Deep talk about wheel cleaners - alkaline, acid, pH levels

[Eldorado2k]

That applies to brand new we wheels... Maybe. But in real life there are scratches and/or curb rash which means bare aluminum. Even on brand new wheels there is bare aluminum somewhere. I've seen bubbling around valve stems on cars where owners regularly used agressive products on wheels.

IMO wheel cleaners are one time use on neglected wheels. They are not for regular use to save you from bending over and using some elbow grease.

The kind of bubbling you’re talking about isn’t caused by aggressive wheel cleaners, it’s caused by long term neglect aka baked on brake dust which can eat through the finish similar to how bird crap can eat through your clear coat if left to bake for long enough.

...But if and when there’s any damage to the wheels finish, it isn’t caused by the wheel cleaner, not even Wheel Brightener @4:1 will do any harm and the following pics of my own wheels can prove it.

Here’s the chrome wheels on my Cadillac several months ago, when I 1st bought it. The whole car was severely neglected for what must’ve been years. Just look at that baked on brake dust. Keep in mind these chrome wheels are 17yrs. old.

Odds are there’s bound to be some pitting or bubbling 1 way or another right?

If there’s no pitting or bubbling from the years of that baked on brake dust, then the Wheel Brightener is about to cause it because if it’s not caused by the brake dust it’s about to be caused by the wheel cleaner right? After all, it’s Acid! Oh no my wheels!

...Actually, no. Of course the wheel cleaner didn’t cause any damage. It actually restored them to like new. Yes, even though it’s “acid” based.

I use Wheel Brightener once per week to clean my wheels. And if it wasn’t Wheel Brightener it was it’s OTC equivalent Megs Hot Wheels Chrome Wheel Cleaner or Eagle 1 Chrome & Wire Cleaner for the past 20+yrs. on all of my Cadillacs on a weekly basis because they’ve all had chrome wheels and the acid based wheel cleaner Never caused any damage.

This is my weekly routine.
WB for wheels
Megs D114 for the tires
Megs APC for the wheel wells

Clean.

And as far as road rash & scratches that may be on wheels exposing the so called delicate ‘bare aluminum’...

Nothing happens.

I’ve cleaned countless customers wheels with so called aggressive wheel cleaners and have never had a single issue and a whole lot of those wheels have road rash on them and if they don’t they’ll have it soon because normL people eventually scratch their wheels.

 

[DBAILEY]

How else do you explain that white worming affect? It always seems to start where the wheel has been chipped from road rash or from the impact socket at the wheel lug holes. It always looks like a strong cleaner has worked its way underneath the clear and or powder coat.

 

[Eldorado2k]

How else do you explain that white worming affect? It always seems to start where the wheel has been chipped from road rash or from the impact socket at the wheel lug holes. It always looks like a strong cleaner has worked its way underneath the clear and or powder coat.

I’ve never heard of that term. These wheels had lots of the clearcoat peeling off of them + road rash. Is the worming effect that you’re referring to seen here?

 

[DBAILEY]

I am not see any of your photos in either post unfortunately

 

[SayNoToPistons]

How else do you explain that white worming affect? It always seems to start where the wheel has been chipped from road rash or from the impact socket at the wheel lug holes. It always looks like a strong cleaner has worked its way underneath the clear and or powder coat.

I know exactly what you're talking about. It stems from exposed aluminum either at the backside where it sits on the hub or around chips/rashes as you mentioned.

I suspect it's from corrosion of the aluminum spreading and lifting the clearcoat. I'm sure aggressive cleaners and road containments (e.g. sodium chloride for snow/ice) contributes to it. Though as one of my concerns from my original post, I do wonder if certain pH level of wheel cleaners will accelerate that corrosion.

 

[AaronE]

I know exactly what you're talking about. It stems from exposed aluminum either at the backside where it sits on the hub or around chips/rashes as you mentioned.

I suspect it's from corrosion of the aluminum spreading and lifting the clearcoat. I'm sure aggressive cleaners and road containments (e.g. sodium chloride for snow/ice) contributes to it. Though as one of my concerns from my original post, I do wonder if certain pH level of wheel cleaners will accelerate that corrosion.

Coming from a small understanding of aviation grade aluminum, that same effect happens to all aluminum over time, you just have the luxury I suppose of seeing it develop compared to on my plane where it can be hidden under the paint. A chemical too acidic or too basic will cause damage.

Mind you, different aluminum alloys have different tolerance levels of what they can take to some degree. Here's a guide from an FAA circular. I selected this portion dealing with the chemical effects of corrosion but if you Google FAA Advisory Circular 43-4B, that is the latest guidance for aluminum corrosion and control and can shed some light on what causes corrosion in aluminum and why some wheels will be more or less resistant than others.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Autogeekonline mobile app

 

[BillE]

I know exactly what you're talking about. It stems from exposed aluminum either at the backside where it sits on the hub or around chips/rashes as you mentioned.

I suspect it's from corrosion of the aluminum spreading and lifting the clearcoat. I'm sure aggressive cleaners and road containments (e.g. sodium chloride for snow/ice) contributes to it. Though as one of my concerns from my original post, I do wonder if certain pH level of wheel cleaners will accelerate that corrosion.

Well stated...I TOTALLY agree.

It seems that it only takes one tiny 'thin spot' is to get things started. At least that's been my experience.

Bill

 

[yakky]

I’ve never heard of that term. These wheels had lots of the clearcoat peeling off of them + road rash. Is the worming effect that you’re referring to seen here?

Don't you live is southern California? Aside from UV, it's the most friendly environment for cars.

The chemistry is there. Reactive aluminum plus strong acids/bases. I just can't see how you think it doesn't happen.

 

[AaronE]

Don't you live is southern California? Aside from UV, it's the most friendly environment for cars.

The chemistry is there. Reactive aluminum plus strong acids/bases. I just can't see how you think it doesn't happen.

Eldorado is a pretty respected guy and he's give me some solid advice here (thanks make keep it up!) But like that advisory circular states (please take a look if you want to nerd out and get a deeper understanding) different alloys of aluminum react to different PH levels and, I forgot to mention, different types of acids. Also it depends on if there's a coating or not, anodization, alan clad, etc. It's way more than I can understand but when I go to the base in two weeks, maybe I can swing by the airframe shop and talk to a few of the metal heads about this.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Autogeekonline mobile app

 

[MattPersman]

I don’t even think wheel bright is that strong in 4:1. It’s cleans my silver oem wheels pretty well but not my black oem or aftermarket that well unless you like to agitate




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[AaronE]

I'm curious to buy some litmus strips to test the dilution ratios. I believe the SDS only covers the concentrate, not the reduced.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Autogeekonline mobile app

 

[UncleDavy]

I'm curious to buy some litmus strips to test the dilution ratios. I believe the SDS only covers the concentrate, not the reduced.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Autogeekonline mobile app

No need for litmus strips. Just use this formula.

For an acid: Original pH + (-log(original volume/new volume))
For a base: Original pH - (-log(original volume/new volume))

 

[AaronE]

No need for litmus strips. Just use this formula.

For an acid: Original pH + (-log(original volume/new volume))
For a base: Original pH - (-log(original volume/new volume))

Now that is cool! I'll run some calculations later


Sent from my SM-G950U using Autogeekonline mobile app

 

[UncleDavy]

Now that is cool! I'll run some calculations later


Sent from my SM-G950U using Autogeekonline mobile app

Here is an easy online calculator.
Chemical Calculator: Dilution of Bases and Acids

 

[KrisDetails]

I have a jug of Meguiars Wheel Brightener that i haven't opened yet and was wondering if anyone would know if it is ok to use on my rims Enkein Nt03+M?
Just a bit confused to what I can use it on besides Stock rims on cars.

"MAT Technology
Enkei developed a new manufacturing process to produce the next aluminum wheel generation. The Most Advanced Technology (M.A.T) combines one-piece cast wheel technology with a rim forming technology called spinning process. Using this new technology of casting and rim forming by M.A.T process, is critical to improve drastically the material property and strength of the wheels. Rim-Rolled technology shapes the rim to improve material elongation without sacrificing the wheels hardness."

View attachment 67337

 

[DirtyCanuck]

Just to give you an Idea as to what you are working with. Household bleach (javex,Clorox) is right around 12 ph full strength. At 13-15 you are getting quite alkaline (lye).

On the other end of the scale is acid. Think vinegar ph 3-4, or hydrochloric acid. Ph 0-1

 

[AaronE]

I have a jug of Meguiars Wheel Brightener that i haven't opened yet and was wondering if anyone would know if it is ok to use on my rims Enkein Nt03+M?
Just a bit confused to what I can use it on besides Stock rims on cars.

"MAT Technology
Enkei developed a new manufacturing process to produce the next aluminum wheel generation. The Most Advanced Technology (M.A.T) combines one-piece cast wheel technology with a rim forming technology called spinning process. Using this new technology of casting and rim forming by M.A.T process, is critical to improve drastically the material property and strength of the wheels. Rim-Rolled technology shapes the rim to improve material elongation without sacrificing the wheels hardness."

View attachment 67337

Depends on the alloy they are made from. Some react with different alkalines and acids but not others.

If you want to know for sure, check the acid type in the Wheel Brightener then call your wheel manufacturer and ask about if it's safe or not.



Sent from my SM-G950U using Autogeekonline mobile app

 

[Belo]

Modern iron and fallout removers are the way to go. PH neutral and work very well for wheels and paint. Also no damage to surrounding areas such as brake components or anodized trim, such as running boards or wheel arch trim.

except for the iron removers explicitly state to keep away from calipers and bare metal brake components...