8 hours of polishing and...

[sportscarhiatus]

When I first saw the DISO on my new Black truck, I freaked; gotta get this fixed. I already had a PC, older version, so I got some WGSR/FG on the combo special. Since my truck was new, I was afraid to use an orange pad to start. I ordered 5.5" green and white pads. Turned the radio on and went at it. I started with the roof so if I buggered something, only I would know it. After 2 hours, the roof still did not have all the swirls removed. I went on to the hood and couldn't get it to look right either. I decided I was using the wrong stuff and have since spent about $1000 on "stuff". I've got Meg's 105/205, had some Menzerna polish & glaze, got some PB's glaze, pads, pads, pads. The 105/205 combo seems to work best with the PBBH glaze. I came to the following conclusions:

1. I was using way too much WGSR.
2. I was not working it long enough, pretty much out of fear of ruining the clear coat.
3. I did not stick with a test spot (roof) before moving on. My impatience.
4. I was new at this and contrary to my opinion, I did not "know it all".
5. And last but not least, Black is Black and it is going to show everything!!!!

All this learning came from reading this and other forums and spending hours reading/watching Mike Phillips how-to articles and videos.

Hang in there, you'll get-r-done.

These two statements above are key!!! When you use too much "liquid", I feel like there is too much lubrication, and I can't get the the liquid to properly break down... the pad seems to "glide" on the paint instead of properly getting worked in. And of course, even with the proper amount of liquid used, you have to work the sections thoroughly...allow it to break down, then remove. Don't rush.

 

[Bunky]

I

1. I was using way too much WGSR.
2. I was not working it long enough, pretty much out of fear of ruining the clear coat.
3. I did not stick with a test spot (roof) before moving on. My impatience.
4. I was new at this and contrary to my opinion, I did not "know it all".
5. And last but not least, Black is Black and it is going to show everything!!!!

Been there, done that. What I always wondered if is just how good you can get it. I was usually getting the correction (I accepted less than getting out every single swirl) but had trouble judging if I had the best gloss possible. Unless you have really good light and experience you really cannot adapt quickly to decide when your test spot is perfect (ok, that did not work, what next) and then saying you have done all you can do. In the test spot, usually anything looks better.

 

[jernal024]

These two statements above are key!!! When you use too much "liquid", I feel like there is too much lubrication, and I can't get the the liquid to properly break down... the pad seems to "glide" on the paint instead of properly getting worked in. And of course, even with the proper amount of liquid used, you have to work the sections thoroughly...allow it to break down, then remove. Don't rush.

As far as liquid is concerned, I am doing what mike phillips does in his video. I am applying an X pattern on the pad and trying not to over do it.

I am applying a good deal of pressure and taking it slow. Slower than Mike does in the video. I do 6 section passes with TSR and I am getting good compression on the pad.

The problem was, my test spot turned out perfect with the orange pad. But anywhere where there was a bit more scratches (not deep), I could not seem to get them and some of the swirls out... Until I used the yellow pad.

If you think I am using too much liquid please tell me, but I think the product is not agressive enough for my paint. I have used over 1/2 a 16 oz. bottle of TSR thus far.

Feed back please

 

[tcollins33]

I have found that of anything I've used, Menzerna Power Finish with an orange LC CCS pad will get swirls out of my Jetta's paint. Follow it with Micro Polish and you're golden. VW clear swirls very easily, yet it's very difficult to get them out. The Menz combo has been my best solution to date.

 

[Pie]

I only use about 1/4 a bottle of TSR and FG for my entire car (2010 Toyota Corolla).

I think applying an X pattern is good for a fresh pad. After that you should use a lot less. I would do an X for a new pad and then 3-4 dots on it after. You use a lot less product this way.

 

[jernal024]

I have found that of anything I've used, Menzerna Power Finish with an orange LC CCS pad will get swirls out of my Jetta's paint. Follow it with Micro Polish and you're golden. VW clear swirls very easily, yet it's very difficult to get them out. The Menz combo has been my best solution to date.

Sweet! Is it just my perception or poor technique or does the jetta have hard clearcoat?

 

[jernal024]

I only use about 1/4 a bottle of TSR and FG for my entire car (2010 Toyota Corolla).

I think applying an X pattern is good for a fresh pad. After that you should use a lot less. I would do an X for a new pad and then 3-4 dots on it after. You use a lot less product this way.

EXCELLENT! I am definitley going to follow that advice

I am also using a spray of pad conditioner, should I take that into consideration and start with the 4 dots?

 

[sportscarhiatus]

I have found that of anything I've used, Menzerna Power Finish with an orange LC CCS pad will get swirls out of my Jetta's paint. Follow it with Micro Polish and you're golden. VW clear swirls very easily, yet it's very difficult to get them out. The Menz combo has been my best solution to date.

This approach works likewise for me as well... which is exactly why I'm confused with his situation. For me, using an orange pad and either TSR or Menz IP or SIP, followed by either FG or P085RD always removes at least 95% of my swirls/scratches. Obviously, I have some REALLY deep ones, but maybe 2 or 3 in the entire car. Those I will leave alone... it's not worth it for me to use a yellow pad and remove significant amounts of paint for really deep scratches.

With that, I can't imagine that the OP's car paint is FULL of REALLY deep scratches that he has to use a yellow pad... something ain't adding up.

I only use about 1/4 a bottle of TSR and FG for my entire car (2010 Toyota Corolla).

This is also what worked for me... probably 1/4 bottle for me, AND I have the 8oz'er.

I think applying an X pattern is good for a fresh pad. After that you should use a lot less. I would do an X for a new pad and then 3-4 dots on it after. You use a lot less product this way.

This is ANOTHER good point. I end up using less and less product on my pads as the pads get more saturated. After about 1/2 the car, I usually switch pads to a fresh pads. I could clean on the fly, but I just set it aside and use a fresh one and clean it once I'm done. So technically, I get done with a whole car in about 8 hours or less. (This includes drinking a beer or two and listening to tunes! )

EXCELLENT! I am definitley going to follow that advice

I am also using a spray of pad conditioner, should I take that into consideration and start with the 4 dots?

I too also use a squirt or two of the XMT's pad conditioner (blue stuff) before each panel I do. Again, you can tell by feel if the pad is saturated enough. I use about 4 dots or so once the pad is saturated.

I still am baffled you need to use a yellow pad... I can't imagine your car is full of really deep scratches... maybe I'm wrong.

 

[jernal024]

This is also what worked for me... probably 1/4 bottle for me, AND I have the 8oz'er.



This is ANOTHER good point. I end up using less and less product on my pads as the pads get more saturated. After about 1/2 the car, I usually switch pads to a fresh pads. I could clean on the fly, but I just set it aside and use a fresh one and clean it once I'm done. So technically, I get done with a whole car in about 8 hours or less. (This includes drinking a beer or two and listening to tunes! )

I am talking about 1/2 a bottle of 16oz.!

This is my process:
1) New pad, one spray of XMT conditioner, x pattern across the pad, 6 slow passes with good pressure... Still only 80-85% of scratches and swirls

2) Next section, x pattern, 6 slow passes with good pressure... same

3) OTF pad cleaning

Repeat 1, 2, and 3 over again. Redoing sections that need it.

Am I doing On the Fly cleanings too frequently? How many sections do you do before you do OTF cleaning?

Any other ideas besides hard clear coat?

 

[5.4 Shelby]

I dont think there is such a thing as cleaning too frequently.

Did you mark the backing plate with a marker? This will help you just the rotation of the pad. Maybe you are pressing too much and stopping the pad. The pad needs rotation to get the best correction.

I have never used TSR, so I don't know how aggressive it is. Try some Ultimate Compound on an orange and see if it still is not performing as it should.

 

[sportscarhiatus]

Am I doing On the Fly cleanings too frequently? How many sections do you do before you do OTF cleaning?

Any other ideas besides hard clear coat?

I haven't really done otf pad cleanings as I stated... I usually just switch pads after about 1/2 the car (not including roof).

As far as ideas other than hard clear coat? hmmmm perhaps just the fact that your RIDS are REALLY deep... and you're trying so hard to get those RIDS out, that it will involve a LOT of paint removal (which I wouldn't recommend). Hmmm let's see, other than that, either too much product...

I think you need to post some pics of this alleged panel that has only 80-85% of swirls removed, as you claim.

 

[jernal024]

I haven't really done otf pad cleanings as I stated... I usually just switch pads after about 1/2 the car (not including roof).

As far as ideas other than hard clear coat? hmmmm perhaps just the fact that your RIDS are REALLY deep... and you're trying so hard to get those RIDS out, that it will involve a LOT of paint removal (which I wouldn't recommend). Hmmm let's see, other than that, either too much product...

I think you need to post some pics of this alleged panel that has only 80-85% of swirls removed, as you claim.

I have to be honest, I feel like the technique is not the problem. The yellow pad worked really well for me.

My car is a black, 5 year old, daily driver. Some of the RIDS are deep and will probably never come out.

The car does have alot of surface area, so that could also explain the length of polishing, but doing panels over didn't help.

I honestly think for this paint, the yellow pad is king! Or a more agressive product.

I finally got through all the TSR step last night after probably 16 hours. I did get to the FG step on many of the panels and it does finish a lot better. FG really makes a difference. I would say, that without a good cutting step, the scratches/swirls would still be there after FG, so I am glad I took the extra time.

I will finish the vehicle tonight (Hopefully) and post some pics.

Note to self... 105 and some more yellow pads!

Thanks for all the advice rops:

 

[jernal024]

I dont think there is such a thing as cleaning too frequently.

How often do YOU do OTF cleanings?

Did you mark the backing plate with a marker? This will help you just the rotation of the pad. Maybe you are pressing too much and stopping the pad. The pad needs rotation to get the best correction.

I definitely did that. I would say the pad rotates one to two times per second. Too slow?

I have never used TSR, so I don't know how aggressive it is. Try some Ultimate Compound on an orange and see if it still is not performing as it should.

Is there a big difference between Ultimate Compound and 105?

 

[5.4 Shelby]

How often do YOU do OTF cleanings?



I definitely did that. I would say the pad rotates one to two times per second. Too slow?



Is there a big difference between Ultimate Compound and 105?

I dont care for OTF cleaning. Prob my inability to do it correctly. I ended up buying a GG pad washer and love it.

When I was OTF cleaning I found it better to just change pads frequently. I prob changed pads every panel. Maybe too often, but, I was having trouble with the middle of CCS pads dimpling in the middle. I thought it was my technique. As it turns out it was prob some of the bad pads. Because of that experience, I like a clean pad and clean frequently.

1-2 per second is the max I would push.

105 and UC are very close. UC is prob a little more workable and 105 is a little more aggressive IME. Trying it will give you a good idea if 105 would make the difference or if it your technique.

Keep trying. You will get the hang of it. I have been polishing for 7 or 8 years. I still feel like I learn something new everytime I polish a car or try a new product or pad.

 

[jernal024]

When I was OTF cleaning I found it better to just change pads frequently. I prob changed pads every panel.

1-2 per second is the max I would push.

Did you mean 1-2 per section?

105 and UC are very close. UC is prob a little more workable and 105 is a little more aggressive IME. Trying it will give you a good idea if 105 would make the difference or if it your technique.

Do you know if I can follow up 105 or UC with Wolfgang Finishing Glaze? I have a bunch of that product left. and I would hate to have to buy something new to finish with.

Thanks

 

[5.4 Shelby]

Did you mean 1-2 per section?

I meant 1-2 rotations per second. Iwas referring to your question about pad rotation at 1-2 rotations per second. Sorry I was not clear on that. Too lazy to individualize your quotes.

Do you know if I can follow up 105 or UC with Wolfgang Finishing Glaze? I have a bunch of that product left. and I would hate to have to buy something new to finish with.

Thanks

You could assuming you are talking about FG 3.0. I have never used WG FG, but, reading the description says it has Menzerna Nano Polish in it. I have not used it either, but, it is highly regarded as finishing polish. It should have enough cut to clean up marring and leave a nice high gloss finish.

I would certainly try it before buying something else.

Let us know how it turns out.

 

[sportscarhiatus]

and post PICS please. all this time helping you out, we deserve pics!!!

 

[jernal024]

and post PICS please. all this time helping you out, we deserve pics!!!

Will Do! I stayed up until 3am on Tuesday trying to finish (didn't). Yesterday I had a retirement party to go to after work and I had a few glasses of wine. So when I got home at 9:30 I didn't want anything to do with polishing.

I will take some shots as soon as I get home tonight. I will show what I started with. Some of the good areas and some of the polished, but still ugly areas.

Stay posted. It will probably be late when I get around to posting.

Thanks for all the help!!!

 

[jernal024]

By the way, I am easily into 20 hours of paint correction. I hope that sealant provides good protection!

 

[A4 1.8tqm]

Yesterday I had a retirement party to go to after work and I had a few glasses of wine. So when I got home at 9:30 I didn't want anything to do with polishing.

I will take some shots as soon as I get home tonight. I will show what I started with. Some of the good areas and some of the polished, but still ugly areas.

Stay posted. It will probably be late when I get around to posting.

Thanks for all the help!!!

So what makes you think you'll want to polish after taking some shots, if you didn't want to polish after a few glasses of wine? J/K :laughing:

Looking forward to some pics. :xyxthumbs: