Best beading product?

SYMAWD said:
He's trying to say that sheeting really means water sticking to the paint in big sheets, thus making it hydrophillic. However, in terms of detailing we use sheeting in terms of water falling off of the paint in big sheets.
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Quite. The detailing crowd have really got the terminology confused - beading meaning hydrophobic and sheeting meaning... errrrr... hydrophobic. The worst of it is that many think that the 'sheeting' they are describing is hydrophillic. The problem comes in the 'sheet' definition. A drop of water on a hydrophobic surface forms a 'bead' - all good there. The same droplet on a hydrophilic surface forms a flat sheet (it spreads out flat) - but this isn't what detailers mean by a sheet. In detailing, a sheet is simply a collection of water droplets on a hydrophobic surface but a surface which is not hydrophobic enough to break that sheet up into droplets. In detailing, a bead and a sheet are manifestations of exactly the same surface chemistry.

It has got to the point that some now use the technical, hydrophilic, term to describe the detailers sheet - which is quite the opposite of fact. Worst of all, some of the brands, in a wonderful demonstration of their utter lack of technical expertise, are guilty of this!
 
PiPUK said:
Quite. The detailing crowd have really got the terminology confused - beading meaning hydrophobic and sheeting meaning... errrrr... hydrophobic. The worst of it is that many think that the 'sheeting' they are describing is hydrophillic. The problem comes in the 'sheet' definition. A drop of water on a hydrophobic surface forms a 'bead' - all good there. The same droplet on a hydrophilic surface forms a flat sheet (it spreads out flat) - but this isn't what detailers mean by a sheet. In detailing, a sheet is simply a collection of water droplets on a hydrophobic surface but a surface which is not hydrophobic enough to break that sheet up into droplets. In detailing, a bead and a sheet are manifestations of exactly the same surface chemistry.



It has got to the point that some now use the technical, hydrophilic, term to describe the detailers sheet - which is quite the opposite of fact. Worst of all, some of the brands, in a wonderful demonstration of their utter lack of technical expertise, are guilty of this!
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In my previous post I was trying to simply state that a very hydrophobic surface is more important because it's going to bead up nice and tall and water will runoff very easily. Hence my comparison.
 
KillaCam said:
In my previous post I was trying to simply state that a very hydrophobic surface is more important because it's going to bead up nice and tall and water will runoff very easily. Hence my comparison.
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Believe it or not, contact angle (what makes beads look impressive) and sliding angle (what makes them run off) are quite distinct and not necessarily linked. In fact, many high contact angle surfaces require quite high sliding angles to clear them. In automotive, contact angle is for show, sliding angle is what is actually best.
 
PiPUK said:
Believe it or not, contact angle (what makes beads look impressive) and sliding angle (what makes them run off) are quite distinct and not necessarily linked. In fact, many high contact angle surfaces require quite high sliding angles to clear them. In automotive, contact angle is for show, sliding angle is what is actually best.
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So is contact angle what makes the beads tall and round, while sliding angle is how easily the water rolls off the surface?
Totally taking a guess here.
 
KillaCam said:
So is contact angle what makes the beads tall and round, while sliding angle is how easily the water rolls off the surface?
Totally taking a guess here.
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Yes. As above, it is often the case that a surface with the highest contact angle won't have the lowest sliding angle. So you can have fantastic beads but they won't clear off the surface as readily as with some less spectacular beading finishes.
 
I read some research that beading is bad for your car. The theory is that the water bead has particulates floating inside. When the water beads start drying, the particulates are drawn into the finish, promoting pitting...

If the water can sheet off the car, the water takes the particulates with it and the finish is better preserved.

So while beading looks nice, I think I would prefer to have a sheeting product instead.

Now, I don't remember the source and it was many years ago but it made sense.
 
Beading might look "cool", but sheeting is a more important characteristic.
 
While all this theoretical anti- beading talk does make sense, IME, it doesn't pan out in real life.

Keep your paint waxed or sealed with something, apply and wash frequently - and it's all good.
 
PiPUK said:
Yes. As above, it is often the case that a surface with the highest contact angle won't have the lowest sliding angle. So you can have fantastic beads but they won't clear off the surface as readily as with some less spectacular beading finishes.
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I think I learn something new everyday from you, thanks!
Sonax polymer net shield must have a high contact angle and sliding angle because it beads very tall and round while blowing off the car very easily as well.
 
Sonax PNS & BSD seam to be ahead of the game right now.
 
Beading wise my top 4 are duragloss 111, sonax BSD, sonax PNS and Geyon Cure
 
It's nice to see the rain bead up on my car but as soon as the instant gratification wears off, I'm out there with my electric leaf blower getting that water off my car. No acidic rain for me man.
I love 845, Prima Epic, Meg's Ultimate Detailer leaves some insane beading for an OTC QD products and I have had it last for two weeks before the slickness was gone.
 
PiPUK said:
Yes. As above, it is often the case that a surface with the highest contact angle won't have the lowest sliding angle. So you can have fantastic beads but they won't clear off the surface as readily as with some less spectacular beading finishes.
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This has been my experience with most
beading products. A leaf blower just pushes them around the surface rather than off the car.

If a vertical panel holds water beads is it really hydrophobic? Not in my opinion.
 
sheeting is better than beading and easier when washing rinsing so what everyone’s top sheeting product?
 
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