Gel Coat Oxidization Removal - How much to charge?

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Always Learning

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Gel Coat Oxidization Removal - How much to charge?


I've been asked to quote on what the owner feels will be a basic polish on a 27 foot boat. The owner says that it isn't badly oxidized and won't need compounding so I gave him a ballpark quote based on this. It's been kept under a roof most summers and stored inside off season.

I'll be seeing the boat in person this week I believe. I've never done a boat before.

Do you think it will need compounding? I'll provide more info (age etc) of boat when I know more. I don't know the 'rules of thumb' for boats. How can I judge when I first look - without a test spot - so I can tell my customer more accurately how much I need to charge.

If you compound a boat, do you normally follow up with a dual action to clean it up some more like a car? I'm guessing the same rules apply.

Everything I've read is telling me that my Flex 3401 isn't enough? If it can be done with the 3401, what will make it fastest and best.

Is it much different doing a boat, I can see it may be more of a pain in tight areas.

I'm guessing 2 days work for this - am I close?

I probably have many more questions, so feel free to make suggestions regarding pads, cutting and polish recommendations etc etc.

Thank,

Doug
 
Re: Correcting oxidized gelcoat

When they say it will not need compounding thaat's a sure clue it will need compounding. I'd suggest having a RB and wool pads in your arsenal as recommended.
 
Re: Correcting oxidized gelcoat

my opinion only, but the gel will oxidize whether under a roof, under a tarp or in the water...it will be all chalky and i dont have to see it.

Again, its just my opinion, you'll never make it without a rotary and wool pads...
 
Re: Correcting oxidized gelcoat

Just did my Bass boat with my PC and CG Phase V and it came out nice.
 
Re: Correcting oxidized gelcoat

First suggestion: Don't take their word for the oxidation. If they say no oxidation, expect low to medium. Light oxidation... medium to heavy!

Second suggestion: use a rotary buffer and wool pads. Gel coat is a lot harder than clear coat.

Third: if you are really unsure, bring the buffer with you along with some cleaner wax and compound. Do a test spot which will impress them and show you how oxidized it really is. Start with the one-step cleaner wax. If it does a great job, good - you can do the boat in one pass. Compound requires more.

Fourth: be real clear about what they want and what you are doing. Is this from the waterline to rub rails? Does it include topside? Are you cleaning the hull?

Finally: if they have not had their boat professionally cleaned in the past, bring a mattress so they don't hurt themselves when they pass out from the price! Make sure to quote your price like you've quoted it a thousand times and know you are right.
 
Re: Correcting oxidized gelcoat

Always Learning said:
I've been asked to quote on what the owner feels will be a basic polish on a 27 foot boat. The owner says that it isn't badly oxidized and won't need compounding so I gave him a ballpark quote based on this. It's been kept under a roof most summers and stored inside off season.

I probably have many more questions, so feel free to make suggestions regarding pads, cutting and polish recommendations etc etc.

Thank,

Doug
Click to expand...


Here's a tip Doug...


Instead of tagging your questions onto a thread from last year, (which can cause some confusion), start a "Dedicated Thread".

That is start your own thread and this will give your project all the dedicated attention it deserves.

Also give your thread a good title so people will know exactly what you're working on and what you need help with.

See these two articles I wrote here for the expressed purpose of helping people to help themselves better on forums....

A tip to help yourself get great answers when you start a thread

How to write a good title for your thread




Also, if you like I can move your post and all the other follow-up posts to a "dedicated thread" for you.


Just let me know what you want for a title.


:)
 
Re: Correcting oxidized gelcoat

Great comments and suggestions from everyone, all much appreciated.


Sorry for Hijacking this thread!

Thanks for the tips Mike and please go ahead and create new thread. For a thread title, how about "Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed" ?
 
Re: Correcting oxidized gelcoat

rmagnus said:
When they say it will not need compounding thaat's a sure clue it will need compounding. I'd suggest having a RB and wool pads in your arsenal as recommended.
Click to expand...


I agree.

Don't give an estimate until you are standing in front of the boat with the owner.


That's a whole lot of buffing to do. I'll see of my buddy Paul aka Sailfish can chime in, he buffs out a lot of boats here in the Stuart area.



:dblthumb2:
 
Re: Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed?

Doug,

Mike asked me to chime in on this,

27 foot boat out of the water on a trailer? Or on a rack / boatel?

If it is just wax no compound I would charge 15 a foot. That would include a wash, hand wipe dry and wax. I use Collinite 925, make sure you mix it well, ( I pour off into a bowl and mix it or in some cases you have lumps in the wax).

Now if it need compounding you need to add to the price,

Light compounding on a 27 footer is about $21.00 per ft. (this includes Wax)

Heavy compounding on a 27 footer is about $26.00 per ft. (this includes Wax)

Now this is for a simple center console boat. If you have a cabin or cuddy then I add about $4.00 per ft for that also.

Motor does the cowl need wax (yes), and the shaft (yes). Outboard only $10.00 -$20.00 depends on if they need to be touched up any.

Now how to tell if you need to compound.

I take the bottle of wax and put in on the side of the boat (bottom of bottle to side of boat) If I can see the print on the bottle clearly then wax only.

If it is hazed but I can still make out the bottle and the print Light compounding. (very very light chalk on hand to none)

If I can not get a reflection or very poor reflection, chalky hand when wiped over surface then heavy compound.

Rotary and wool at a low speed with lots of product, gel coat sucks up product. 2' x 2' sections and take your time. Work out of the sun and what ever product you use make sure that you wipe it off well before you wax.

A note on Collinite wax also work small area at a time 2' x 2', it wipes off easier that way.

Good luck, a car will fell like a walk in the park after you do this boat.
 
Re: Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed?

The people here on this forum are the best!


I'm getting the message loud and clear - rotary with wool pads!


David: Great tip on doing a test spot to show what can be done with the one step and let the owner judge from themselves.


If it needs compounding - and he's willing to pay for the extra step, I'll look into a rotary. Otherwise, the feeling I'm getting is he's not willing to pay enough to make it worthwhile for me to pick up a rotary just for a one step so I may have to give it a pass. (I'd like one anyway but can't justify it at this time - unless I can find used.)



Mike - I've always looked up to and appreciate you taking the time to help me out.


Paul - amazing information, it's really giving me a perspective on how enormous this job really is. (love the website btw)


Sorry not much info about the job - boat is indoors in a warehouse.


More info to come Thursday.


Cheers!
 
Re: Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed?

Doug,

Good luck and you are right you can always say no, some people just don't know what the jobs we do cost to do right. You can always pick up a cheap rotary or rent one at a tool rental place for this job, then invest in a good rotary from AG with your proceeds.

Paul
 
Re: Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed?

Paul (Sailfish) awesome info. I've seen your posts before on boat detailing but I thought I'd finaly say thank you.

Doug eEven picking up a Harbor Freight Rotary (cheap $40) it will get you thrugh this detail. Get a few pads and remember rake to clean the pads assuming you don't have a pad cleaner. Guess in a pinch a screwdriver will work but be careful very careful if you go this route.

Last suggestion is maybe borrowing a rotary buffer if you know someone in your area.
 
Re: Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed?

I like using the 3m white cutting pads and rotary with 3m super duty if it is highly oxidized - that will cut amazingly but keep the buffer moving and be weary of the edges of the pad. I tape ALOT when buffing out boats. Also, there will be many areas that will need to be done by hand to do a thorough job. The hull will be a bit tricky your first time and you may be sore after polishing it - very awkward angles. I like to wear a face-shield when buffing the hull when out of water - cause those odd angles will throw compound in your face. All of the tips I can think of for now that I didn't read about - Good Luck man!
 
Re: Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed?

Just to add for the OP or for anyone reading this into the future that is going to get into buffing out large boats using rotary buffers with wool pads...

At a minimum get a pad cleaning spur.

IF you want to work faster, work cleaner and avoid tiring yourself out, get a pad washer.

As your pad gets caked-up with dead, oxidized gel-coat and spent product and if you don't somehow clean this off the face of your buffing pad, then adding fresh product will dilute the cutting strength of the fresh product and the residue you leave on the hull will be a lot more gummy and a lot more difficult to wipe off. This will tire you out.



First thing a person needs to learn is how to clean their wool pad using a pad cleaning spur
TrainingVette001.jpg



Perfect!
TrainingVette002.jpg




This thread shows some pad washers...

Grit Guard Pad Washer Cart


:xyxthumbs:
 
Re: Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed?

rmagnus said:
Guess in a pinch a screwdriver will work but be careful very careful if you go this route.
Click to expand...

While the spur is best and something you should have if you're going to do more than a little buffing with a wool pad, a heavier zip tie works pretty well also! Form it into a tear drop shape and use it the same as a spur.
 
Re: Gel Coat Oxidization Removal Advice Needed?

Using a screwdriver is what I call that the Caveman Method... :laughing:

It works and I've used a screwdriver when I've had nothing else. I've also used whatever was closest to my hand, like an open end box wrench. Basically anything you can cram into the rotating fiber to kick out spent residue and removed paint.

If you're buffing out one boat one time then the caveman method works but in my honest opinion I think it damages your wool pad more than the actual tool made for this job and that is the simple wool pad cleaning spur.

If you're going to buff as a hobby or for money at any level, then when you can invest in a real spur. It cleans the pad better than a screwdriver and it also does a better job of fluffing up the fibers. Just my two cents...


Here's where you can get one... and it's only 8 bucks...


Lake Country Wool Pad Spur


Pad Cleaning Spur - The best tool for the job
Spur.jpg




Works but it's kind of the caveman technique
screwdriver.jpg





:dblthumb2:
 
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