaches. It's not rocket surgery and the concept isn't complex. It's just a matter of finding the right combination of parts (that already exist) that solve each obstacle along the way.
After using it the first time, I swear I'll never squeeze a spray bottle trigger for wheel cleaning again! The foam sprayer coats the entire wheel and tire in less than 5 secs. and I can adjust the width of the spray. In my opinion, it was worth every penny!
The biggest hurdle you're going to run into is not having the seals deteriorate from the chemicals we use. Those o-rings are really thin and not chemical, resistant in the least. It will be interesting to follow your progress to see what you eventually come up with. Who knows, we could be witnessing the birth of the next revolutionary tool for our biz!
Good luck and keep trying different approaches. It's not rocket surgery and the concept isn't complex. It's just a matter of finding the right combination of parts (that already exist) that solve each obstacle along the way.
Klasse Act
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- Feb 21, 2012
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Coach Steve, which wheel cleaner are you using in there and at which ratio? It's funny how they (Adam's) put their name on it when it clearly says IK right on the sprayer itself.
Looking forward to using both of my IK's this Friday!
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Looking forward to using both of my IK's this Friday!
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Coach Steve
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Eagle1 All Tire&Wheel Cleaner full strength and Meg's Wheel Brightener 1:1.
oneheadlite
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- Aug 20, 2015
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Well, today during my lunch break I spent some more time with the sprayer.
The Flo Master sprayer has a different nozzle design than the sprayers I have at home (which match the videos I’ve seen online of people hacking cheap sprayers into foamers).
I spent some time digging through my box of spare small plastic caps trying to find something that would slip over the nozzle to add some scotch-brite style material to aerate the dispensed fluid as I saw in the videos. Not finding any caps I was willing to give up (I use them to cap off lines/etc during repairs), I remembered how at times the sprayer would foam just when the fluid level would get low and you were tipping the bottle around. The other part of the online how-to has you poke a small hole in the pickup tube.
So: Let’s try this. I used a pick and poked a hole in the pick up straw well above the fluid line. I took some old (emphasis on old) Zaino car wash that’s been hiding in my box, added an unscientific squeeze into the water in the sprayer, sealed it, and bumped it to 40psi.
Here’s the sprayer with fitting:
And here’s the output after playing with the factory nozzle a little:
Way better than I was expecting! At this point I’d feel comfortable actually flushing the sprayer out and trying it with some of my good chemicals.
Next thing on the experimentation to do list is to-
A: See how long it dispenses and how much coverage you get between recharges.
B: Try connecting my little cheapie tire inflator and see how annoying/effective that works. It’s a little cheapie Micro Start inflator that connects to their jump packs (or a cigarette lighter). If the bottle runs out of pressure crazy fast, I could use the little inflator and have the jump pack in my back pocket to power it (it’s one of the little jump packs, not huge ones!).
The Flo Master sprayer has a different nozzle design than the sprayers I have at home (which match the videos I’ve seen online of people hacking cheap sprayers into foamers).
I spent some time digging through my box of spare small plastic caps trying to find something that would slip over the nozzle to add some scotch-brite style material to aerate the dispensed fluid as I saw in the videos. Not finding any caps I was willing to give up (I use them to cap off lines/etc during repairs), I remembered how at times the sprayer would foam just when the fluid level would get low and you were tipping the bottle around. The other part of the online how-to has you poke a small hole in the pickup tube.
So: Let’s try this. I used a pick and poked a hole in the pick up straw well above the fluid line. I took some old (emphasis on old) Zaino car wash that’s been hiding in my box, added an unscientific squeeze into the water in the sprayer, sealed it, and bumped it to 40psi.
Here’s the sprayer with fitting:
And here’s the output after playing with the factory nozzle a little:
Way better than I was expecting! At this point I’d feel comfortable actually flushing the sprayer out and trying it with some of my good chemicals.
Next thing on the experimentation to do list is to-
A: See how long it dispenses and how much coverage you get between recharges.
B: Try connecting my little cheapie tire inflator and see how annoying/effective that works. It’s a little cheapie Micro Start inflator that connects to their jump packs (or a cigarette lighter). If the bottle runs out of pressure crazy fast, I could use the little inflator and have the jump pack in my back pocket to power it (it’s one of the little jump packs, not huge ones!).
Eldorado2k
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- Nov 9, 2015
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That’s correct, they aren’t foaming sprayers, but D143 foams so much coming out of it that you’d swear they are. It’s the only product I’ve run into that does that.
I’m anti foam in regards to hand held pump sprayers. The videos I’ve seen of the Kwazar Foaming Pump Sprayer shows it lasting only a few seconds before needing to be re pumped + if it’s anything like mine is when used with D143 turning it to foam then I’m sure it wastes a ton of product.
I don’t pre wash or foam before a 2BM wash, IMO it’s not necessary nor does it clean any noticeable amount of dirt off on its own. If I’m dealing with a vehicle that’s extra dirty I’ll rinse it then pre spray a panel with diluted Blackfire Bug Remover before washing with a soapy mitt. That seems to work really good IME.
Klasse Act
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What I and alot of people like about pre-wash foaming is this, it breaks down and removes a certain amount of the grit, thus making the 2BM that much more safer...and easier, cutting down on the chances of introducing scratches is a good thing!
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Eldorado2k
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I disagree with that. I’ve seen too many videos with people showing how they use a snow foam, let it dwell, then power rinse it off and the amount of grime is the same as if they would’ve just rinsed with the power washer. Foaming a car may add a bit more lubricity to your wash, but it removes little to no grime on its own.
Eldorado2k
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You have to keep in mind that car wash shampoos aren’t detergents, yes they’re soaps and they aid in cleaning, but their main purpose is to add lubricity.
Coatingsarecrack
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- Dec 9, 2018
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It’s funny I thought they were exact same too. It is an IK and Adams doesn’t hide the fact. Real big benefit to buying Adams is you can adjust the spray patterns. My only complaint from ones I got from rag company. Wonder if AG’s are the same?
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That's why I use dedicated prewash foam that are not made to aggitate with. And as always it's depends on the kind of dirt you have in your environment. It's like saying an APC don't clean or desolve anything better than a PW does when used on the exterior. A prewash foam is like an APC with foaming agents in it. It's like saying a wheel cleaner is not necessary just get a PW to clean them. I think I put up picture of the difference between rinse with PW and then prewash foam and PW rinsed in the winter months where I live. Mostly you see the evidence in the rinse bucket. I use multible wash mitts and still rinse them out in a rinse bucket to have them a little cleaner of all of the car soap before put in the washer. A prewash foam is not cleaning everything off though but more than just the PW does IME. And it don't need to be a prewash foam. You can use a mild alkaline based degreaser and get about the same results. But I agree with you on car soap vs prewash foam product. Then you have some not so great products and you have great products like in everything else.
Klasse Act
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I use certain soaps just for pre-wash and while they're dwelling and it begins to run off of the car I can see dirt in the foam. Let's also keep in mind that I stay ontop of my car and its coated with TAC system power plus Sio2 paint coating as well, plus topped with ALOT of "stuff". I know this, works for me and will be working tonight too!
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Eldorado2k
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You would see dirt running off the car if you rinsed it with water.
Klasse Act
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Right but because the soap is white you can see it in the foam on the ground when it piles up. Doesn't it make more sense to foam, dwell so it lifts and removes the dirt instead of blasting water directly into embedded dirt
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Eldorado2k
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Right but because the soap is white you can see it in the foam on the ground when it piles up. Doesn't it make more sense to foam, dwell so it lifts and removes the dirt instead of blasting water directly into embedded dirt
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It’s better to pre rinse with water, then foam and begin washing.
There’s no harm done with blasting water even from a power washer onto embedded dirt. Swirls aren’t caused that way.
It’s much better to blast as much dirt off with the pre rinse vs. having foam dwell because most of the dirt will still remain on the paint.
If someone has a power washer w/foam cannon and starts off the wash process by snow foaming the vehicle and goes straight into washing with a mitt he’s performing a much more risky wash vs. Pre rinsing with the power washer and then going straight into washing with a mitt. Guaranteed.
Klasse Act
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Ok...using a certain type of soap in the pre-wash foam will lift and carry the dirt down, the rest of the dirt is mixed with the soap and carried away in the rinse process. Now...explain to the class how strictly rinsing without soap is better than what I just clearly explained?
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