Clear Coat refresher...

[Ohio Detailing]

I have been hearing varying opinions on whether or not re-coating a vehicle's clear coat would be prudent or a good investment. Some day a new clear coat wouldn't actually hide imperfections, while others say it would but would be fine as long as it was done by a skilled technician. I am wondering everyone's thoughts on this, perhaps not an entire car, but re-coating a certain section/hood etc, would this be a way to revitalize the brilliance of a car's color or if it would only be masking the underlying fine scratches?

Maybe if the problem areas or panels were prepped with wet-sanding first, a top-clear coat would suffice?

 

[TOGWT]

The secret to a Concours d'elegance winning paint finish is colour-sanding (before wet-sanding paint show vehicle owners often have an extra 2.5 mils to 3.0 mils of clear applied).

This kind of work should only be undertaken by a very experienced enthusiast or a professional detailer; those that are experienced in colour-sanding (wet-sanding) more so than detailing, as this is more a paint renovation technique that takes years to perfect.

 

[Ohio Detailing]

The secret to a Concours d'elegance winning paint finish is colour-sanding (before wet-sanding paint show vehicle owners often have an extra 2.5 mils to 3.0 mils of clear applied).

This kind of work should only be undertaken by a very experienced enthusiast or a professional detailer; those that are experienced in colour-sanding (wet-sanding) more so than detailing, as this is more a paint renovation technique that takes years to perfect.

Awesome - makes sense. Would anyone happen to know someone in the Michigan, Kentucky, Ohio, Penn, Indiana, Virginia area that is renowned?

 

[oldmodman]

I saw a car that had been re-clearcoated by the owner in his garage. It looked fantastic.

I asked him how he went about it. He bought the clearcoat in quart containers at Kragen auto parts. It was made by Duplicolor and was designed for the home hobby painter.

He said he wet sanded the car until the old paint was scratch free but did not go into the basecoat. He went most of the way through the clearcoat. Then sprayed on four coats of the clearcoat. Then he sanded with 2500 grit wet paper and a sanding block until it looked perfectly smooth. Then it was polished with a rotary. He did say that he spent about a month doing it and a lot of the time was spent washing the car to remove every trace of dust. And he draped the entire inside of his garage in plastic to create a paint booth that was dust free.

I guess that if you have a huge amount of free time and want to do it at home you actually can. But unless I had access to someones real paint booth I wouldn't want to try it. Too much work.

 

[Gus_Mahn]

Clear coat is nothing more than clear paint. The question you should be asking is does the car need paint? If the underlying color is not faded, it is possible to wetsand with 1000 grit and re-clear the car, but any chips or scratches that can catch your finger nail likely can't be wetsanded out and will require featheredging, primer, block sanding, re-primer, finish sand, color, and finally clear. If you paint to the edge of the panel, you'll need to blend into the adjoining panel. It takes 12"-18" to hide the minor mismatch refinish paint often has compared to OE paint. Likely it will need color sanding and buffing after the clear.

 

[David Fermani]

I have been hearing varying opinions on whether or not re-coating a vehicle's clear coat would be prudent or a good investment. Some day a new clear coat wouldn't actually hide imperfections, while others say it would but would be fine as long as it was done by a skilled technician. I am wondering everyone's thoughts on this, perhaps not an entire car, but re-coating a certain section/hood etc, would this be a way to revitalize the brilliance of a car's color or if it would only be masking the underlying fine scratches?

Maybe if the problem areas or panels were prepped with wet-sanding first, a top-clear coat would suffice?

As long as it's done properly, re-clearing a vehicle will be fine. Re-clearing will only cover up the imperfections(scratches) that are in the clear and won't help if imperfection(orange peel or deep scratches) are heavy in the base coat. I'd suggest sanding the clear down as flat and even as possible before repainting it. Otherwise, you'll only be accentuating the already OP'd finish. I suggest re-clearing a vehicle if a substantial amount of clear has been removed and is harming the durability of the basecoat. There's also an option on light colored paints to use a colorless base to mask/cover some of the deeper imperfections.

What is the year, model & color of your vehicle and why are you considering re-clearing it?

The secret to a Concours d'elegance winning paint finish is colour-sanding (before wet-sanding paint show vehicle owners often have an extra 2.5 mils to 3.0 mils of clear applied).

This kind of work should only be undertaken by a very experienced enthusiast or a professional detailer; those that are experienced in colour-sanding (wet-sanding) more so than detailing, as this is more a paint renovation technique that takes years to perfect.

On perfectly flat show finishes, sanding starts before the clear is applied. A painter will block sand the base in between coats to insure that the base is totally flat before appling clear coat. Otherwise, the clear will only magnify the imperfections. They will also end up doing extensive sanding of the clear as well.

Would anyone happen to know someone in the Michigan, Kentucky, Ohio, Penn, Indiana, Virginia area that is renowned?

I know a very good person in the Metro Detroit area. He specializes in perfect show finishes.

 

[Ohio Detailing]

I have a distinguised and award winning '97 Pontiac Grand Prix GT - bright red. HAHA, ok, don't laugh - I know it's not exactly a Gallardo, but it's all I have and I've had it since high school and taken such obsessive care of it, I've become 'emotionally' attached to it you could say. Now since I'm married, a new car isn't feasible right now, so I'd like to return my car (which is 85% show roon condition right now) to a full, stand-out, whip lash neck turning flawless red.

I know it seems like a wasted time and investment to some, and it might be true - but when it comes to my car I am always a little liberal with my money and time.

Anyway, I really wanted to thank everyone for chiming in, Detroit is about 3 hours away... I wonder how much this entire process would run me? I know I could maybe budget for a certain amount, but we're really trying to save up for some things.

 

[David Fermani]

I'd be willing to take an educated guess that it would be no less than $3000 just to reclear it. Other than the material cost, there's alot of trim removal to consider plus surface prep labor involved.

 

[Malu59RT]

I'd be willing to take an educated guess that it would be no less than $3000 just to reclear it. Other than the material cost, there's alot of trim removal to consider plus surface prep labor involved.

Yeesh, that's a lot of money. I had two cars painted for $2,000 each. First one was a 3 stage yellow pearl, with minor body damage, and shaving off emblems. 2nd car had the same 3 stage yellow pear, a body kit installed, and graphics added, and both paint jobs were show quality. On my Viper, I was quoted $3500 to have racing stripes added, and the entire car re-cleared from a high end shop that specializes in Vipers (Viper tax, lol). I'm sure you could get your GP done for around $2,000.

Jason

 

[ScottB]

everytime I think of some re-clearcoating, I think of those super wavy low cost repaints. It doesnt seem worth it.

 

[David Fermani]

Yeesh, that's a lot of money. I had two cars painted for $2,000 each. First one was a 3 stage yellow pearl, with minor body damage, and shaving off emblems. 2nd car had the same 3 stage yellow pear, a body kit installed, and graphics added, and both paint jobs were show quality. On my Viper, I was quoted $3500 to have racing stripes added, and the entire car re-cleared from a high end shop that specializes in Vipers (Viper tax, lol). I'm sure you could get your GP done for around $2,000.

Jason

Your post doesn't make alot of sense? You paid $2000 for a "show quality" tri-stage paint job & $3500 for a basic stripe kit with JUST CLEAR and you think my $3000 quote for a re-clear is a lot of money? Just because the Viper is more expensive has nothing to do with the price (for this application).

With body repair, I find you more than likely get what you pay for. Have you ever entered your 3-stage cars in a show? I find it difficult to digest that a reputable shop could make a profit on a $2000 paint job? The material cost alone is well over $600.

 

[Malu59RT]

Your post doesn't make alot of sense? You paid $2000 for a "show quality" tri-stage paint job & $3500 for a basic stripe kit with JUST CLEAR and you think my $3000 quote for a re-clear is a lot of money? Just because the Viper is more expensive has nothing to do with the price (for this application).

With body repair, I find you more than likely get what you pay for. Have you ever entered your 3-stage cars in a show? I find it difficult to digest that a reputable shop could make a profit on a $2000 paint job? The material cost alone is well over $600.

The first $2,000 job was a local body shop that did work on my 2nd car (Prelude - was in an issue of Super Street back in 2002), and several friends cars. Great work, but on the next car (S2000 - won 2 awards at the 2 shows I entered it in), the body kit wasn't something they wanted to mess with. So I went to another shop with a good recommendation, and they installed the kit, made adjustments as necessary (as the fit on aftermarket parts aren't the greatest), painted the yellow base coat over the entire car, laid the black w/blue pearl on the bottom half of the car, laid the graphics over, applied the yellow again, the pearl, pulled the graphics tape, and sprayed the clear. Then he wet sanded, buffed, and accepted my check for $2,000.

Oh yeah, my motorcycle has a very trick custom paint job. 3 colors, graphics, drop shadows, etc. It has won the only show I've entered it in, and is in the April 2008 Super Street Bike magazine. I paid for the materials on that, $400, and had a friend paint it. So I DO know a little bit regarding what I'm talking about. Regarding profit, I don't know, but I have maintained good relationships with all the previously listed shops, so I'm pretty sure I haven't screwed anyone over.

Regarding your comment, the car does have a lot to do with the price, because I was going to take the car to a body shop that specializes in Vipers and other high-end cars. They know how much we pay for our cars, and they know that most will pay more for paint work from them. I have received cheaper quotes of $1,000 for stripes only, from other local shops, but have yet to pull the trigger on anything, because the solid color is starting to grow on me.

To the OP, if you do decide to get it re-cleared, find a body shop with customer cars you can look at, and make sure they have a lifetime warranty on their work.

Jason

 

[David Fermani]

You're comparing shops that cut you a break because you have a relationship established to one that doesn't? That's could make a huge price difference. What if someone off the street walked into that exact shop for the same thing? Hard to believe $2000 for all that work? Alot of quality shops charge $1000 alone just for sanding a car after they paint it for customers off the street.

Plus, if the materials for your motorcycle cost $400, imagine how much a car would be? So, how can a shop profit with that kind of cost margine?

Again, price will have nothing to do with the type of car, unless that specific vehicle requires additional work (trim removal, etc.) or is an exotic. There would be no difference in price to paint a fender on a Mazda, compared to a Mercedes unless the shop is unethical. Price is calculated in labor hours, not kind of vehicle you have. (unless it's an exotic, which in some of cases Vipers are not - they actually go both ways). There's usually not that big of a variance in paint labor rates between high end shops and non-high end shops. I refer people to a local place that is 1 of 6 places in the country that is factory certified on Ferrari, Maserati & Aston Martin. They don't charge exotic rates to non exotic vehicles. It basically comes down to what labor the shops need to do, to do the job right. Some might remove trim, some might rope or tape it. That alone could account for a large price difference if one is removing and windshield/back glass and the other is roping/taping it off.

 

[Malu59RT]

You're comparing shops that cut you a break because you have a relationship established to one that doesn't? That's could make a huge price difference. What if someone off the street walked into that exact shop for the same thing? Hard to believe $2000 for all that work? Alot of quality shops charge $1000 alone just for sanding a car after they paint it for customers off the street.

Plus, if the materials for your motorcycle cost $400, imagine how much a car would be? So, how can a shop profit with that kind of cost margine?

Again, price will have nothing to do with the type of car, unless that specific vehicle requires additional work (trim removal, etc.) or is an exotic. There would be no difference in price to paint a fender on a Mazda, compared to a Mercedes unless the shop is unethical. Price is calculated in labor hours, not kind of vehicle you have. (unless it's an exotic, which in some of cases Vipers are not - they actually go both ways). There's usually not that big of a variance in paint labor rates between high end shops and non-high end shops. I refer people to a local place that is 1 of 6 places in the country that is factory certified on Ferrari, Maserati & Aston Martin. They don't charge exotic rates to non exotic vehicles. It basically comes down to what labor the shops need to do, to do the job right. Some might remove trim, some might rope or tape it. That alone could account for a large price difference if one is removing and windshield/back glass and the other is roping/taping it off.

Relationship established? Re-read what I posted. I said I have maintained relationships AFTER the work. I went off of my friends' recommendation to take it there in the first place. Yes, I walked into both of the first two shops "off the street" based on recommendations, and received that price. So NOW I maintain good relationships with them, and they work on my parents/brothers cars if they are in any accidents.

The cost of my motorcycle paint is also irrelevant, because you don't know what I bought. Do you think PPG, Glasurit, or House of Kolors are the exact same price? I had to buy HOK, and I had to buy 2 different candy colors, AND I didn't have an account set up with English Color, so I was buying it for more than what body shops pay.

Also, you are living in a dream world if you think all body shops charge the same, because they don't. I doubt they are worried about ethics, because to most people in business, customers are big $ signs. If you see me drive in my Viper and I ask for a repaint, you are going to charge more than you would if you see me drive a 91 Honda Civic. Why? Because I expect a higher level of quality for the paint job, and you can tell I won't be as forgiving for minor mistakes. It's just the way the world works.