2008 Ferrari F430

[Mastercraft241]

As with many of you, I began getting into detailing by working on my own vehicle. Not long after, I had friends and neighbors asking me if I could do their car. I'm an accountant by day, so I take on the cars on the weekend as a hobby. I'm very fortunate to have an AGO member, "Pureshine" aka Todd to guide me in the right direction here and there.


Last week I did a detail on a black 2013 SL550 AMG package. Another friend of mine stopped by and was pretty estatic about the detail. I had done the usual....washed, nanoskin, iron x, air dryed, blackfire finsihing polish with the Rupes 21lhr and yellow rupes pad. I got 70-90% correction out of it. I was thinking about going all the way, but the guy is stuck on using this stupid automatic car wash. Got me sad knwing all my hard work was going to get ruined within the week.

So my other friend stops by and asks if I can do his Ferrari F430, black. This car is in really bad shape and it's due to the owners negligence after use. He takes the car out every sunday and after each ride, he takes a quickwax and a dirty microfiber towel and waxes the entire car..... and the paint looks like it!

He thinks the car is in excellent shape, of course. I'm going to do the usual test spots, but i think Im going to go with a nice finishing polish as I know the guy is going to continue to hammer dirt into the car with the quick wax.

Any ideas where to start? I have the following products available. (1) Pinnacle (3) blackfire (3)wolfgang (4) Sonax Perfect Finish 4/6 (5) Fast Gloss 400 .

I have the following pads: Rupes White and yellow, Meguiars MF Cutting Pad.

Where should I start with this car? I'm going to do my usual test spots, just curious what others people experiences are.

I've read on the paint hardness spreadsheet

( https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...TGNRdTQ2RzNVcjQySE9QVnowWFE&usp=sharing#gid=0 )

it is "super soft", which makes me want to start with either sonax pf 4/6 with a white pad, or blackfire with a white pad.

 

[Jpatchley]

I too am an accountant by day, detailer (kinda) by night I don't have any advise, just saying hello to a fellow accountant!

 

[Calendyr]

I won't give you advice on the restauration, too many talented people here for me to step on their toes.

What I will suggest is that you teach you friend (the owner of the F430) to see swirls, explain to him how they got there and then how to prevent adding more. Show him how to safelly wash the car and explain the use of clean microfiber towels to him. It will take you no time if you explain as you wash the car and I think the owner will be very grateful.

 

[Mastercraft241]

I won't give you advice on the restauration, too many talented people here for me to step on their toes.

What I will suggest is that you teach you friend (the owner of the F430) to see swirls, explain to him how they got there and then how to prevent adding more. Show him how to safelly wash the car and explain the use of clean microfiber towels to him. It will take you no time if you explain as you wash the car and I think the owner will be very grateful.

I have tried and have yet to be successful at this. Im going to be very detailed in taking before and after pictures so he can truly see the condition of his paint. Additionally, I have emailed him with a link to the following products: (1) 12 pack of cobra microfibers (2) wash bucket with grit guard (3) Microfiber detergent (4) ONR No Rinse. Once finished I will show him the proper meathod to clean his car and how much quicker and better it will be with this new method.

 

[Calendyr]

Are you charging people for your services?

I can see someone not caring if it costs them nothing to have the car restored. If they pay a few hundred dollars, it should make them want to preserve it afterwards.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Fist, this is not meant as a plug but just a suggestion to help you educate your customer. If you have a copy of my how-to book, either version, show him the pictures that I took of my hand holding a 3M Post-it Note between my fingers, explain to him how thin the clear layer of paint is and how easily it is scratches, (scratch-sensitive), and that's why it's important that anything or anyone that touches the paint needs to

A: Know what they are doing.
B: Use the best products, including clean quality MF towels they can obtain.

This picture,

Also, my own personal practice and what I recommended in my classes is to

Match your services to your customer


Don't put a show car finish on a car that the owner isn't going to take care of or is going to run through any type of car wash.

The results are the paint will become all swirled out again and with some people... you'll get the blame.

Believe it or not, some people actually think that if they spend a LOT of money for a detail job that this somehow means swirls and scratches will never show up again.

In my VIF Form I also have a section where you give the customer choices, the more work the nicer the finish and also the higher the price.

There's also a section that breaks the ice for you to help offer a "Maintenance Program", that's where AFTER you've done the hard part, restoring the scratched-up mess, you then wash and wax the car on an agreed upon schedule and this is key, bill them monthly.

All the most successful detailers I know of build a list of clients that after they do the grunt work, just take care of the cars afterwards. Plus think about it... after "YOU" detail a car, won't it be fast and easy to maintain the results you already achieved.

See screenshots here...

Mike Phillips VIF or Vehicle Inspection Form


And here's were I rant and rave about matching your services to the type of person you're dealing with and keep in mind, you can't always change people.


A few tips on starting a part-time detailing business
Match your services to your customer

Any ideas where to start? I have the following products available. (1) Pinnacle (3) Blackfire (3)Wolfgang (4) Sonax Perfect Finish 4/6 (5) Fast Gloss 400 .

I have the following pads: Rupes White and yellow, Meguiars MF Cutting Pad.

Where should I start with this car? I'm going to do my usual test spots, just curious what others people experiences are.

I buffed out a 2009 F430 for Wayne Carini, actually taught his head detailer how to do this type of work. I took the Pinnacle Twins, Flex 3401, Porter Cable and Flex PE14 and I found the factory clear on this F430 to correct very easy and polish out to a crystal clear shine with just 4 products.

1. Pinnacle Advanced Swirl Remover
2. Pinnacle Advanced Finishing Polish
3. Pinnacle Souveran Paste Wax

It was Simple Simon.



Wayne Carini from Chasing Classic Cars gets a visit from Ivan Karstuff and Autogeek!

The below is coped and pasted from page 3 of the above thread...




Working on the Ferrari seen in the TV Segment...


Someone who watched the TV show asked me if we finished removing the swirls... and of course, 'yes" is the answer. One of my jobs while I was there was to train Wayne's guys with some tools, pads and products I use in my detailing boot camp class.


Ferrari F430 - Used for the Autogeek how-to segment on Chasing Classic Cars

On our how-to segment on TV you see a hood filled with swirls and a tap-line running down the middle of the hood. After we filmed the segment, the next thing was to finish the rest of the car.

I started by first removing the swirls on the other side of the tape-line and in the process showing Marius how to use the Flex 3401 Forced Rotation Dual Action Polishers. Notice I'm running the polisher right down the middle of where the tape-line was when we taped-off the hood for the TV show segment. You can see Wayne's behind me checking out the progress on another build in his shop.

Lake Country 5" Hybrid Pads on Lake Country 4" Backing Plate
I'm a big fan of the 4" Lake Country Backing Plate and the Lake Country 5" Hybrid pads and that's what we used on this Ferrari.

Marius turn...
Here's Marius who is Wayne's head painter. Marius had never seen, nor used the Flex 3401 before this day nor the Porter Cable. So for his break-in car we're using this Ferrari F430

Machine Waxing
Here's Marius machine applying wax for the first time too, after I left Marius said he would never apply a wax by hand again. For this I like to use the Porter Cable 7424XP with a Lake Country blue waxing pad and Pinnacle Souveran Paste Wax. This was also the first time Marius used a paste wax by machine.

Here's Marius inspecting our work using the Swirl Finder Light, this was also the first time he'd seen and used this handy little tool. Of course, we left the shop all these cool tools to continue working with into the future...

Marius says it looks good!

Here's Marius backing the Ferrari into position for display...

Looking right at home in front of Wayne's F40.com store...

Here's the results...
Here's the full overhead sun shot out in front of the F40.com store...

Now that's how the paint on a Ferrari is supposed to look!

 

[zmcgovern45]

I know this is not the topic of your thread, but if you are doing a full correction on a Ferrari, you need to be getting paid very well or at least have your friend sign some paperwork stating you are not at fault for anything that might occur to the vehicle while you are working on it.

Part of working on expensive cars is being able to cover the bill if something were to happen to it. Typically this is what insurance is for, but if you are simply just doing this as a hobby (as many of us are) then you most likely are uninsured for your detailing work. While I understand that this is your friend's car and I'm sure he is happy to have you working on it, his attitude may change if you end up damaging the paint or another part of the vehicle. While the chances may be slim, it is still something that you need to consider IMO. Always cover your own rear end...... especially when you're working on an exotic vehicle.

 

[Mastercraft241]

Are you charging people for your services?

I can see someone not caring if it costs them nothing to have the car restored. If they pay a few hundred dollars, it should make them want to preserve it afterwards.

He's a very good friend of mine so I'm going to be very very fair with him. I'll probably charge him $200 in and out. Some people are very thick headed when it comes to some things. I think I may have gotten to him though since he has ordered everything I requested.

Match your services to your customer


Don't put a show car finish on a car that the owner isn't going to take care of or is going to run through any type of car wash.

The results are the paint will become all swirled out again and with some people... you'll get the blame.

Believe it or not, some people actually think that if they spend a LOT of money for a detail job that this somehow means swirls and scratches will never show up again.

In my VIF Form I also have a section where you give the customer choices, the more work the nicer the finish and also the higher the price.

There's also a section that breaks the ice for you to help offer a "Maintenance Program", that's where AFTER you've done the hard part, restoring the scratched-up mess, you then wash and wax the car on an agreed upon schedule and this is key, bill them monthly.

All the most successful detailers I know of build a list of clients that after they do the grunt work, just take care of the cars afterwards. Plus think about it... after "YOU" detail a car, won't it be fast and easy to maintain the results you already achieved.

See screenshots here...

Mike Phillips VIF or Vehicle Inspection Form


And here's were I rant and rave about matching your services to the type of person you're dealing with and keep in mind, you can't always change people.


A few tips on starting a part-time detailing business
Match your services to your customer

Thanks Mike. I'm going to offer him both a show car finish and a one step finish and see what he would prefer. I have the pinnacle line but it is very very low. I may try either FG400 with a yellow uber pads followed up with PF 4/6 and white rupes or the Blackfire Combo. I believe I read a review of yours about blackfire that made me purchase it initally. Is the ferrari clear usually pretty thick? I just ordered a griots 3" polisher as I think it is absolutley essential for this detail.

 

[Mastercraft241]

I know this is not the topic of your thread, but if you are doing a full correction on a Ferrari, you need to be getting paid very well or at least have your friend sign some paperwork stating you are not at fault for anything that might occur to the vehicle while you are working on it.

Part of working on expensive cars is being able to cover the bill if something were to happen to it. Typically this is what insurance is for, but if you are simply just doing this as a hobby (as many of us are) then you most likely are uninsured for your detailing work. While I understand that this is your friend's car and I'm sure he is happy to have you working on it, his attitude may change if you end up damaging the paint or another part of the vehicle. While the chances may be slim, it is still something that you need to consider IMO. Always cover your own rear end...... especially when you're working on an exotic vehicle.

Definetly well noted and I made him aware of this. May want something in writing though....................:iagree:

 

[Calendyr]

What year is this car? My god Ferrari knows how to make beautiful cars. I am floored everytime I see one.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Thanks Mike. I'm going to offer him both a show car finish and a one step finish and see what he would prefer. I have the pinnacle line but it is very very low. I may try either FG400 with a yellow uber pads followed up with PF 4/6 and white Rupes or the Blackfire Combo. I believe I read a review of yours about Blackfire that made me purchase it initially.

To be honest, just about any combo of the product you listed will work because from my experience they all use good abrasive technology. Just do your normal test spot procedure and you'll be able to dial in a process that will work just fine.

Is the Ferrari clear usually pretty thick?

I don't think any of us can ever use the word "thick" when talking about any factory sprayed clear coats.

Car manufactures are supposed to spray at least 2 mils of clear over the basecoat because paint manufacturers "know" that is what is required to keep the entire matrix of paint from failing due to exposure to the sun and elements.

Assuming no Caveman has buffed the car out before you then I don't think you have anything to worry about as long as you use your normal good technique and use common sense.

I just ordered a Griot's 3" polisher as I think it is absolutely essential for this detail.

As long as you mark your backing plate and monitor pad rotation you can pull swirls using the 3" Griot's polisher or as I like to call it, the Peanut Polisher.

I'll tend to over use my aggressive product with the Griot's 3" to make sure the surface is lubricated with enough product to maintain good pad rotation under pressure.

You know offering a good two-step might work for you and him, just explain that doing two steps won't remove all the deeper defects but it will really do a great job overall and then seal her up.

Use the Sonax PF with a polishing pad and then go to your LSP.


What are you going to use for an LSP?

 

[Mastercraft241]

What year is this car? My god Ferrari knows how to make beautiful cars. I am floored everytime I see one.

It's a 2008. It has a tubi exhaust which makes it sound unreal.

Attached is a similar car:
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trozqLkBXWw]Ferrari F430 tubi decat - revs and brutal acceleration - YouTube[/video]

To be honest, just about any combo of the product you listed will work because from my experience they all use good abrasive technology. Just do your normal test spot procedure and you'll be able to dial in a process that will work just fine.




I don't think any of us can ever use the word "thick" when talking about any factory sprayed clear coats.

Car manufactures are supposed to spray at least 2 mils of clear over the basecoat because paint manufacturers "know" that is what is required to keep the entire matrix of paint from failing due to exposure to the sun and elements.

Assuming no Caveman has buffed the car out before you then I don't think you have anything to worry about as long as you use your normal good technique and use common sense.



As long as you mark your backing plate and monitor pad rotation you can pull swirls using the 3" Griot's polisher or as I like to call it, the Peanut Polisher.

I'll tend to over use my aggressive product with the Griot's 3" to make sure the surface is lubricated with enough product to maintain good pad rotation under pressure.

You know offering a good two-step might work for you and him, just explain that doing two steps won't remove all the deeper defects but it will really do a great job overall and then seal her up.

Use the Sonax PF with a polishing pad and then go to your LSP.


What are you going to use for an LSP?

I am VERY glad you asked this question mike. I have a fresh order of Blackfire Black Ice (8oz) coming in from AGO on Thursday:xyxthumbs:

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

I am VERY glad you asked this question mike.

I have a fresh order of Blackfire Black Ice (8oz) coming in from AGO on Thursday

I'm excited you get to work on such a cool car, if you like doing this kind of work this is a cool car to have in your Car Detailing Portfolio.


But seriously, don't throw pearls before swine, that means don't do a 3-step or more correction if the owner won't take care of it.

I'd stick to the two step as that will still make it look amazing and as long as you get some good before and after picture to showcase "yourself", then that's what will be as important or more important than the financial gain if you use it to leverage your business.

If you don't know how to already, learn how to take good before and after pictures and learn how to work with pictures on forums.

The power in the after shots is created in the before shots

Tips for using a discussion forum to reach more customers...


How to create dedicated albums in your photo gallery...

If you're going to be a "Forum Person" on ANY forum, help yourself by learning how to work with picture on the Internet

How to resize your photos before uploading to a photo gallery - Using Easy Thumbnails

How to upload a photo into your Autogeek Photo Gallery

How to insert an image from your photo gallery into your message

How-To capture swirls, scratches, etchings and other surface defects with your camera



Here's my review of Blackfire BlackICE including how to machine apply it. For the 8 ounce jar you'll need to scoop some out and apply to foam pad using the blade of the PC wrench or something else.


Review: BLACKFIRE BlackICE Hybrid Montan Sealant Wax



:xyxthumbs: