Beginning scratches from rinse less wash...

[Bobby B.]

I have never seen any scratches on my vehicles from doing rinseless washes - and this includes doing them in the winter with salt and dirt grime on the vehicle.

I'll tell you my method, and it works well for me.

1. In the winter only, I go to the coin op and pressure wash the bulky stuff off. I do this in the warm weather only when the car is absolutely filthy (rare).
2. I spray the entire car with the waterless or QD dilution of some waterless or rinseless wash (BFWW, UWW+, N914 or WGURW). Whatever I have ready and in reach.
3. I use WGURW or N914 as my rinseless wash.
4. Using multiple 1100GSM towels, I soak them all and fold them into quarters.
5. I use the towels on the car while they are mildly soaked - I wring them out a bit, but they still drip.
6. Top to bottom. Horizontal surfaces first.
7. One quarter of a towel gets a single wipe - no more. Next wipe gets a fresh quarter towel.
8. Dry with waffle weave towels while using a drying aid like Kenotek or ECH2O.

Towels get soaked in water and then washed.

Some use a single sponge, and I think that's fine. It's just not my preference. You can use a single sponge or mitt, but you have to make sure it is thoroughly cleaned using a grit guard or something like that.

I have abandoned the notion that rinseless washes are somehow conservative and by necessity eco-friendly. They can be. But, in my mind, a rinseless wash is simply a wash that doesn't need to be rinsed off. But that doesn't mean I don't use a lot of solution and frequently rotate towels.

(Sent via my mobile device...)

This is perfect! That's the same way I like to do my Rinseless Washes.

 

[Tempest45]

BRS is softer on paint than microfiber. Been using it for a year on Mazda and Toyota paint without issue.

Anything can pickup debris. Always need to check. Best to just leave the sponge in the ONR all the time.

Check drying towels for debris as well.

 

[Tempest45]

I've been doing GDWM for a couple of years with no issues.

Recently tried the Big Red Sponge method with Grit Guard. Yes, it was getting the car clean...but.... When I went to dry the car per my usual waffle weave method, I noticed DIRT on my drying towels! Luckily, this was being tested on my R&D daily driver.

It's normal for drying towels to have dirt on them with the BRS. The ONR continues to work on the surface and encapsulate dirt.

 

[fightnews]

Using ONR with the blue sponge I got from autogeek.

Tom

Are you sure its not just left over product that looks like scratches or maybe you have a coating and the coating is scratched. Unless you have really really soft paint or You never rinse the sponge the whole time it shouldn't scratch the paint that easy.

 

[fightnews]

I have never seen any scratches on my vehicles from doing rinseless washes - and this includes doing them in the winter with salt and dirt grime on the vehicle.

I'll tell you my method, and it works well for me.

1. In the winter only, I go to the coin op and pressure wash the bulky stuff off. I do this in the warm weather only when the car is absolutely filthy (rare).
2. I spray the entire car with the waterless or QD dilution of some waterless or rinseless wash (BFWW, UWW+, N914 or WGURW). Whatever I have ready and in reach.
3. I use WGURW or N914 as my rinseless wash.
4. Using multiple 1100GSM towels, I soak them all and fold them into quarters.
5. I use the towels on the car while they are mildly soaked - I wring them out a bit, but they still drip.
6. Top to bottom. Horizontal surfaces first.
7. One quarter of a towel gets a single wipe - no more. Next wipe gets a fresh quarter towel.
8. Dry with waffle weave towels while using a drying aid like Kenotek or ECH2O.

Towels get soaked in water and then washed.

Some use a single sponge, and I think that's fine. It's just not my preference. You can use a single sponge or mitt, but you have to make sure it is thoroughly cleaned using a grit guard or something like that.

I have abandoned the notion that rinseless washes are somehow conservative and by necessity eco-friendly. They can be. But, in my mind, a rinseless wash is simply a wash that doesn't need to be rinsed off. But that doesn't mean I don't use a lot of solution and frequently rotate towels.

(Sent via my mobile device...)

You must be doing these washes inside? If you are spraying the whole car up front. How can you stop one side of the car from drying out from the sun while you are working on the other?

What do you use those avalanche towels?

 

[Ernie Mccracken]

How bad? Isn't minor damage to be expected when rinseless washing? The lubricants in the solution help, but there are limitations of physics. Any way you slice it, you are scratching the paint whenever you touch it with wash media or a towel.

 

[WillSports3]

I would suggest a heavier pre-soak to avoid some of those scratches. And I know they suggest for you to wring the sponge out until it's barely dripping but I like to leave more liquid in the sponge. I actually use the LC Blue Sponge that's exactly like the BRS and I haven't had a problem with that. That being said there's always risks I think, and it depends on what exact kind of dirt was on your car. And yes it is normal for your drying towel to catch some dirt when you use the sponge and ONR. To avoid that, I run the sponge across the panel a few times.

 

[Crispy]

I think the problem, if any, is not the application of the ONR.

It is the drying stage.

ONR once on paint (I use the sponge) it moves the dirt off the surface and into the solution.

Some is picked up by the trailing edge of the sponge.

The rest is absorbed by the drying towel.

I personally get alot of dirt in my drying towel (I wash after each wash).

I learned here to wipe one way on each panel and tilt the cloth a little on each pass.

Never had any straight scratches that I noticed (even in winter with heavy salt on the car DD).

 

[WillSports3]

That's why I think with the sponge, you need to saturate it enough with pre spray and then run the sponge over the surface a few times, making sure the sponge is wet.

 

[evo77]

You must be doing these washes inside? If you are spraying the whole car up front. How can you stop one side of the car from drying out from the sun while you are working on the other?

Was thinking the same thing.

 

[Legumes]

I personally get alot of dirt in my drying towel (I wash after each wash).

.

I have never noticed dirt in my drying towels during rinseless washes. I heavily pre-soak panels and use multiple microfiber towels that are still sopping wet. I give my towels only a very light squeeze when removing them from the bucket as I feel the extra solution can only help. I tend to wash weekly or bi-weekly, so I'm not dealing with a lot of dirt in the first place...

 

[idriveblackcars]

Last night I washed a filthy BMW X3 with just 2 big red sponges and no other wash media. I did pre soak the panels before hand.

They did an amazing job, the car was so dirty there was at least 7 major bird bombs on the car. Dusty, dirty, pollen everywhere. The bottom had a layer of filth.

In the end there was only a small trace of dirt on the drying towel I was using. I mean very small and it was only from drying the lower portion.

I still won't use the sponge on a daily basis on my own car but very impressed! And like I said little to no dirt trace on the drying towel.

The sponges on the other hand are as black as could be lol

Wish I had a pick of the car before hand, but here are the sponges(after I cleaned them)

And the only dirt remaining from an EXTREMELY dirty BMW

 

[fightnews]

Last night I washed a filthy BMW X3 with just 2 big red sponges and no other wash media. I did pre soak the panels before hand.

They did an amazing job, the car was so dirty there was at least 7 major bird bombs on the car. Dusty, dirty, pollen everywhere. The bottom had a layer of filth.

In the end there was only a small trace of dirt on the drying towel I was using. I mean very small and it was only from drying the lower portion.

I still won't use the sponge on a daily basis on my own car but very impressed! And like I said little to no dirt trace on the drying towel.

The sponges on the other hand are as black as could be lol

Wish I had a pick of the car before hand, but here are the sponges(after I cleaned them)

And the only dirt remaining from an EXTREMELY dirty BMW

did you do a 2 bucket method with the rinseless or how did that work?

 

[idriveblackcars]

did you do a 2 bucket method with the rinseless or how did that work?

Just one bucket with a grit guard at the bottom.

 

[fightnews]

That's why I think with the sponge, you need to saturate it enough with pre spray and then run the sponge over the surface a few times, making sure the sponge is wet.

What do you do as far as buckets and grit guards when you use the sponge?

 

[fightnews]

Just one bucket with a grit guard at the bottom.

OH OK I was thinking of doing it that way except i'll rinse the mitt or whatever off with the hose before putting it in the bucket. I have a hose with a trigger sprayer in the yard anyway. I will be ready to go.

 

[idriveblackcars]

OH OK I was thinking of doing it that way except i'll rinse the mitt or whatever off with the hose before putting it in the bucket. I have a hose with a trigger sprayer in the yard anyway. I will be ready to go.

That will work just fine! No need for a second bucket, just rinse with the hose and squeeze out before re entering the ONR bucket(which I would still use a gg with).

 

[RippyD]

Great discussion. I typically use modified GD method. I like to hose or pressure wash off first and I pre-apply rinseless product. If very dirty, I'll hose, apply product, then pressure wash off most of the dirt.

I'm still a newbie here, with that caveat here's my opinion on likely causes of your scratches:

1. Most likely is doing too large an area before cleaning the sponge. This is dependent on how much dirt there is. Are you doing 1 horizontal foot or 10 before rinsing? If the car is dirty you've essentially turned the sponge into sandpaper after a couple of feet, maybe less. I sometimes test first with light colored MF very low on a panel before using a sponge so I know how much dirt is being picked up.

2. Are you getting any dirt on your drying towels? If so, that's almost certainly one cause. My scratches/swirls have gone to nearly 0 since I started washing until I see o dirt coming off. This means I'm usually doing the same panel twice. Rarely 3 times. I don't dry between washes, so it's very little extra effort. It does mean a few more towels to wash. Well worth the extra 5-10 mins for me to not scratch the paint when drying.


3. Any chance your wash media is not clean enough? With a sponge I generally only use my 5 gallon bucket down to 2.5 gallons and then toss it. Rinseless wash is cheap enough that I don't need to use dirty water. I'll dump it out sooner if it looks dirty. This is even with a grit guard.

4. Less likely, but be sure your soap is at the correct ratio. I tend to go with a higher ration when the car is dirtier. Sometimes I'll use two mixes - higher ratio for first pass, then regular waterless ratio for 2nd pass.

I'm finding it difficult to get a GSM count on some towels. Not all towels have the number in the info. I know the eagle edgeless ones are only 480. The buff and shine ones are 600GSM. These are my main towels.

But I do find it hard to find 600GSM towels which are a perfect thickness imo.

Keep looking. My favorite waterless wash towels by a mile are 800 GSM and white. I don't really need 800 GSM, but they hold so much wash media I feel better about using them. Significantly more wet than any other 4-600 GSM towel I've tried. The downside is that in my garage it makes a bit of a mess on the floor. Well worth it to get a wetter waterless wash. I have a grey car and it's almost impossible to tell how much dirt is one it before I start to wash it. One short test with a white towel and it's very clear.