Buffing new paint on dark car

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cray1801

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I have a project to take the swirls out of my freshly painted dark blue car and I don't know what type products can be used on the fresh paint. The car was pinted one week ago so I'm sure the paint is not yet cured.

Here are the tools I have:
A Porter Cable buffer and various "smart" pads; a white foam polishing pad, a blue foam final finishing pad, a black foam finishing pad and a slightly smaller 5 1/2" orange pad. My only pad arber (holder) is about 5 1/2" in diameter.

Questions
Do I have the right tools for this job?
Can I use my 5 1/2" pad holder even for the larger 6 1/2" diameter pads?
What is the order of my pads rough to soft, and is the pad color an indicator of softness? I say Mike's video, he started with orange then white then red.
What type products should I use for the first step, second step and third stem and with what pad. I know some trial and error may be needed.

Would'nt you know it, after three months owning this dark Z06 a lady backed into it. Paint shop did a good job but I can see swirl marks where the the body shop buffed it. I had them touchup the spots that were obvious but wanted to finish it out myself.

Thanks, this is my first post!
 
the cherry is broke now it ok to beat the s out of it and have some fun.
pads sound good to me but i would get some 105 205 and 106fa or 85rd for the 3rd step... you cant take it with you no matter how hard you try
good luck and welcome to the forum..
 
IMO 6.5" pads on a PC are way too big, also your backing plate for the 5 1/2" pads should be no larger then 5".
 
Thanks!
I looked again and the backing plate, it's only 5". Maybe I need some additional 5.5" pads, since I only have one (orange one) that's the right size. Which ones should I get.

What products are good for this job? Any brands that are good buys will do for now. I only have pad cleaner and conditioner (Pinnacle XMT).

Two years ago for Christmas my wife got me this buffer and kit. I'm looking forward to putting it to good use. I practiced on my son's car last year with nice results.
 
Since this was your first post ot our forum...

Welcome to Autogeek Online! :welcome:

cray1801 said:
Would'nt you know it, after three months owning this dark Z06 a lady backed into it. Paint shop did a good job but I can see swirl marks where the the body shop buffed it. I had them touchup the spots that were obvious but wanted to finish it out myself.

Thanks, this is my first post!
Click to expand...

In the forum world this is called a Horror-Story

I try to actually type the word Horror-Story into each thread like this so later I can find threads about Horror-Stories by searching using the term Horror-Story. The hyphen helps to find more specific threads.

Anyway, sorry to hear they swirled your car's paint out after painting it but nobody reading this will be surprised as that's the norm for body shops, dealerships and even some detail shops and mobile detailers.

You'll alway find the best detailers are the detailers that hang out on forums like this and educate themselves.

cray1801 said:
I have a project to take the swirls out of my freshly painted dark blue car and I don't know what type products can be used on the fresh paint.
Click to expand...

Any of these products are safe for fresh paint - by the way, fresh paint is loosely defined as before 30 days air cure. So if car was painted a couple of months ago it might be new but it's not fresh.

Pinnacle Compounds and Polishes
Wolfgang Compounds and Polishes
Pinnacle XMT Compounds and Polishes
Optimum Paint Compounds and Polishes
Mother's Professional Line of Compounds and Polishes
Menzerna Compounds and Polishes
Meguiar's Professional Line of Compounds and Polishes
Poorboy's Compounds and Polishes
3M Professional Line of Compounds and Polishes
Finish Kare's 303 Foam Pad Glaze
Griot's Garage Polishes and Glazes


So there's lots to choose from and all of the above products will work to remove swirls.

It sounds like you have an older DA Polisher, by older I mean it's not one of the new models listed here,



Point being is that it won't have the power to keep larger pads rotating effectively when under pressure so you definitely want to go with 5.5" buffing pads. The CCS or Flat Pads will all work well.

Here's a thread that documents another forum member doing the exact thing you're doing...


WG TSR/FG & PC 7335 Technique

Chances are good the Wolfgang Twins will remove the swirls and restore the paint to a show car shine just like they did for the owner of the 2004 Corvette in the above thread.


Another stellar example of a forum member trying to undo the damage inflicted by the mis-use of a rotary buffer with show car results... great "after" pictures at the end of the thread...

How To Remove Horrible Rotary Buffer Swirl Marks out of a 350Z using the Wolfgang Twins


All of the products I listed above will work great but the Wolfgang Twins are two polishes that are literally bubba-proof and are so easy to work with especially for anyone new to machine polishing.

:)
 
That helps a lot! My buffer is a PC 7424 6", it's at least two years old. I have some of this 3M product a friend gave me. It's likely 3-4 years old and I don't know about shelf life. You think it will be fine to use?

Here's a couple of additional pictures of the "before" state of this fresh paint.

Time for some shopping.....and I'll check out those threads too!
 
cray1801 said:
I have some of this 3M product a friend gave me. It's likely 3-4 years old and I don't know about shelf life. You think it will be fine to use?
Click to expand...


If that's a heavy duty cutting compound it will probably scour the paint when used with a DA Polisher due to the oscillating action of the tool.

IF it's a polish it will probably be okay... If it's a glaze then it will probably just mask the defects.

Is there a part number or any words left on the label to give you an indication of how aggressive the product is?

Some products that are safe for use with a rotary buffer are not safe for use with a DA Polisher and 3M has been making RB products a lot longer than they've been making DA Products, so if it's old it might not be DA safe.

:)
 
Well here's what I have, what can I use:
1. Meguire's Cleaner #1
2. Meguire's Polish $2
3. Rejex, not a wax but makes paint/wheels slick, easier to clean.
4. Black Magic Liquid Wax, good shine but hard to get off, somewhat oily
5. Meguire's Quick Detailer
6. Pinnacle Pad Cleaner
7. Pinnacle Pad Conditioner
8. 6.5 pad, firm, likely too big?
9. 6.5 pad medium, likely too big?
10. PC buffer, 4.0 amps, is this considered weak, decent or strong? What size pad should I use, 5.5" for each step?
11. 6.5 pad soft, likely too big?
12. 4.8" backing plate, good size for 5.5" pad?
13. 5.5" pad, medium hard, need more of these pads I'd guess? Is this a popular size?
14. 6.0" pad, firm, don't know what this can be used for, polishing?

I assume my steps are first clean and clay, then swirl removal, then polish and then when the paint cures wax.

I've always been a car guy but was more interested in performance, but now that i have a newer car to play with too I'm branching out....:xyxthumbs:

Since I'm all new to this stuff help with the numbered items would be great.
 
cray1801 said:
Well here's what I have, what can I use:
1. Meguire's Cleaner #1
2. Meguire's Polish $2
Click to expand...

The Step 1 is a very light diminishing abrasive cleaner, it might help if you use a polishing pad, good technique and do some testing.

You really need a real "Swirl Mark Remover" formulated for use with a DA Polisher.


cray1801 said:
10. PC buffer, 4.0 amps, is this considered weak, decent or strong? What size pad should I use, 5.5" for each step?
Click to expand...

I've written extensively on the lack of power the first generation DA Polishers have to rotate a pad, probably more than anyone on the Internet. If you have a Porter Cable brand and it's not the new XP model then you have a first generation and it will work but you should use the 5.5" pads and thinner pads rotate better than thicker pads.

Millions of people have been using first gen polishers for 20 or so years so they do work, no worries just remember if you want to remove defects you need to keep the pad rotating.

cray1801 said:
I assume my steps are first clean and clay, then swirl removal, then polish and then when the paint cures wax.
Click to expand...

Wash
Clay
Remove swirls
Polish
Seal with wax or sealant


cray1801 said:
Since I'm all new to this stuff help with the numbered items would be great.
Click to expand...

Might have to start with getting some more tuned products for machine cleaning and polishing paint, I listed most of the brands we carry that include swirl mark removers and polishes for DA Polishers.


:)
 
Well I made some purchases last night, here's the list:

 1 LC-75-6PACK - 6 QTY Lake Country 5 1/2 x 7/8 Inch Beve

1 XMT-1000 - 12 oz. XMT Ultra Fine Swirl Remover #1

1 XMT-2000 - 12 oz. XMT Fine Swirl Remover #2

1 GR-11088 - 16 oz. Griot's Garage Paint Sealant

1 GR-11041 - Griot's Garage Paint Glaze


This should get me going. You know the paint really does not look bad, it's just the spots the body shop buffed and it looks hazy. I may only need the Ultra fine Swirl Remover to get the swirls out.
 
Mike, which product from my list in post #10 would you start with to remove light swirls and model shop buffing goofs after a through paint cleaning?

Also do I have my order correct?
1 wash
2 clay (if needed)
3 remove swirls (if needed)
4 glaze
5 polish
6 seal or wax
 
Always try the least aggressive approach first.

Wash
Clay
Polish (polishing is what you are doing when removing swirl marks)
Glaze
Wax or Seal
 
So I should start with the least aggressive (Ultra fine) swirl remover that I purchased, and use a blue 5.5" pad? :confused:

Please excuse my beginner questions...:xyxthumbs:
 
Start with a orange or white pad. Just do a couple test sections (12"x12") until you get the results you are looking for.
 
Practiced on the families extra car tonight, with decent results.

The "project car" has good to very good paint, except for the body shop crap. As a first try, should I use something less abrasive than the XMT Ultra Fine Swirl Remover #1 that I just purchased? As you can tell I'm a little hesitant...

Here is the 2007 Lemans Blue Z06 "project car" I'm referring to.
 
Well, I got her finished today. Total time was about 14 hours I'd guess. Wash, clay, polish, glaze and seal (original paint only).

I removed about 90% of the scratches and all the body shop scuff marks with the above products. I had some areas where a more aggressive swirl remover may have helped. I used the Fine Swirl Remover mostly and not much of the Ultra Fine. I liked all the products except the glaze, it was really hard to get off even when wiped right away. All the work in an air conditioned garage.

I worked in small areas and worked slowly, as you know it really takes some patients! The PC DA buffer worked great, I used setting 6 for all but the sealer, where I used 5. I can see where the new generation PC would be nice with a little more power.

I took several pictures but it was hard to the reflective details. Here's one "after" picture.
 
cray1801 said:
Well, I got her finished today. Total time was about 14 hours I'd guess. Wash, clay, polish, glaze and seal (original paint only).


I worked in small areas and worked slowly, as you know it really takes some patients! The PC DA buffer worked great, I used setting 6 for all but the sealer, where I used 5. I can see where the new generation PC would be nice with a little more power.
Click to expand...

Sounds about right for a Corvette for your first time... one thing about quality results, moving the polisher faster won't get the job done faster because you'll still have swirls and scratches left in the paint, you have to let the combination of pad, chemical and pressure over time do it's magic.



I took several pictures but it was hard to the reflective details. Here's one "after" picture.[/QUOTE]

Looks beautiful! :dblthumb2:

I uploaded it to your gallery so I could insert it into this thread instead of having a thumbnail everyone has to click on to see the picture...

bluecar.jpg




Nice work! Thank you for the follow-up, it's very rewarding to follow someone's progress from starting out to finished results.


:bowdown:
 
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