Did I make a mistake buying the PC 7424XP?

I'm going to get the most powerful or best correcting one they make. If it breaks - oh well.

Wouldn't that be a Flex 3401 on both accounts? I guess perhaps best is open to interpretation of best as in fastest to correct, or best as in best finishing.

I still have my old PC 7336 I used for correcting before I got a flex. Talk about taking forever to correct paint, but it left a darn fine finish on my vehicle.
 
I'd return the 7424xp, it's like a 3-speed auto by today's standards. I got seat time with a 7424xp last month and it was a pretty awful experience compared to my Rupes 21 or Flex 3401.

For your budget, I'd look around for a used Flex 3401. You may be able to find one in the $150-$200 range if you look hard enough.
 
This unit is a great unit for waxing, glazing & very light correction. Also you can purchase the same brushes that are sold for the cyclo & use it for cleaning interiors. The PC is also great for using the nanoskin clay pads as well as the 5000 & 3000 sanding discs. I also have the GG 6" which is a bit stronger and more useful for some correction work. I think that the PC is one of the better units for the beginner since it is almost impossible to damage your paint with it. Also it is a well built unit, I've lost track of how many years I've had mine.
 
I like the Porter Cable... the horizontal panels on this car were done using a 3 step rotary process. The vertical panels on this car were done using a 2-step dual action polisher process and the dual action polisher was the Porter Cable.


2000_Lotus_Esprit_012.jpg


2000_Lotus_Esprit_013.jpg


2000_Lotus_Esprit_014.jpg



I type this all the time and here goes again....


MILLIONS of cars have been taken from a diamond in the rough and turned into a glistening gemstone using nothing but a Porter Cable dual action polisher, a few good pads, some compound and polishes that use good abrasive technology and good technique.

The only other factor that has an effect as far as determining good or bad results is time.

Porter Cable = Tool Maker = Good Tool.



:)
 
Wouldn't that be a Flex 3401 on both accounts? I guess perhaps best is open to interpretation of best as in fastest to correct, or best as in best finishing.

I still have my old PC 7336 I used for correcting before I got a flex. Talk about taking forever to correct paint, but it left a darn fine finish on my vehicle.

I'm not interested and don't need a forced rotational machine. I've read enough on the 3401 to know I'm not interested in it. I like the Rupes and the GG6.
 
I have the 7424 XP, and it works for me. Like others have said, use the smaller pads with it, and you'll be fine.
 
Truth is, there's many correct answers here, and I didn't mean to come across as being so adamant, that one particular machine excels over another. Probably all have their plusses, and minuses.

Cost, reliability, effectiveness, ergonomics, etc.

If I was a professional detailer, or was in the position where cost was no object, I would then seriously consider machines like the Rupes, or Flex Tools.

I personally have a rotary polisher (Milwaukee) know how to use it, but also have a high respect that almost borders on fear of such machines.
As you'll all agree, such machines can get you into trouble in a hurry with a mistake.

Mike P has mentioned time. The other is learning to properly use what you have to attain good final results.

Again, I meant no disrespect towards any member here with my past comments. These machines all have their following, their fans, and their detractors.

Anything can fail of course, nothing is perfect, and a particular sample's quality of build can vary from one unit to another, just like anything else.
Mark
 
I have the 7424 XP, and it works for me. Like others have said, use the smaller pads with it, and you'll be fine.

Yep, the PC7424 works just fine with 5.5" pads, I think the OP will be very happy with their new PC if used correctly.
 
Back in the olden days (now I'm showing my age here) we weren't so blessed with such a variety of good machines like today.

Essentially we had the choice of a Rotary (usually back then just a single speed unit, and then with only wool or polyester bonnets), and the orbital waxers of the day, such as Waxcoa-Craftsman, Wen, and others.

While many would say the orbital waxers offered absolutely no correction abilities, I would say this is partially untrue.

For a vehicle with a paint that was well maintained, and if one spent the time of learning these machines, one could get some bit of rotation and correction with these.

They did work (to a point) with AIO's, Glazes, Cleaner Waxes, and also Polishes. They were simple to use, just about impossible to get into trouble with, and even a child could get very good final results, with an even finish with good luster.

I would use such behind a rotary, to eliminate any remnants of holograms left by a rotary, or use such with a mild polish-glaze before waxing-sealing.

When I once had personal access to an upholstery shop, I even once made many custom made Bonnets, from Canon Plush Cotton Bath Towels.

Still have those two waxers (9"&11"), but they have been relegated to their boxes, just like many have relegated such machines as the PC, or Griots-etc, once they graduate to more sophisticated pieces of machinery.
Mark
 
Since we're all giving our opinions and I've expressed by dislike of my PC before I thought I'd join in again. I wouldn't wish a Porter Cable on anyone for correcting cars. It just takes too long. Use a Rupes if you don't like the Flex. I felt sorry for my son who was using my old PC and got him a Rupes. The PC was vibrating his hands so much they itched and his arms were worn out by the time he finished doing the sides of the car with the PC. He bangs them out in no time with the Rupes. Still, the PC will get the job done if you have patience which is something I battle.
 
I've got to throw in a question here......

Before I knew better, I had purchased several 6.5" pads to use with the standard 6" backing plate that came with the DA machine.

Is it a really bad idea to use a 6.5" pad? If so, why?
 
Simply put, the larger the pad, the harder it is for the machine to turn the pad and actually level paint. Hence why it's more advantageous to use smaller pads with the PC. You'll wind up making a few more passes, but you get better results. I started with the larger LC pads and now use 5.5" and smaller.
Another +1 for the PC 7424XP. Its been a great tool to learn on for me with far less chances of screwing up mine or someone else's paint. Thanks to what I've learned on here from Mike and the AG gang, I even did my first wet sanding last week and was able to successfully compound/polish the wet sanding marks with my PC and wool pads. One day I'll upgrade but so far it's been a great tool.
 
Since we're all giving our opinions and I've expressed by dislike of my PC before I thought I'd join in again.


I wouldn't wish a Porter Cable on anyone for correcting cars.


And opinions are all any of us have to offer... and one of the strong features of the AGO forum is the input of opinions from a wide variety of people as this just makes for a great discussion.



This Thursday I'm teaching a class on how to do both production detailing and show car detailing using only a Porter Cable, Lake Country 5.5" Flat pads, Orange, White and Black and Wolfgang Uber Compound, Total Swirl Remover, Finishing Glaze and Pinnacle XMT 360.

This is one of the reasons I scheduled the 2000 Lotus Esprit to be here was to walk the walk.


I like the Porter Cable, I like it better than the Griot's Garage and the Meguiar's versions. I think it has room for improvement but the people at Porter Cable don't ever as "we" on the forums what we think or want and they certainly have never called me and asked for my input.


Griot's Input
A few years ago Rob Wood from Griot's sent me an e-mail asking what kind of changes I would make to the previous design of the Griot's, myself and I'm sure others they asked gave them feedback. See post #8 of this thread.

Griot's Garage 6" won't accept Lake Country 5" Backing Plate?



3M Input
A few years ago one of the 3M Reps joined the forum world and asked everyone what kind of improvements or changes we would like to see made to a rotary buffer and myself and a host of other guys provided them feedback and the current DeWALT 849X is the result from 3M's research. (I can locate this thread too).



Flex Input
A few years ago I was asked by Flex engineers for my thoughts and suggestions for a new tool while Nick and I were in Germany visiting Flex and in a meeting with the Flex Engineers I told them I thought there was a market for super high quality and high efficiency version of the Porter Cable.


Secret meeting with the Flex Engineers!



Porter Cable Input????
So I'd love to see some improvements made to the current Porter Cable 7424XP but as it is built as of today in the right hands it can do miracles.

I have a friend that was an engineer for Black & Decker and has contacts at Porter Cable and even he told me they really don't want or need our input on what we would like to see improved about their tool.


Still... I like the PC, I like how it fits my hand and when I use the 5.5" thin pads it does a great job for whatever project I've selected to use it on. If I need more power, I know where to get it but sometimes the PC is all I need.



Just one guy's opinion...



:)
 
I've got to throw in a question here......

Before I knew better, I had purchased several 6.5" pads to use with the standard 6" backing plate that came with the DA machine.

Is it a really bad idea to use a 6.5" pad? If so, why?

Mike has a great article about the older PC7424 (the non-XP model) called something along the lines of "getting the most from your porter cable" and in it, he explains exactly how to get great results with that older machine. If you take the advice in that article, a apply it to the newer PC7424XP, you'll get great results, but even faster with the extra bit of oomph that model has.

OP, I think you made a great first choice of machine. I learned on the older PC7424 (actually a PC7336, but that's a technicality), and the techniques I learned on it made me overcome Flex challenges in a panel or two when I ran it the first time.

Pad not flat on a PC? It just stops rotating. On a Flex, it walks right into a side mirror or drops off the panel before you know it. Too much downward pressure on a PC? Just stops rotating. On a Flex, it'll keep spinning, but you don't get a good finish out, and you just create heat.

Besides all that, if you buff out the entire car and think, "never again!" You're not out $350.00.
 
Mike has a great article about the older PC7424 (the non-XP model) called something along the lines of "getting the most from your porter cable" and in it, he explains exactly how to get great results with that older machine. If you take the advice in that article, a apply it to the newer PC7424XP, you'll get great results, but even faster with the extra bit of oomph that model has.

OP, I think you made a great first choice of machine. I learned on the older PC7424 (actually a PC7336, but that's a technicality), and the techniques I learned on it made me overcome Flex challenges in a panel or two when I ran it the first time.

Pad not flat on a PC? It just stops rotating. On a Flex, it walks right into a side mirror or drops off the panel before you know it. Too much downward pressure on a PC? Just stops rotating. On a Flex, it'll keep spinning, but you don't get a good finish out, and you just create heat.

Besides all that, if you buff out the entire car and think, "never again!" You're not out $350.00.

Very good points you bring up. That the PC-Griots-Meguiars-Rupes-etc just stop rotating if you do something dumb, like tilting, or applying too much pressure, and not so with the Flex DA, that it is akin to a Rotary in some respects with its forced roatation.

That was one thing I liked in the old days about using such ancient machines as the Waxcoa-Craftsman Oribtal Waxers, that unless you dropped the machine upside down on the paint, or was using the thing drunk, and then banged it into a mirror, it was just about impossible to mess up. That you could literally sit there with machine in one hand on the roof, hood, or truck, and a cup of coffee in the other hand, and spend countless minutes in one small area, and never hurt the paint.

I cannot even guess how many vehicles I've hand waxed in my lifetime? Multiple hundreds would be a good guess. Hand waxing can sometimes produce inconsistent final results, even with easy to use waxes, and sealants. I've been there, and experienced such.

That I said to myself multiple times with the simplicity of the old orbital waxers, that an 8-10 year old could come along, apply, and remove wax-sealants with such, and get better results than my experienced hands could. A more even application of product, with a similar matched surface pressure throughout, not pressing light in one area, and harder in others, and a random action which could, and will effect final results.

I feel that the PC, Griots, Megs, Rupes, Harbor Freight follow such simple useage, the end results are great, and relatively safe for even a first time user.

It would probably be a safe assumption on my part, to say that I'd guess that 99% of us forumites who use a machine, have one of these brands I list above in my previous sentence.
Mark
 
Very good points you bring up. That the PC-Griots-Meguiars-Rupes-etc just stop rotating

The GG6 doesn't stop rotating no matter what angle or crazy thing you do with it. That is why it's superior to the PC and Meg's IMHO.
 
Thanks for all of the input guys. I realize I won't know how well I will like the PC until I actually try it out. But your insights are greatly appreciated. I dove into the detailing world just a tad over a week ago, so my head is still spinning with every article, forum post, and video I can lay my eyes on.

On Youtube, I have to say Mike Phillips' tutorials stood out to me above the rest (his videos led me here to AG). The way he delivers the material, you can tell he is a natural teacher. So after watching his videos and reading a number of his articles, I certainly respect his opinion, and if the PC is good enough for Mike, it is probably good enough for me. :)

Before discovering AG, I made several car care purchases on Amazon and ebay--some good and some not so good! I just missed the holiday coupons here, but the next time they come around, I would like to try the Pinnacle and Wolfgang product lines. In the meantime, I will try to work with what I have and fill in any essentials that I am missing.

Last week, I ordered the 5" Lake Country back plate and six 5.5" LC CCS pads. I ended up ordering one pad of each color I thought might be useful: orange, white, green, black, blue, and red. I know one pad of each isn't enough for most cars. How many of each type of pad should I stock up on? Are the flat pads better suited for the PC compared to the CCS pads that I bought? And is it important for me to buy a 3" back plate and 4" pads for smaller sections of the car? Lastly, what type of painter tape for polishing and waxing do you recommend? I was looking at this 3M tape on Amazon, but one reviewer said the glue separated onto the paint after polishing with a DA.

http://www.amazon.com/3M-03435-Auto...id=1389132231&sr=8-2&keywords=automotive+tape
 
Thanks for all of the input guys. I realize I won't know how well I will like the PC until I actually try it out. But your insights are greatly appreciated. I dove into the detailing world just a tad over a week ago, so my head is still spinning with every article, forum post, and video I can lay my eyes on.

On Youtube, I have to say Mike Phillips' tutorials stood out to me above the rest (his videos led me here to AG). The way he delivers the material, you can tell he is a natural teacher. So after watching his videos and reading a number of his articles, I certainly respect his opinion, and if the PC is good enough for Mike, it is probably good enough for me. :)

Before discovering AG, I made several car care purchases on Amazon and ebay--some good and some not so good! I just missed the holiday coupons here, but the next time they come around, I would like to try the Pinnacle and Wolfgang product lines. In the meantime, I will try to work with what I have and fill in any essentials that I am missing.

Last week, I ordered the 5" Lake Country back plate and six 5.5" LC CCS pads. I ended up ordering one pad of each color I thought might be useful: orange, white, green, black, blue, and red. I know one pad of each isn't enough for most cars. How many of each type of pad should I stock up on? Are the flat pads better suited for the PC compared to the CCS pads that I bought? And is it important for me to buy a 3" back plate and 4" pads for smaller sections of the car? Lastly, what type of painter tape for polishing and waxing do you recommend? I was looking at this 3M tape on Amazon, but one reviewer said the glue separated onto the paint after polishing with a DA.

3M 03435 48 mm x 32 m Automotive Performance Masking Tape : Amazon.com : Automotive

I'm certainly far from being the forum expert here, but looking as the LC CCS Line, I would say the most useful, or perhaps I should say the most commonly needed pads would probably be the orange, pink, and white pads. And I say this as these are probably what would generally be needed to be used for an "average" paint correction with a variety of polishes, and mild compounds.

I would assume the softer pads "could" be used with a polish, or a compound, but they won't work nerarly as good, or as fast.

Bottom line is, do keep some form of reference as to what Pads should be used for what?
It is a simple process to always just come back here if unsure, and look in the AG Store to see the listings-descriptions.

I would say having at least 3-4 of each pad type per vehicle that is being corrected will be a minimum. Larger vehicles such as pickup trucks, and large SUVs maybe 5-6 pads per job.

Working a pad too long will eventually tear up a pad from heat-overuse, they will load up with both product, and paint nasties after a panel or two. It is easier, to then just swap out a fresh pad, rather than stopping, washing, then trying to dry a pad. Cleaning on the fly does help, but only to a point.

As for the Green 3M auto Painter's Tape, this is pretty much the common gold standard of what we all use here. Meguiars has their own Tape, and so does Rustoleum I see. I have a roll of Rustolem Tape from Wally World, but have yet to try it. And Meguiars I understand is now actually owned by 3m, so the Meg's Tape may be indeed just rebranded 3M Tape?

Usually, most decent size towns have an Auto Paint Supply Shop where such tapes in different widths can be easily gotten locally within a moment's notice. Some of the auto parts stores such as AutoZone, Advanced, O'Reillys. Pep Boys also usually carry such Tapes.

It is a good idea to have a fair selection of a few different widths on hand. Wider widths cover more area easily, but also become a bit harder to conform to curving on panels, and trim.

I usually keep 1/4" 1/2" and 3/4" on hand.

Hope this helps. Mark
 
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