Boss MF pad issue

[Mantilgh]

Mine does.

I also use the washer mod.

I this could why it happened in your test but I think it's the soft interface combined with just over stressing them in general too.

Say with little to no down pressure to slow the pad down, and no friction from the anti spin shroud, it's allowing the pads to reach a higher speed than they can take.

 

[RaskyR1]

I also use the washer mod.

I this could why it happened in your test but I think it's the soft interface combined with just over stressing them in general too.

Say with little to no down pressure to slow the pad down, and no friction from the anti spin shroud, it's allowing the pads to reach a higher speed than they can take.

I've had my washer in since day one and have never had one of these pads fail. I don't have an issue with other MF pads either TBH.

I run my G15/G21 at speeds of 4-4.5. I run my Rupes MKII at speeds of 3-3.5. If this is happening to your pads dial back on the speed and ease up on the downward pressure.

 

[Cruzscarwash]

I've been speaking to groits about this and passed on this thread, here's Thier response

"I've passed it along to our product development team for them to look into. For now, definitely call in to our customer service to get yours swapped out for new ones. 800-345-5789"

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

 

[dlc95]

Well said. That has been my point exactly. Like dlc95 said, griot's should probably specify that the pads should not be used over a certain speed. That said, I still think people need to use a bit more common sense, if whatever you are doing is destroying the pads (speed, pressure, dry buffing) then learn to adapt your technique to optimize the performance of the pad. Most of us experience the same issues, but because we love the pads we've made the necessary adjustments.

That said, I understand how it would be frustrating considering how expensive they are. Especially if you didn't see this thread and had it happen to numerous pads. That would stink

The whole point of the tall stroke, is to increase friction as a means to allow for reduction in pressure.

Rupes from day one advocated reduced pressure for their system. I find that I still need some, but not a lot.

Meguiar's on the other hand, states to use moderate pressure. Of course these guidelines are all relative to the individual behind the tool. Moderate pressure to one end user might be light to another. One guy might be 5' tall, 90 lbs, and the other 6' 8", 345... Those two will have their own perspective on pressure description parameters.

 

[Legacykid]

These pads seem to have a very soft foam which do not like much pressure. I use these quite often and they work very well, however you need to adjust your technique. I typically run my MKII 15 @ 4-4.5 with lighter pressure when using these pads, while my older 21 I can run @ 6. I know I was eating them up pretty good when I first got them also.

What up Kev, love the new spot dude it looks awesome, hope all is well on your end!

I also use the washer mod.

I this could why it happened in your test but I think it's the soft interface combined with just over stressing them in general too.

Say with little to no down pressure to slow the pad down, and no friction from the anti spin shroud, it's allowing the pads to reach a higher speed than they can take.

Im wondering if this may be something. I have in the past on a specific car had to run it at 6 with MF, but those pads were shot already. At most i will run it at is speed 5 id say 75-80% of the time im at 4.5 while cutting with the G21, and I never use pressure. The only pressure I could think of would be on slightly curved panel, maybe a Cayanne door. As you get lower and it curves it could press the pad against the backing plate causing this issue. But this brings me to my issue with there interface pad that was blown out on 2 section passes. I had to switch back to my CCS pads for the extra cushion.

I've been speaking to groits about this and passed on this thread, here's Thier response

"I've passed it along to our product development team for them to look into. For now, definitely call in to our customer service to get yours swapped out for new ones. 800-345-5789"

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

I think its great they are willing to work with the customer as always, they have great CS. But the reason I am on here is to figure out the problem. No point in having more of what doesn't work(for me). I mean the pads still work reguardless of it being like this. And I feel like they finish down better then the megs MF but for that price I don't want to see it failing.

 

[Mike PhillipsMike Phillips is verified member.]

Has this happen to anyone else?

I used this on the G21, and GG6.

I use no pressure, just weight of machine to polish. Ive ripped up a few pads. The last one I ripped up was testing how it happens on a hood, one handed on speed 4.5 G21. I could see red foam flying out of the pad. So that eliminates heat, and pressure. <br><br>Any thoughts, or is this just what it is?

With the above picture showing foam eaten out of or disintegrating out of the "center" portion of the foam thickness.



And with the below picture showing the edge of the backing plate touching into the center of the foam interface...

T

It certainly looks like the backing plate is doing the damage.


The effect is called,

Mushrooming

That is when the foam compresses and actually collapses against the backing plate, the foam squishes outward and over the edge of the backing plate.

The action of any 8mm and larger stroke tool is violent at speed, at least over time. Together with all the other factors, my guess is the damage is being caused by the edge of the backing plate. I've seen this over the years with other foam pads and other backing plates.


I just spoke with Jeff Brown about this and I suggest you give him time to carve out some of his time to sufficiently read through this entire thread and then I'm sure he'll comment.


I don't normally use any company's microfiber pad because when I need to cut fast or cut heavy I use a rotary buffer. I will do some testing of these pads and tools and see what I can find out.


It could be a case for future evolution of the foam formula for this pad and this application. Or a design evolution. By the word evolution I mean that after a product, pad or tool is introduced, after lots of date is compiled tweaks can be made for improvements to improve an existing working product so that it works better.

I don't want to categorically state there's an issue with these pads because like I said, I don't use them. Jeff did say that these pads and this system have been extensively tested and their testing never revealed this problem.


Griot's is a great company with great customer service and Jeff is the real deal when it comes to both hands-on detailing and new product development so let's give him a chance and give him some time.


Thank you....

 

[Legacykid]

With the above picture showing foam eaten out of or disintegrating out of the "center" portion of the foam thickness.



And with the below picture showing the edge of the backing plate touching into the center of the foam interface...




It certainly looks like the backing plate is doing the damage.


The effect is called,

Mushrooming

That is when the foam compresses and actually collapses against the backing plate, the foam squishes outward and over the edge of the backing plate.

The action of any 8mm and larger stroke tool is violent at speed, at least over time. Together with all the other factors, my guess is the damage is being caused by the edge of the backing plate. I've seen this over the years with other foam pads and other backing plates.


I just spoke with Jeff Brown about this and I suggest you give him time to carve out some of his time to sufficiently read through this entire thread and then I'm sure he'll comment.


I don't normally use any company's microfiber pad because when I need to cut fast or cut heavy I use a rotary buffer. I will do some testing of these pads and tools and see what I can find out.


It could be a case for future evolution of the foam formula for this pad and this application. Or a design evolution. By the word evolution I mean that after a product, pad or tool is introduced, after lots of date is compiled tweaks can be made for improvements to improve an existing working product so that it works better.

I don't want to categorically state there's an issue with these pads because like I said, I don't use them. Jeff did say that these pads and this system have been extensively tested and their testing never revealed this problem.


Griot's is a great company with great customer service and Jeff is the real deal when it comes to both hands-on detailing and new product development so let's give him a chance and give him some time.


Thank you....

And this is why I love AG, thanks Mike! Always something to be learned

 

[AZpolisher15]

I would think this problem would largely disappear with a stiffer foam replacing the red stuff. I do realize that introduces another variable to the "system". And I'm not familiar enough with the system to know what product/pressures this issue occurs with the most, although it looks like it kinda runs the gamut. If it were at the extreme cutting or extreme finishing end, it might be easier to deal with. But in the middle, it's a little trickier.

 

[Brownie]

Hey Guys

I'm slammed setting up for the Back to the Fifties Show in St Paul, MN. I promise to respond to you all no later than Monday. Have a great weekend. Thank you for your patience

 

[RaskyR1]

Hey Guys

I'm slammed setting up for the Back to the Fifties Show in St Paul, MN. I promise to respond to you all no later than Monday. Have a great weekend. Thank you for your patience

Oh man, I forgot about the 50's this weekend! Where is the booth at this year? I'll have to make it up there on Saturday if the weather holds out.

 

[TiCaLLioNStaLLyN]

Did we ever hear back on this?

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk

 

[brettS4]

Good question. Has anybody heard more about this design flaw?

 

[Justin at Final Inspection]

Was kinda wondering too. I have been a very faithful user if the BOSS microfiber cutting pads if you check all my write ups I have used them a ton. And they have all torn up on the edges. Even on flat panels. I think they need more cushion like a Rupes foam pad. The busier I become the more of these pads I tear up. I haven't really given it much thought but this season I have had to junk a bunch of them from delamination over time.

 

[7.3powerstroke]

not surprised Jeff did not respond yet...

 

[brettS4]

I dug out my Boss MF pads over the weekend for a session on my BMW. Both were completely destroyed (one had the foam pad rip entirely off the velcro, flying off to some unknown spot in the garage).

So, two pads completely worthless after two cars. Not exactly a good investment. And I have to say I wasn't terribly impressed with the results, anyway. I like the Boss creams, but I'm switching back to LC wool pads for hard paint.

 

[boomdone]

I dug out my Boss MF pads over the weekend for a session on my BMW. Both were completely destroyed (one had the foam pad rip entirely off the velcro, flying off to some unknown spot in the garage).

So, two pads completely worthless after two cars. Not exactly a good investment. And I have to say I wasn't terribly impressed with the results, anyway. I like the Boss creams, but I'm switching back to LC wool pads for hard paint.

Interesting. I've been using the Boss MF pads on my GG6 on a few cars now with no issue. However, I have ordered some LC wool pads to use on my MB E350 Genuine Black paint because the Boss MF pads seem to be taking a lot of section passes to get good correction.

 

[Brownie]

Greetings,
At Griot’s Garage® we strive for perfection in everything we do. Your satisfaction is paramount, as we want you as a customer for life.

We’ve heard your feedback regarding the BOSS™ Microfiber Pads. We’ve explored unique foams from Germany and the United States, and after much research and development have made a significant improvement.

We’ve identified a unique open-celled (reticulated) foam from Germany. This foam delivers multiple performance improvements, including:
Significantly improved durability- the foam features a higher tear resistance delivering class-leading life
Improved rebound- this is the foam’s ability to resist compression. This in turn improves panel contouring and increases pad rotation. Hence they’ll run smoother and offer increased paint correcting ability.

Improved BOSS™ Microfiber Pads should be in stock now. If you feel we've let you down, we'll make it right. Please contact Griot’s Garage Customer service at 800-345-5789 or [email protected].

We ask that you be prepared with:
• Proof of purchase
• Photographic evidence
• Brief explanation of your experience
• Name, Address, Phone

As with all buffing pads, they have a life span under normal use and eventually wear out. Please consider that while deciding to obtain reimbursement.

Again, we want you as a customer for life. Thank you for using Griot’s Garage.

 

[Legacykid]

Greetings,
At Griot’s Garage® we strive for perfection in everything we do. Your satisfaction is paramount, as we want you as a customer for life.

We’ve heard your feedback regarding the BOSS™ Microfiber Pads. We’ve explored unique foams from Germany and the United States, and after much research and development have made a significant improvement.

We’ve identified a unique open-celled (reticulated) foam from Germany. This foam delivers multiple performance improvements, including:
Significantly improved durability- the foam features a higher tear resistance delivering class-leading life
Improved rebound- this is the foam’s ability to resist compression. This in turn improves panel contouring and increases pad rotation. Hence they’ll run smoother and offer increased paint correcting ability.

Improved BOSS™ Microfiber Pads should be in stock now. If you feel we've let you down, we'll make it right. Please contact Griot’s Garage Customer service at 800-345-5789 or [email protected].

We ask that you be prepared with:
• Proof of purchase
• Photographic evidence
• Brief explanation of your experience
• Name, Address, Phone

As with all buffing pads, they have a life span under normal use and eventually wear out. Please consider that while deciding to obtain reimbursement.

Again, we want you as a customer for life. Thank you for using Griot’s Garage.

Awesome and glad to hear! Griots CS is always top notch, thats for sure.

 

[VISITOR]

^ there you have it from the man himself, nice hearing from you jeff! :xyxthumbs:

 

[Justin at Final Inspection]

I believe I have received a few of these newer pads. Below is a comparison of new vs old. On speed 5 on my g21 with washer mod they haven't shown any signs of wear of tear on 2-3 vehicles. Also they do seem a bit denser as well.