Charge for onr?

[cardaddy]

How in the World are you using so many towels?

"Speaking of rinseless, I take it you have a LOT of microfiber towels to use for that? On the Scion it'll take somewhere between 18~24 towels, only using each one once (for the wash) and almost as many for the drying. And on that F150 it'll easily take 24 towels (just for the wet part)."

See below.....

If you are going to the guys house use his water and power. I am just starting too and when the people contact me about it I just tell them up front as long as I have access to power and water I can come anywhere I need to. Later this year I'll get a tank and generator and start going to businesses around my area. That's a big thing here. Right now though I just use a hose and this GroundWork® 9 Pattern Spray Nozzle with Dispenser - Tractor Supply Co. You can add soap to the little container there and it gives a little foaming action nothing like an actual foamer but still serves a pretty good purpose IMO.

I have spent my money on good products and small things like brushes, wash mitts, pads, things like that. The way I look at it, that's more essential than having the generator and things like that. Unless there is heavy dirt the same things can be achieved with a hose and nozzle and a little safer.

I charge a little more for spray wax. I use OTC megs ultimate and its around $10 so I charge a little more for it. But its still a pretty stinking good spray wax and it last a good while too.

As far as my price on the two: for the truck, Mine would be about $70, and the car I would be about $60

So for all I would be at $130

:iagree::dblthumb2:
It's more than reasonable for you to use their water and power. You do however want to make sure you have all your own equipment, including hoses, nozzles, drop cords, etc. And make sure you take channel lock pliers to deal with old crappy hoses that they may have. Not that you can't use their hose, just make sure that everything is better when you leave than when you got there.

Wow 24 towels is a ton of towels

Yep it is... but I'll not put any additional swirls in a paint job doing a rinseless wash either. OTOH I have several hundred towels so it's not a big deal. Sure, you can do the "wet" part with as few as a dozen, but that's pushing it.

:iagree: I just finished an ONR wash on my van this afternoon. There's many variations on the rinseless method. You don't have to use so many towels as cardaddy said - I believe he's referring to what many call GDWM (I don't believe GD invented it, but that's a topic for another thread!)

The Lowe's grout sponge is a viable option. I use three in a single wash - one for the glass and upper panels, a 2nd one for lower panels, and a 3rd sponge for the tires and wheels. Pre-wetting the panels is always a good idea. And always, use 2BM. As well, with rinseless (or waterless) method, don't skimp on the drying towels. Since you're working panel by panel, there's always that risk your drying towel could pick up dirt somewhere.

I'm not a pro, but as a customer, I would be willing to pay $40 for a good ONR wash (not including spray wax, tire shine or interior). Good luck!!

:iagree:It may be what some call the "GDM".
And if you saw his videos all those years ago he'll use an entire bucket full of towels. I know that if it means no swirls, I'll use as many as it takes. Beats breaking out the buffer any day.


On why so many......

One reason is I don't use a towel that has any dirt/grit/grime in it at all (after it's been pulled lightly across the surface, forward, turned around then pulled back, not in a circular motion, 2 maybe 3 times it's done).

You can get away with 12 towels, but I really can't see anything less than that. The hood, 2, the roof 2, (then use those to do the glass) trunk 1, front fender 1 each (2), door 1 each (2), back quarter panel 1 each (2) and then you might just go ahead and use the ones from the hood and roof on the front and rear bumpers. That's a minimum of 12, providing you use some of them 2~3 times. Add in a few small towels to dry while you are going and it's pretty much impossible to wash/dry a vehicle with less than 18~20 towels.

Then you get to the real nitty-gritty...... the places where the more you wipe, the more damage is done.

The problem is the lower you get the WORSE it is for your towels. So if you're wiping wet with a towel and then drying.... you BETTER NOT be taking that towel you did the bottom of the front fender behind the tires with and then drag it across the hood.

If I'm doing a rinseless I'll do the top of the vehicle, (roof, hood, glass, tops of fenders, tops of doors (down to the handle) and *maybe* the top of the trunk providing it's not too dusty/dirty all with the same type of towel, same towel that' done those areas before.
Then for the bottom of the doors you can use a towel that's already dirty.

That still leaves you with the bumpers, rockers, and lower body panels. Those are by far the worst places for dirt and grime. If you are using a microfiber towel there, IT NEEDS TO BE A DEDICATED ROCKER PANEL/LOWER BODY TOWEL. (I have different colors for different uses.)

The grout sponges are a great option, I'll use them on the really dirty areas, just tend to used microfiber on all the rest.

@ the OP......

Meguiar's D114 is a much cheaper alternative to ONR. Worth checking out for sure. rops: Also, look at Lowes/Home Depot for a 52oz pump sprayer (or even a gallon sprayer). You can mix your rinseless wash in that and use it for a pre-spray. rops:

There is a time and place for doing rinseless, usually when a vehicle isn't all that dirty. OR.... when it's stupid cold outside and you have access to warm water for your rinseless mix. You can also do a rinseless wash inside of most garages. It'll put less water on their garage floor than they would have after parking their car in the garage after driving in the rain.

We're lucky here in Atlanta that we can (for the most part) wash with a bucket year round. I'd get 2, 3, 4 grit guards, at least a pair of dedicated wash mitts (one for the upper panels another for the lower) and 2 buckets. Shampoo will ALWAYS give you better lubricity and a safer wash than rinseless.

Drying is drying no matter which wash method you use. :xyxthumbs:

And has been mentioned, you can get ONRWW (with wax) or Duragloss makes an excellent rinseless wash with Aquawax in it. I've switched to Megs D114 and then just go back with either Megs 156 or Duragloss 951 as a spray wax/drying aid afterwards. :dblthumb2:

 

[allenk4]

So you are only using one of the 8 sides of the folded towel?

Or are you using only 2-3 of the 8 sides?

I re-read your post, but I am not following

Why not use all 8 sides?

 

[Blade]

It may be what some call the "GDM". And if you saw his videos all those years ago he'll use an entire bucket full of towels.

I think people call it GDWM for "Garry Dean Wash Method". And "all those years ago" is roughly only 2 years ago, (correct me if I'm wrong). However, I remember seeing posts by other people from before 2012 describing this exact same method. The difference: they never put their name on it. Topic for another thread...

One reason is I don't use a towel that has any dirt/grit/grime in it at all (after it's been pulled lightly across the surface, forward, turned around then pulled back, not in a circular motion, 2 maybe 3 times it's done).

I'm with allenk4, I can't picture what you're doing here. When you say "turned around", I believe you mean you flip the towel after one pass, right? So it's only 2 sides you're using at that point. What does it mean by "2 maybe 3 times it's done"?

Drying is drying no matter which wash method you use.

I disagree a little here. With rinseless and waterless, I'm more careful with my drying technique. The panel to the left/right/bottom may still be dirty - and I don't let my towel touch it. In fact to mitigate any risk, I'll use a fresh drying towel after a few panels (after roof and glass for example), or when I see it has accidentally picked up grime somehow. OTOH, I'm a little more lax when drying after a traditional 2BM wash.

 

[RecurveBolt27]

Well thanks for the replies

 

[cardaddy]

1. I think people call it GDWM for "Garry Dean Wash Method". And "all those years ago" is roughly only 2 years ago, (correct me if I'm wrong). However, I remember seeing posts by other people from before 2012 describing this exact same method. The difference: they never put their name on it. Topic for another thread...
2. I'm with allenk4, I can't picture what you're doing here. When you say "turned around", I believe you mean you flip the towel after one pass, right? So it's only 2 sides you're using at that point. What does it mean by "2 maybe 3 times it's done"?
3. I disagree a little here. With rinseless and waterless, I'm more careful with my drying technique. The panel to the left/right/bottom may still be dirty - and I don't let my towel touch it. In fact to mitigate any risk, I'll use a fresh drying towel after a few panels (after roof and glass for example), or when I see it has accidentally picked up grime somehow.
4. OTOH, I'm a little more lax when drying after a traditional 2BM wash.

1: Yep, I believe the proper acronym is "GDWM".
And "all those years ago" with the other people talking about it, long before the "GDWM" term was adopted was exactly what I was talking about. It's surely been going on long before Garry Dean made his video.

2: Yes, I flip the towel after 1 (or 2 at the most) passes. But I don't have 8 sides to use (as Kyle alluded to). The towels I use only have long pile on one side, as most do these days. Sure... I could use some dual-plush towels that cost a lot more, but I'm not going to use an expensive towel like that to wash a vehicle.

With that in mind, I *could* get 4 sides but I'll lay the towel open, only folded once so that it's wider, (the full 16" width). Using that method I'll still not put my hand directly on the towel, in an effort to leave as much liquid in the towel as possible. I'll hold it by the corners and gently 'drag' it across the surface. (Always front to back.) Then once it's at the other end I'll turn the towel around 180°... so that the pile always moves in the same direction, (in some OCD effort hoping that the pile will hold onto any dirt that's been picked up and not release it as soon as it's moved in the opposite direction) then move it BACK across the area it first went across. Then I'll flip it, move it over to the next 'track' and do it all again. With this method it's possible to do a roof, or hood with 2 towels.

(Also, when I mentioned using the top towels to do the glass, THAT is where the short pile side of the towel comes in. No problem using the short side there, perhaps better in fact.)

I also never do a rinseless in any sort of circular motion, (only straight, front-to-back motion).

3: When saying "drying is drying" I'm saying that we should ALL be diligent when drying. Just because it's a rinseless wash should mean that you take any less care when drying than you do any other time.

4: I think we are in total agreement here actually. In fact, (as you said) with rinseless you might indeed be MORE careful. rops: I don't 'drag' towels when drying either knowing that water has by far the least lubricity. I'll lay my towel on the surface and then gently pat, (or rub my open hand on the back of) the towel. It's those bottom panels that'll get you every time! Dedicated lower panel towels, washing, drying, scrubbing, etc. are the only way to go. Heck, I'll not use a buffing pad on a vehicle anywhere else once it's been used on a rocker panel.



Basically, towels are cheap and paint, (as well as correcting that paint) is expensive. Not to mention you only have so much paint to deal with.:dunno:
So if you're using 10~12 versus 18~24 you are taking a risk, (some may say a huge risk) depending on just how soft your paint is. As much as I enjoy buffing/polishing/correcting/applying LSP of any kind to paint, I don't want to (have to) do it after a wash because I didn't throw an extra 6~8 $2.00 towels in a bucket.
(I'm sure towels are more than $2.00, especially if you pick certain vendors.... but if you buy a case, you can get 365gsm towels for WELL UNDER $2.00, even 530's. Last 360's & 530's I bought were under $1.50, even after shipping.) :dblthumb2: