I have just ordered a Flex 3401 VRG but for nearly three years have been using a Porter Cable 7424XP. Although the porter cable has served me well I work at a small dealership and we sometimes have a ridiculously small amount of time to prep a vehicle. Porter Cable and fast can't be used in the same sentence. I use Menzerna FG400 and PG1500 a lot but its laborious and slow (especially now that I'm out of yellow cutting pads). A lot of our paint is really terrible so aggressive isn't an issue necessarily, these are daily drivers not million dollar show cars. I was going to get a Dewalt rotary but not being terribly versed in rotary polishing I thought it was a bad idea. I'm just wondering to do all panels of a typical passenger car (ie: say Honda Civic/Toyota Corolla) what kind of time savings do you think I'll get from using the Flex over the PC7424XP? I know it sounds rushed but yes I am incredibly rushed most of the time. All I know is I dread when someone needs a full vehicle buffed out. I know that the Flex should be able to do correction faster (yet still somewhat safer).
Flex 3401 VRG vs. PC 7424xp
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allenk4
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For Compounding, IMO, my PC is at least 30% more efficient
For light Polishing, the gap narrows significantly, because less downward pressure is used on the machine and the PC can maintain rotation.
In your situation, you may be able to use 6 1/2" pads with the FLEX. This can really decrease your time per vehicle. The PC will nit perform w 6 1/2" pads, except for very light polishing.
I love my FLEX and suggest you hold on to the PC and convert it to a Hernandez Polisher
For light Polishing, the gap narrows significantly, because less downward pressure is used on the machine and the PC can maintain rotation.
In your situation, you may be able to use 6 1/2" pads with the FLEX. This can really decrease your time per vehicle. The PC will nit perform w 6 1/2" pads, except for very light polishing.
I love my FLEX and suggest you hold on to the PC and convert it to a Hernandez Polisher
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The PC is 30% more efficient? how so ? Everything I have read to date pretty much pegs the Flex as far more of a machine than the PC7424XP. The only thing I had read it excels at is utmost safety to paint and be controllable with even one hand. The Flex should have much more 'bite' when used with similar pads and compound I have read.
allenk4
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Sorry....Typo
The FLEX is more "Efficient", because I can do more work in less time.
Because the FLEX will maintain rotation under increased downward pressure; I can work the abrasives more aggressively against the paint during the 1st several passes of the compounding stage and then ease up on the last two passes. This process, for me...cuts quickly and finishes well.
The FLEX is more "Efficient", because I can do more work in less time.
Because the FLEX will maintain rotation under increased downward pressure; I can work the abrasives more aggressively against the paint during the 1st several passes of the compounding stage and then ease up on the last two passes. This process, for me...cuts quickly and finishes well.
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- #6
(PS: I figured that's what you had meant but I wasn't 100% sure LOL)
It amusing because I went to a demo of a product a year or two ago when I was still VERY green about DA's/Compound etc. Suffice to say it was for a set of 2 foamed wool pads and a 3 stage paint correction system from Technician's Choice. It did seem really amazing at the time but what I hadn't realized was that it was honestly 70% machine (Flex 3401 VRG) and 30% compound/product!!!
I tried the same system on my PC7424XP and it really didn't work hardly at all. Part of the thing about it is they use a 6.5" pads and I only have a 5" Lake Country backing pad. So what that basically meant was two things... the pad had sh#*#y torsional forces on it that caused it to twist and loosen the velcro backing ruining it. Secondly alas the it seemed the PC was a bit limp in trying to get it up to a speed that it cut any amount. I was horrendously disappointed with that whole thing and stopped using that system, switching instead to Menzerna FG400 and 5.5" yellow / orange Lake Country CSS pads that I have to order in from Ontario (takes about 7-10 days).
I am welcoming the power of the new Flex when it gets here. I may even use up the rest of that 3 step correction compound/polish/pads when it gets here as it was moderately impressive at the time with the amount of correction it could do. I can order 6.5" pads locally so that will be a bit of a relief.
It amusing because I went to a demo of a product a year or two ago when I was still VERY green about DA's/Compound etc. Suffice to say it was for a set of 2 foamed wool pads and a 3 stage paint correction system from Technician's Choice. It did seem really amazing at the time but what I hadn't realized was that it was honestly 70% machine (Flex 3401 VRG) and 30% compound/product!!!
I tried the same system on my PC7424XP and it really didn't work hardly at all. Part of the thing about it is they use a 6.5" pads and I only have a 5" Lake Country backing pad. So what that basically meant was two things... the pad had sh#*#y torsional forces on it that caused it to twist and loosen the velcro backing ruining it. Secondly alas the it seemed the PC was a bit limp in trying to get it up to a speed that it cut any amount. I was horrendously disappointed with that whole thing and stopped using that system, switching instead to Menzerna FG400 and 5.5" yellow / orange Lake Country CSS pads that I have to order in from Ontario (takes about 7-10 days).
I am welcoming the power of the new Flex when it gets here. I may even use up the rest of that 3 step correction compound/polish/pads when it gets here as it was moderately impressive at the time with the amount of correction it could do. I can order 6.5" pads locally so that will be a bit of a relief.
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Kamakaz1961
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The Flex 3401 VRG will BLOW AWAY the PC 7424XP in terms of overall performance....PERIOD!! You will finish jobs at about 35-40% quicker compared to the PC. You can use a 6.5" Pad or even 7-7.5" Pad (with Lake Country Backing plates).
I do, however, still use the PC for other duties. I use it for applying sealants and waxes. The majority of the time the Flex is what I use the most.
It is the closest DA that compares to a rotary. It's "forced rotation" is the only DA that has this feature.
I do, however, still use the PC for other duties. I use it for applying sealants and waxes. The majority of the time the Flex is what I use the most.
It is the closest DA that compares to a rotary. It's "forced rotation" is the only DA that has this feature.
VISITOR
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while the flex will do a faster job (particularly with foam), the traditional DA with the MF pads still can do a equivalent job (if not better) in the end to remove defects it may just take just a little longer...
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conman1395
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The microfiber system like Meguiars was created for exactly what the OP said. Not perfect show car finish, but a pretty darn good finish in short time. Plus less dust and easy wipe off. Perfect for short time/high production detailing.
Mizzoutiger
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:iagree:
cardaddy
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:laughing: Mike Phillips
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To the OP,
Lots of info on doing fast work throughout this thread.
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...ality-production-detailing-mike-phillips.html
The focus was putting a nice finish on trashed black paint quickly using the Flex 3401.
The discussion though is about doing all types of production work.
Lots of info on doing fast work throughout this thread.
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum...ality-production-detailing-mike-phillips.html
The focus was putting a nice finish on trashed black paint quickly using the Flex 3401.
The discussion though is about doing all types of production work.
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- #16
Sometimes I'm given less than an hour to prep a car for sale. It's more then a bit unrealistic but sales people don't it but ah well. Lately if I have an hour I'll very quickly apply a black cherry glaze and buff it off with the PC. I'll zip the tornador through it and vac it....boom out the door and over the curb.
I'd love to clay the lot cars but I never have a chance as I also do stuff in the office in addition to detailing. Claying seems to make waxes/sealant so Much more effective.
I'd love to clay the lot cars but I never have a chance as I also do stuff in the office in addition to detailing. Claying seems to make waxes/sealant so Much more effective.
You should have a chat with those who schedule this work for you. What are there expectations? Do they just want it to shine or do they want the swirls removed?
Show them what you are capable of doing when you have adequate time.
However, working for a dealership who likely just wants the car off their lot you may be better off just doing a wash, glaze and wave bye-bye.
I've found microfiber pads to work great with a PC. They cut slower IMO, but they rotate much easier in weird places and overall they work easier than a foam pad, but if the edges start caking or getting nasty, it will leave marring all over, whereas I've found it takes one hell of a nasty pad to mar with foam to the degree a MF pad will.
To fully swirl remove on a hood using a PC and yellow pad along with improving the look of RIDS , I would spend almost 2 hours on that alone. By the time I had everything looking how I wanted, I still had to go around the rest of the car, and then go around and finish down everything. 6-8 hours total for a car to look acceptable to me. But I would have smoked 3 yellow pads, that I now have to clean & dry for tomorrows car, used twice the amount of microfibers I wanted to use because I was working areas repeatedly, etc.
I picked up a DeWalt rotary. Took half a car to get a real feel for it and I was amazed. Can do a hood in 1/10th the time.
Show them what you are capable of doing when you have adequate time.
However, working for a dealership who likely just wants the car off their lot you may be better off just doing a wash, glaze and wave bye-bye.
I've found microfiber pads to work great with a PC. They cut slower IMO, but they rotate much easier in weird places and overall they work easier than a foam pad, but if the edges start caking or getting nasty, it will leave marring all over, whereas I've found it takes one hell of a nasty pad to mar with foam to the degree a MF pad will.
To fully swirl remove on a hood using a PC and yellow pad along with improving the look of RIDS , I would spend almost 2 hours on that alone. By the time I had everything looking how I wanted, I still had to go around the rest of the car, and then go around and finish down everything. 6-8 hours total for a car to look acceptable to me. But I would have smoked 3 yellow pads, that I now have to clean & dry for tomorrows car, used twice the amount of microfibers I wanted to use because I was working areas repeatedly, etc.
I picked up a DeWalt rotary. Took half a car to get a real feel for it and I was amazed. Can do a hood in 1/10th the time.