2 years with Opti-coat - not very happy

Well at over a 100$ an ounce, it better last more than a year! Very disapointed to see this. I hope it's an insolated incident based on incorrect application or curing. If this product only last Under 2 years, it's not something I was to sell to my clients.
 
sicklyscott said:
I used to be the kind of guy that would wash and wax my car every weekend but life happened. After getting married and buying a house I'm lucky if that's now once a month. In addition I have a baby on the way. In a nutshell my preference would be to clean it up in the spring, maybe a good detail mid-summer, and prepare it for the winter. Anything that would happen in between would be just a basic wash.
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Just wait 'til you have the baby. I'm fighting for time to do a basic wash on each car every other week :)
 
I am going to put in my 2 cents.

First of all, how does one explain 2.0 still beading/sheeting on many cars after several years?

1 - either it was not prepped/applied properly

2 - not maintained well, neglected, which is definitely at least one of the criteria, according to the OP.

The sandpaper like feel is a very good indicator that the car was not maintained properly. And that is the ONE requirement. So try a decon system like the Value guard ABC system or some other harsh cleaner.

And please don't take this the wrong way and I don't know who you are, heck, you maybe better than me at applying coatings, but it isn't as easy as slapping on some wax or sealant. We don't know any of the details about your prep work, or how you applied OC 2.0. Maybe you removed too much of it when wiping it.

PS: the guy who thought that 2.0 was discontinued due to not lasting? You couldn't be further from the truth.

OP - good luck and next time if 2.0 is gone from your car, try having a pro do the work. See if there is a difference in durability. Either way, you MUST wash the car regularly. You can't neglect it and blame the product.
 
tdekany said:
I am going to put in my 2 cents.

First of all, how does one explain 2.0 still beading/sheeting on many cars after several years?

1 - either it was not prepped/applied properly

2 - not maintained well, neglected, which is definitely at least one of the criteria, according to the OP.

The sandpaper like feel is a very good indicator that the car was not maintained properly. And that is the ONE requirement. So try a decon system like the Value guard ABC system or some other harsh cleaner.

And please don't take this the wrong way and I don't know who you are, heck, you maybe better than me at applying coatings, but it isn't as easy as slapping on some wax or sealant. We don't know any of the details about your prep work, or how you applied OC 2.0. Maybe you removed too much of it when wiping it.

PS: the guy who thought that 2.0 was discontinued due to not lasting? You couldn't be further from the truth.

OP - good luck and next time if 2.0 is gone from your car, try having a pro do the work. See if there is a difference in durability. Either way, you MUST wash the car regularly. You can't neglect it and blame the product.
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Fair points. I will state however that Opti-coat was marketed and sold as a hard coating that requires minimal maintenance. I'm not the kind of guy that expects to just spritz water on it and expect it to be clean. I wash my car on a monthly basis when the weather affords it. I will not wash my car in the winter time as my outside water supply is shut off for the winter and I refuse to use a car wash. I do clay it every 6 months.

I may have applied it too thin, completely possible. I did prep it however as directed.

I am not blaming the coating, just trying to figure out how to repair / revive it. I will say however if it takes using a DA with a paint cleaner annually to keep it in good shape I might as well use a good sealant. I don't see a benefit here.

I don't want this to turn into an Opti-Coat bashing thread, there are more than enough of those out there. Just trying to figure out a way forward.
 
Calendyr said:
Well at over a 100$ an ounce, it better last more than a year! Very disapointed to see this. I hope it's an insolated incident based on incorrect application or curing. If this product only last Under 2 years, it's not something I was to sell to my clients.
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naturally this is an isolated incident. this isn't a situation where a coating company came out with a new version and there are issues - this is 2.0, the coating that was instrumental in getting coatings in our (consumer) hands. it was on the market for several years as-in and became extremely popular. it got the rep it did and people were overpaying on ebay for leftover tubes once it was discontinued because it worked.

and you can polish many coatings without removing them, it depends on what you are using, how you are doing it and why you are doing it.

as mentioned, Poli-Seal is an AIO that will not remove the coating when used as prescribed. you can use other polishes in a cleaning manner with the proper pad to clean coating and/or prep for re-coating...or remove them. but i agree that it's too easy to beat it up with trad polishes even if you don't remove it so if you aren't going to re-coat, as usual with any unknown, approach the issue at hand with least aggressive technique first.

sicklyscott said:
I will say however if it takes using a DA with a paint cleaner annually to keep it in good shape I might as well use a good sealant. I don't see a benefit here.
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nonetheless, if it's still there, it's protecting the actual paint on your car. i think that is an important point to consider when coatings vs. sealant come up. so, while it may not be behaving the way you expect/like, if it was installed right, it should still be there and can be refreshed. just imagine what would have happened to your clear coat if the coating WASN'T there?

everyone's situation differs, but it's not SOP to expect a DA to have to be used annually on a coating for it to behave properly. you will have to maintain it, it's not a miracle product, but doing so to the car will be easier than if you DIDN'T have coating. it will be easier to clean and stay cleaner, longer...not forever...and at the same time, you'll have an appreciable sacrificial barrier on your paint, not a sealant that is 100x thinner or a fraction as "hard".

keep us updated.
 
I agree that if you put on a coating, one of the benefits is to be able to be able to get away with less agressive cleaning. It would make no sense to use coatings if you have to use a DA twice a year to clean it.

Swanicyouth seems to have had a few bad experiences with OC. I take it that none of you guys have had the same issues?

While not a miracle product, coatings are marketed as permanent protection with enhanced chemical and physical damage resistance. So not washing the car on a regular basis should not affect them.

Sicklyscott, did you get any info regarding this from Optimum? I am really curious to know what they will tell you.
 
Calendyr said:
While not a miracle product, coatings are marketed as permanent protection with enhanced chemical and physical damage resistance. So not washing the car on a regular basis should not affect them.
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I think if you had come to a detailing forum before coatings were available, and asked what the most important tip was for preserving the clearcoat on your new car, a common answer might have been to wash it regularly to keep environmental contaminants from bonding to and penetrating the clearcoat.

So I don't find it unreasonable that we see that as a recommendation for coating maintenance as well.
 
For whatever reason, OC 2.0 is still holding up to this day (topper free) and beads like crazy on the roof of my SUV. I OC'ed the whole vehicle at one point - and it didn't hold up. So, I chalked that one up to "user error".

A while after that, I OC'ed the roof and bumpers only. The prep was exactly what Optimum recommended - Optimum polishes, followed by IPA, then OC - using an Optimum Dual Pro Applicator (new).

It held up on the roof phenomenally, but the bumpers didn't make it through the winter. The roof even saw MAJOR contamination - as this vehicle sat at a body shop for over a month and had a ton of iron and sap on the roof. The beading is still intense there.

I know the prep was 100% perfect. I went overboard polishing multiple times with Optimum polishes and wiping down with IPA.

This leads me to believe there is *something* in road salt that either degraded OC or messed up its hydrophobic properties. This is just my experience - which seems to jive somewhat with the OP and numerous other OC users that were not happy with the product.

So, maybe I'm wrong... But I don't know whatever hoops I needed to jump through to make this stuff last. It just seemed like a hit or miss product. Some people had good luck with it - and some people didn't.

My GUESS is that's why they d/c it. They came up with a product (Gloss Coat) that was less finicky to whatever was the cause of the numerous "My OptiCoat isn't beading" threads.
 
swanicyouth said:
My GUESS is that's why they d/c it. They came up with a product (Gloss Coat) that was less finicky to whatever was the cause of the numerous "My OptiCoat isn't beading" threads.
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Well, that may be, but at the time it was chalked up to pro detailers losing OCP business to DIY's or non-certified installers using OC 2.0, bait and switch warranty ("I'm using Opti-Coat" but no warranty because it was actually 2.0). There was a long thread about it that got locked. FWIW it seemed Dr. G never really wanted to do a consumer version because of concerns about bad installs with high spots that had to be machine-removed.

In the end it's a moot point because as the OP says in the thread title he's not happy, but he'd have to switch to a diff product anyway since 2.0 is gone.
 
Wax and sealants spoiled everybody. You could half-a** it and the car still looked good, and if you messed up, it was no big deal to fix it. You could change every week to something else.

Coatings came along and frankly I blame the manufacturers for putting it out there that these were easy to apply. I recall the great Renny Doyle saying he had to do over 300 cars before he "got it" right. Think about that statement...let it sink in.

What none of those carpro or optimum videos showed was the meticulous prep work involved, the effect of humidity, moisture, temperature, etc that effects these coatings when applied. No, the whole story wasn't told...just buy me, buy me. Dr G was concerned about unleashing this incredible new technology on the average Joe detailers...with good reason.
 
Setec Astronomy said:
I'd try the chemical steps first, if you hit it was a polish you are definitely removing coating, maybe not all of it, but at least some and maybe all.

I guess what I'm saying is if the chemical process works, you're done, if you polish, you know you are removing at least some coating, you won't be sure if the coating is still there after, etc.
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I'm not saying to hit it with a polish, but a non-abrasive paint cleaner. I've measured before and afters of paint after paint cleaning and I got no measurable reduction, even with using the DA.

If you clean it with a paint cleaner and it's not beading or sheeting after a month, I feel like it's pretty definitively gone. I'm just saying to use that as a test to see if it's really there or not. With both being entirely reasonable possibilities.
 
ihaveacamaro said:
I'm not saying to hit it with a polish, but a non-abrasive paint cleaner. I've measured before and afters of paint after paint cleaning and I got no measurable reduction, even with using the DA.
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Yeah, but you can't measure the thickness of OC 2.0 either, at ~1 micron.
 
silverfox said:
I recall the Renny Doyle saying he had to do over 300 cars before he "got it" right. Think about that statement...let it sink in.
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hyperbole, imo. not your fault at all, i'm just saying - that's silly if i'm reading that right and it's referring to installing coating.

yes, Opti-Guard/Pro CAN be somewhat challenging at times, depending on many factors, but give me a break....300 cars, haha.
 
I am with you on this one 100% (no comment on the Renny claim :))

I said many times, that even with prepping perfectly, the application of OC will make or break durability. it isn't anything like slapping on a coat of wax.

silverfox said:
Wax and sealants spoiled everybody. You could half-a** it and the car still looked good, and if you messed up, it was no big deal to fix it. You could change every week to something else.

Coatings came along and frankly I blame the manufacturers for putting it out there that these were easy to apply. I recall the great Renny Doyle saying he had to do over 300 cars before he "got it" right. Think about that statement...let it sink in.

What none of those carpro or optimum videos showed was the meticulous prep work involved, the effect of humidity, moisture, temperature, etc that effects these coatings when applied. No, the whole story wasn't told...just buy me, buy me. Dr G was concerned about unleashing this incredible new technology on the average Joe detailers...with good reason.
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And more miss info. Out of all the coatings, OC PRO, and 2 other products are claimed to be permanent that I have seen. All others are 18-24 months. Just so you know

Calendyr said:
I agree that if you put on a coating, one of the benefits is to be able to be able to get away with less agressive cleaning. It would make no sense to use coatings if you have to use a DA twice a year to clean it.

Swanicyouth seems to have had a few bad experiences with OC. I take it that none of you guys have had the same issues?

While not a miracle product, coatings are marketed as permanent protection with enhanced chemical and physical damage resistance. So not washing the car on a regular basis should not affect them.

Sicklyscott, did you get any info regarding this from Optimum? I am really curious to know what they will tell you.
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Minimal maintenance means washing only, but that needs to be regular. Optimum says by weekly. 2.0/OC Pro is a ceramic clear coat, meaning that if it is neglected, contamination will build up eventually. There is a car out there that was coated 8 years ago. Gets a yearly decon from the pro who did the work and still beads like day one. As it was said in another post, how the prep/application was performed will greatly effect the long term outcome.

Anyone, who is "busy" can order ONR, which Optimum pushes like crazy (for very good reason) to be used. If noting else, you can wash the exterior paint in 10-20 minutes inside your garage, rain or shine. It makes a huge difference.

sicklyscott said:
Fair points. I will state however that Opti-coat was marketed and sold as a hard coating that requires minimal maintenance. I'm not the kind of guy that expects to just spritz water on it and expect it to be clean. I wash my car on a monthly basis when the weather affords it. I will not wash my car in the winter time as my outside water supply is shut off for the winter and I refuse to use a car wash. I do clay it every 6 months.

I may have applied it too thin, completely possible. I did prep it however as directed.

I am not blaming the coating, just trying to figure out how to repair / revive it. I will say however if it takes using a DA with a paint cleaner annually to keep it in good shape I might as well use a good sealant. I don't see a benefit here.

I don't want this to turn into an Opti-Coat bashing thread, there are more than enough of those out there. Just trying to figure out a way forward.
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I had a chance about a month ago to spend sometime cleaning up the fleet. As mentioned in my first post I was not happy with the how my car looked after a good wash nor how the water laid on the surface.

I spent a good day focusing on the Audi. I washed it, used a nanoskin mit, used a decon, washed again, then went over it with Poli-Seal and a Flex with green pad. All in all it bounced back nicely. The Nanoskin mit offered the best improvement. I really saw no changes with the chemical decon, the solution didn't change colors at all. After about 4 weeks I can say that the Poly-Seal seems to be on it's last legs. The sheeting action and beading is disapearing and I don't think there is much of any Opti-Coat on underneath. I will be switching back to my beloved PowerLock next time i get a chance.

Here are some pictures:

First wash:
Untitled by sicklyscott, on Flickr

"Sheetiing"
Untitled by sicklyscott, on Flickr

After Nanoskin mitt, decon and a second wash:
Untitled by sicklyscott, on Flickr

And with the rest of the fleet:
IMG_1898 by sicklyscott, on Flickr
 
Boy that last pic looks an awful lot like New Jersey but you don't have front plates on any of the cars.
 
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