Are we making things worse by using multiple products for topping up?

RPPM

RPPM

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So to set the stage for my question, November 2018, I detailed both my cars with the new Collinite cleaner wax (325), followed by two coats of 476 24 hours apart. Over the next 6 months, the following products with some kind of sealant were used as toppers after washes. Almost every time, or every other time, a topper was used after either a traditional wash or a RW.
Meguiars D156
Meguiars Ultimate Fast Fininsh
Beadmaker
Sonax Brilliant Shine Detailer
Duragloss 931 mixed at WW strength
Meguiars D115
Collinite 520-their new QD.

The cars seemed to look ok, water behavior seemed to be some what holding on.

Fast forward to last weekend. One car was decontaminated, polished with HD Polish+, wiped down with 914 at WW dilution and one layer of Sonax Polymer Net Shield was put on the car. I washed that car yesterday with a traditional 2 bucket wash, wow, what a breeze to wash, water just ran off the car. What little left to dry was so easy. I did not apply any topper, as my plan is to use Brilliant Shine Detailer just once a month. I then washed the other car as I intend to give it the same treatment today the other car received last week. What a huge difference. Water was beading, but not really moving. The paint is not perfect, but not all swirled up by any means, but this is a heavily used DD. Compared to the other freshly detailed paint, this car's paint looked saturated. Not the fresh, clean look of the other car's paint.

It got me thinking, does using multiple toppers from different manufacturers make the paint worse? Is all that mixing over time causing our paint to be clogged? What if you only use one topper over the same time period? I am curious as to everyone else's thoughts on this. I plan on using just BSD between now and my fall detail. I wonder if I will notice a difference?
 
I did the same as you all winter, over Collinite 915. I don’t think using all sorts of different toppers is great for the paint and behavior, but I have seen some random, really-good-shine days based on doing this. It’s not a shine I can ever replicate because it’s after so many toppings over different periods of time.

Water behavior seems to always get better, then worse, then better, etc when I do this.

In summary, I don’t think obsessive topping with different items lends itself to any consistency... but for some who can’t stop touching, the results can be interesting some days nonetheless.
 
We have 4 family cars and 2 extended family cars. Luckily i stick to one topper per vehicle,period. And they all have different sealant n topper combo



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Me personally? Keep it simple silly (KISS)…. Wash, decon, protect. My cars are polished, Erasure wipe-down, CQUK 3.0 applied, stick a fork in it. For others, AIO, then sealant, stick a fork in it.

I don't see or understand the concept of topping... If you are using a sealant, I can see using a QD (Polymer / Carinuba) mix QD as a wipedown after maybe every other maintenance wash.

For my CQ vehicles, every six months they get Reload after a wash..... KISS... :)
 
This is the reason I don't go topper crazy on my personal coated cars. Takes away from the performance of the coating if topped to often.

Ech20 at 1:20 seems to be the best thing as it does not last that long and does not hinder the performance of the base layer coating.

LSNAutoDetailing said:
Me personally? Keep it simple silly (KISS)…. Wash, decon, protect. My cars are polished, Erasure wipe-down, CQUK 3.0 applied, stick a fork in it. For others, AIO, then sealant, stick a fork in it.

I don't see or understand the concept of topping... If you are using a sealant, I can see using a QD (Polymer / Carinuba) mix QD as a wipedown after maybe every other maintenance wash.

For my CQ vehicles, every six months they get Reload after a wash..... KISS... :)
Click to expand...

Try adding Ech20 at 1:20 into your wash regiment as a drying aid. It is not really a topper for the above mentioned reasons. Plus Ech20's characteristics is to add gloss and slickness as a versatile waterless wash, which is great over CQUK 3.0. Also Elixir is better than Reload in my experience.
 
Sometimes I think that the paint has reached what it can handle. Even with something like BSD after every wash if you do it weekly. And with many different kind of products you can get some that don't work so good together. So sometimes I think that's a good way to go back a step and only use one product and depending on the strength of it weekly or monthly or every other month.

This winter I have been slacking with the maintance. But useally when I wash regualary I use Carpro Reset car soap which leaves nothing behind. And I don't use a drying aid either. When I feel like the water behavior degrades I use the topper or the base protection that I have on the car. I apply this dry after the wash if it's not a spray on rinse off coating product. So many times I think it's that you apply it too often that can be messy. Many of the products out there are long lasting LSP that are used as toppers or drying aid. Even if it's not building up to much when applyied often it's needed to go somewhere when you apply it. That can lead to a product starts to streaks on you that have not done it before. Or another product you also can get trouble with when starting to use that. But on a bare paint you would not be haveing any problems with the application with it.

As long as you don't have any problems with the looks and behavior from the products you apply regualary it's a non problem. But if you getting problems with it then you would be going back to do more simple. You see from time to time when people haveing problems with a sealant or coating. When you found out that the sealant or coating is hidden behind the topper or toppers. Then it's often no problem with the sealant or coating. Also I think for the coatings at least that they could be better of when you not topping it. But let it do it's thing until you see the actually coating being degraded in the behavior. And first then top it to extend the behavior from it. Rather than letting the topper being what the behavior that has. You could be better of to just use the topper as a stand alone LSP instead.

Just some thoughts about it. And an interesting discussion.
 
I think most of these sprays do little if anything. They give you good feels applying them because they are slick / shiny and have silicone or whatever in them. For the most part that’s about it.

There are exceptions - but they are few and far between.
 
•IMO:
-It may depend on whose point
of view you’re talking about.

-I bet that the manufacturers (and most
vendors) of the products used for “topping”
don’t mind it one bit; and, if fact be known:
they encourage the practice thereof.


•Me? AFAIC:
-They can keep their “toppers”;
I don’t want any part of them!


Bob
 
Bob,

I think you are spot on. I remember when I first found Collinite 476. I didn't use any toppers back then, and it seemed to handle water better for longer periods of time. The topper changed the characteristics of the 476. I don't think these products just sit on top. I think they blend in, creating a who knows what.
 
LSNAutoDetailing said:
Me personally? Keep it simple silly (KISS)…. Wash, decon, protect. My cars are polished, Erasure wipe-down, CQUK 3.0 applied, stick a fork in it. For others, AIO, then sealant, stick a fork in it.

I don't see or understand the concept of topping... If you are using a sealant, I can see using a QD (Polymer / Carinuba) mix QD as a wipedown after maybe every other maintenance wash.

For my CQ vehicles, every six months they get Reload after a wash..... KISS... :)
Click to expand...

The Guz said:
This is the reason I don't go topper crazy on my personal coated cars. Takes away from the performance of the coating if topped to often.

Ech20 at 1:20 seems to be the best thing as it does not last that long and does not hinder the performance of the base layer coating.



Try adding Ech20 at 1:20 into your wash regiment as a drying aid. It is not really a topper for the above mentioned reasons. Plus Ech20's characteristics is to add gloss and slickness as a versatile waterless wash, which is great over CQUK 3.0. Also Elixir is better than Reload in my experience.
Click to expand...

Same for me. I don't want to top my coating and then experience inferior performance. I'd prefer a coating that doesn't last as long than me having to top it like crazy and know the coating is there but not giving me its benefits because I keep putting stuff on it.
 
I just use toppers that have the characteristics I like as a stand alone. Freshly apply cosmic or kamikaze performs better than any sealant I’ve ever used. Those and Ech20 will be only things my coated car sees


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
RPPM said:
I don't think these products just sit on top. I think they blend in, creating a who knows what.
Click to expand...

About 6 weeks ago I came to this conclusion myself. Decided to give BeadMaker a try, super slick and glossy, applied on top of my BSD treated Lexus. So hit the Sequoia with BF One Step and topped with BM... not really slick at all. Stopped halfway thru and sprayed Megs Ultimate Quik Wax over rest of the Sequoia... much, much better slickness and gloss. I could go on some more, but let's just say that products do seem to interact with each other and can sometimes produce less-than-desired results.

It's been 8 months since the Lexus has seen my GG6, so in the not too distant future, I plan on doing a little decon, BF AIO, IPA wash, then PNS... and every other wash I'll throw on some BSD, like I've been doing before trying the BM.

Combining different products seems to really affect the performance of the stuff we use, but I will say that PNS and BSD do seem to work really well together, or maybe all I'm seeing (and loving) is the performance of the BSD.
 
Thought this way for ways about all the bad chemists out there.....a little is good. More is not better.
 
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